what is the most powerful fighter prc?

[CyberThread]

What is the most powerful prc for a fighter without going into leadership?

[John Longarrow]

Wizard?

By most powerful, what are you trying for?

[Flame of Anor]

Well, depends on if you want to be a pure fighter. Abjurant Champion is a great combat class, but you need to dip Wizard or Sorcerer to fulfill the prereqs. Same thing with Spellsword.

If you insist on no magic, then you'll limit yourself rather severely. There are certainly better and worse mundane fighter PrCs, but the best isn't great. There are some okay ones in Complete Warrior (http://dndtools.eu/classes/rulebook/complete-warrior--61/) though.

[Frozen_Feet]

I would suggest we limit our selection to PrCs that can be accessed straight from fighter, without multiclassing, but also that we don't exlcude PrCs that have Supernatural or Spell-like abilities (etc.) either, as long as they fit the first criteria.

Within those constraints, Warmind is at least a strong competitor, seeing as it's Psychic Warrior lite, basically. Speaking in terms of tiers, going to Warmind from Fighter (doable after 8th level) should elevate a character from 5th to 4th tier at least, potentially from 4th to 3rd tier if Fighter ACFs are well utilized.

[HammeredWharf]

Because Fighters lack unique mechanics, there are no fighter-only PRCs, unless there's a class I'm not aware of that requires Weapon Specialization. There's a number of decent PRCs a melee character can take, but they're almost universally better on a character with only one or two levels of Fighter.

[Ssalarn]

There weren't many fighter PrCs in 3.5 that I particularly cared for or thought really brought more to the table, but Pathfinder's got a couple that are all right. The Sentinel from Inner Sea Gods gives a cool selection of abilities based on the deity you choose, and the Hellknight is decent. Neither of those is Fighter specific, but Fighter can easily qualify.

[Forrestfire]

Personally, I'm a fan of Suel Arcanamach into Abjurant Champion and a level of spellsword. Arcanamach 3/Abjurant Champion 5/Arcanamach +1/Spellsword 1 is 9 BAB, 5th level spells, a bunch of utility, and a free Extend Spell to every buff you cast on yourself (and also every abjuration spell you use from Abjurant Champion). Pretty awesome for a melee guy.

[HammeredWharf]

Personally, I'm a fan of Suel Arcanamach into Abjurant Champion and a level of spellsword.

Suel Arcanamach can't really be called a Fighter PRC. A pure Fighter can't even qualify for it until lvl 7.

[Forrestfire]

That is a good point, but it's still probably one of the better choices you could go into as a fighter-type without a specific focus.

[The Viscount]

Bloodstorm Blade is a pretty good class for a fighter, and it's easy enough to enter, since it'll only take you 4 feats, all of which are fighter bonus feats, you can easily be in by level 5.

[Zombulian]

Warmind into Illithid Slayer?

[Fouredged Sword]

Warhulk is a strong contender, though it doesn't do anything for your tier ranking. It DOES make you the boss of killing everything in melee and adds a splash of ranged damage (rock throwing). Getting +20 strength with the weapon enhancement that changes all that zero bab to 3/4 bab is nice.

[Telonius]

Warshaper is really nice. I might call it more of a Changeling PrC than a Fighter PrC, but it's certainly melee-focused.

[Zombulian]

Alternatively, Warmind into Hulking Hurler while using Metamorphosis to be a Centaur or something?

[Biffoniacus_Furiou]

Looking at the Tier System for PrCs (http://brilliantgameologists.com/boards/index.php?topic=5198.0), a single-classed (PHB race) Fighter can easily qualify for the following prestige classes from the 'Up Two or More Tiers' list:
Champion of Gwynharwyf
Disciple of Dispater

Also include the following if using a race to qualify, with only Fighter levels:
Hulking Hurler
Soul Eater
Thrall of Juiblex
War Hulk
Warshaper

[lytokk]

Cavalier? Though I look at that one more like a paladin prc than fighter. If 3.0 was allowed I would say Weapon Master, I miss that class.

[dextercorvia]

Suel Arcanamach can't really be called a Fighter PRC. A pure Fighter can't even qualify for it until lvl 7.

No one qualifies for it (sans serious cheese) before level 6 (taking the 1st level of Suel Arcanamach at 7). So, waiting one level isn't awful. Having to take Fighter 7 is, though.

[Zombulian]

Cavalier? Though I look at that one more like a paladin prc than fighter. If 3.0 was allowed I would say Weapon Master, I miss that class.

I wouldn't say Cavalier would help a fighter out of Tier 5. Exotic Weapon Master and Kensai are both aight though.

[lytokk]

I wouldn't say Cavalier would help a fighter out of Tier 5. Exotic Weapon Master and Kensai are both aight though.

I'd think cavalier might, due to the fact it can greatly increase the damage output of the fighter, and gives the class a much higher mobility. Not to mention it does add a companion to the fighter that would otherwise just be a normal mount. Nope, I think thats paladin only.

[HammeredWharf]

No one qualifies for it (sans serious cheese) before level 6 (taking the 1st level of Suel Arcanamach at 7). So, waiting one level isn't awful. Having to take Fighter 7 is, though.

True, but a PRC that requires three cross-class skills, a feat that's absolutely useless to a Fighter and Charisma isn't exactly a Fighter PRC. Besides, while Suel Arcanamach is one of my favorite gish components, it's clearly a caster.

Out of the classes mentioned in this thread, I'd pick Disciple of Dispater, because it's very Fighter-like, requires mostly Fighter bonus feats and is really good.

[Metahuman1]

Dervish maybe?

[dascarletm]

Because Fighters lack unique mechanics, there are no fighter-only PRCs, unless there's a class I'm not aware of that requires Weapon Specialization. There's a number of decent PRCs a melee character can take, but they're almost universally better on a character with only one or two levels of Fighter.

The Legend requires it. Though that I believe was 3.0.

[Endarire]

Ur-Priest.

[Metahuman1]

Can a straight class fighter enter Ur-Priest?

[Forrestfire]

I think one actually can, if you use some dragon magazine feats to grab a few orisons and meet the casting requirement.

[Metahuman1]

Huh, interesting. What if you don't have those dragon mag feats?

And that aside, this sounds like an awesome way to advance fighter up several Tiers.

[Doc_Maynot]

I think one actually can, if you use some dragon magazine feats to grab a few orisons and meet the casting requirement.

Ur-Priests have no casting requirement. It's requirement is that if you have divine spellcasting, give it up.
The require Spell Focus (Evil), yes. But the feat itself has no casting requirement.

[Zombulian]

I think one actually can, if you use some dragon magazine feats to grab a few orisons and meet the casting requirement.

Ain't no casting requirement for Ur Priest. Just Spell Focus (Evil). To which there are no prereqs.

[Forrestfire]

Ah. I don't have the book handy and misremembered it as needing to have the casting in the first place in order to give it up. In that case, yeah, Ur-Priest is probably the best fighter PrC.

[Metahuman1]

Yeah, I think we have a winner.

[HammeredWharf]

Note that Ur-Priest requires 8 ranks of Spellcraft and Knowledge: Religion, so you'd need to spend around three extra feats (Apprentice: Criminal for Bluff, Education for Knowledges and probably Aereni Focus for Spellcraft) to get into it before lvl 14. Unfortunately, Aereni Focus has a pretty exotic source. As long as you can get in reasonably early, Ur-Priest is the best PRC for a lot of classes.

Then again, pure Fighter is one of the worst ways to enter Ur-Priest, but maybe I'll just shut up now.

[Doc_Maynot]

Remember, it's not about Ur-Priest, its about the best Fighter PrC.

A five feat tax for the class, can be easily done.
Easier for the Thug Variant, which gets Bluff.

[FabulousFizban]

For Pathfinder

take quickdraw feat, get a quickdraw throwing shield, get a blinkback belt, attack infinity times a round.

powerful enough?

[Metahuman1]

For Pathfinder

take quickdraw feat, get a quickdraw throwing shield, get a blinkback belt, attack infinity times a round.

powerful enough?

Until the DM uses hardness/DR/Miss chance/Disarm to invalidate this tactic, sure. Or till Paizo get's wind that this combo does this and nerfs it ala Crane Wing.

[Vaz]

Suel Arcanamach can't really be called a Fighter PRC. A pure Fighter can't even qualify for it until lvl 7.

And it's ECL8, actually, thanks to spellcraft requirements - but that can be fixed with Apprentice Spellcaster - which is actually quite thematic, so you can get in at ECL7.

Ur-Priest can be got in by; a Blue Dragon Shaman dip.

[FabulousFizban]

Until the DM uses hardness/DR/Miss chance/Disarm to invalidate this tactic, sure. Or till Paizo get's wind that this combo does this and nerfs it ala Crane Wing.

as to hardness, get an adamantine shield. As to DR, as long as your max possible damage on a critical is at least 16, you're fine. Miss chance is legit, though things like blindfight will help. As to Paizo getting wind of it... crap... perhaps I should delete my post?

y-you don't work for them do you? I want to pull this stupidity off just once in society before it gets fixed.