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animewatcha
2014-05-08, 05:29 PM
When it comes to pathfinder, what has it done for Sword-and-Board/shieldbash and what has been done for two weapon combat? I am assuming fighter 20?

Figured human fighter 20 allowing feat at 'every level' to help with something to help me learn pathfinder a bit.

Ssalarn
2014-05-08, 05:47 PM
Well, Shield Master (http://paizo.com/pathfinderRPG/prd/feats.html#_shield-master) is a pretty big deal since you do not suffer any penalties on attack rolls made with a shield while you are wielding another weapon. That means if you've got the feats to burn it's really up there in the realm of super cool goodies. Shield Slam gives you a free Bull Rush attempt on all of your attacks with your shield, so that's pretty potent. The Two Weapon Warrior archetype gives you options for attacking with both weapons as a standard action, or even as an AoO.

There's also the Thunder and Fang feat from "Varisia: Birthplace of Legends" that allows you to TWF with a klar and an earthbreaker, which is awesome.

StreamOfTheSky
2014-05-08, 07:16 PM
Go Ranger for at least the first 6 levels before going Fighter.

Weapon and Shield style lets you get Shield Slam at level 2 (4 levels early) and Shield Master at level 6 (5 levels early). I'd suggest by level 6 going towards a TWF build with a pair of spiked Bashing heavy shields (Shield Master means you won't take the -4 TWF penalties for using a 1H weapon in the offhand), before that maybe just two-hand a single spiked heavy shield or TWF with a heavy and a light.

If you really dislike using two shields or using nothing but a single shield, you could main hand a spiked Bashing heavy shield and use a kukri in the offhand, it's be sort of Spartan-ish... In any case, heavy shield's damage and AC boost over light makes it worth having but it'd be giving you a bigger penalty if in the offhand (even after Shield Master, it'd affect the kukri's attack modifier). On the other hand, the kukri's main purpose is to generate critical hits, the damage it inflicts is less important. That's because at level 10 you can get Bashing Finish feat, which will give you an extra shield attack when you crit.

If and when you do go into Fighter, you want an archetype with Weapon Training so you can benefit from gloves of dueling. Sadly, this means Brawler is a poor choice unless you don't expect to reach level 11+ (Ranger 6 / Fighter 5) anyway. Lore Warden is the best Fighter archetype for basically everything, so it's probably the one you'll want, too.

The main things you'll be doing is taking advantage of shield slam's free bull rush on each hit to deny foes full attacks (and possibly to send them into your caster friend's battlefield control spell) and shield master's elimination of TWF penalties and using defensive shield enhancements as offensive bonus (so you can then get some offensive special properties added to it for cheap). You might well want Greater Bull Rush.

EDIT: Or I could just link to the thread I made years ago on this (http://www.enworld.org/forum/showthread.php?308795-Dual-Shield-Ranger-build-help).

fallensavior
2014-05-08, 10:42 PM
Go Ranger for at least the first 6 levels before going Fighter.

Weapon and Shield style lets you get Shield Slam at level 2 (4 levels early) and Shield Master at level 6 (5 levels early). I'd suggest by level 6 going towards a TWF build with a pair of spiked Bashing heavy shields (Shield Master means you won't take the -4 TWF penalties for using a 1H weapon in the offhand), before that maybe just two-hand a single spiked heavy shield or TWF with a heavy and a light.

If you really dislike using two shields or using nothing but a single shield, you could main hand a spiked Bashing heavy shield and use a kukri in the offhand, it's be sort of Spartan-ish... In any case, heavy shield's damage and AC boost over light makes it worth having but it'd be giving you a bigger penalty if in the offhand (even after Shield Master, it'd affect the kukri's attack modifier). On the other hand, the kukri's main purpose is to generate critical hits, the damage it inflicts is less important. That's because at level 10 you can get Bashing Finish feat, which will give you an extra shield attack when you crit.

If and when you do go into Fighter, you want an archetype with Weapon Training so you can benefit from gloves of dueling. Sadly, this means Brawler is a poor choice unless you don't expect to reach level 11+ (Ranger 6 / Fighter 5) anyway. Lore Warden is the best Fighter archetype for basically everything, so it's probably the one you'll want, too.

The main things you'll be doing is taking advantage of shield slam's free bull rush on each hit to deny foes full attacks (and possibly to send them into your caster friend's battlefield control spell) and shield master's elimination of TWF penalties and using defensive shield enhancements as offensive bonus (so you can then get some offensive special properties added to it for cheap). You might well want Greater Bull Rush.

EDIT: Or I could just link to the thread I made years ago on this (http://www.enworld.org/forum/showthread.php?308795-Dual-Shield-Ranger-build-help).

Shield bonuses to AC don't stack, so why fight with two shields? (Sorry that link is blocked to me)

grarrrg
2014-05-08, 10:51 PM
Shield bonuses to AC don't stack, so why fight with two shields? (Sorry that link is blocked to me)

The same reason most TWF builds use 2 of the same type of weapon.
ALL of your "pick a weapon" bonuses will apply to each of them.
To use a minor example, Weapon Focus. If I use a Shield+Sword, and I take Weapon Focus, it will only apply to one of them. But if I use Sword+Sword or Shield+Shield then Weapon Focus applies to both of them.

fallensavior
2014-05-08, 10:56 PM
The same reason most TWF builds use 2 of the same type of weapon.
ALL of your "pick a weapon" bonuses will apply to each of them.
To use a minor example, Weapon Focus. If I use a Shield+Sword, and I take Weapon Focus, it will only apply to one of them. But if I use Sword+Sword or Shield+Shield then Weapon Focus applies to both of them.

Oh. That's one of the reasons that I prefer to swing a shield two-handed.

StreamOfTheSky
2014-05-09, 12:34 AM
Shield bonuses to AC don't stack, so why fight with two shields? (Sorry that link is blocked to me)

Well, you could make one your source of AC w/ a +5 bonus and the other +1 with lots of properties. But...Shield Master means you want both +5. Shield Master does remove TWF penalties, though. So between that, the fact that defensive enhancements cost 1/2 as much as offensive (making enhancing 2 weapons more affordable), and the "same feats apply" thing...it's a goo way to go if you want to TWF.

fallensavior
2014-05-09, 01:03 AM
I'm not sure if PF specifies, but in 3.5 you have to do the offensive and defensive enchantments separately. SO you could have a +1 shield of bashing with +5 flaming spikes or the like, but you don't get to buy +5 to hit, damage, and AC for only 25k gp.

grarrrg
2014-05-09, 01:13 AM
you don't get to buy +5 to hit, damage, and AC for only 25k gp.

Yes you can.
Part of the reason why the previously mentioned Shield Master feat is so good:

You do not suffer any penalties on attack rolls made with a shield while you are wielding another weapon. Add your shield's enhancement bonus to attacks and damage rolls made with the shield as if it was a weapon enhancement bonus.