Der_DWSage
2014-05-10, 09:19 PM
Fillet of a fenny snake,
In the caldron boil and bake;
Eye of newt, and toe of frog,
Wool of bat, and tongue of dog,
Adder's fork, and blind-worm's sting,
Lizard's leg, and owlet's wing,—
For a charm of powerful trouble,
Like a hell-broth boil and bubble.
Double, double toil and trouble;
Many of us have come to dislike Magic Mart, but we also see its place-after all, most adventurers won't spend their hard-earned lucre elsewhere, or worse, they'll call on Djinnis and shapeshifted Zodaks and whatever else they can in order to just wish their equipment up if they don't get what they need. But at the same time, Magic Mart robs a lot of the mystical aspect from our magic games. So, here's the system I propose to counteract that, and bring a little bit of magic back while still having everything fully explained.
When a creature is killed, some parts of its body-the blood, the eyes, the brain, the tongue, something-is worth CR squared * 10 GP (And for 3.5, 1/25th that amount in XP) in value when used as a crafting component. At GM discretion, the creature does not need to be killed, but somehow bested in another fashion. (A blade that makes a thousand orcs flee is as potent as a blade that bathed in the blood of a thousand orcs, or a pair of gloves wagered against a dozen thieves guilds can become as legendary as a pair worn while killing the same amount.) It is expected that you lower acquired wealth by an equivalent amount.
These bits only count towards certain types of enchantments, determined by what type of creature that was slain. At GM discretion, gold and XP can cover the remainder of the crafting needs. Also at GM discretion, crafting feats and appropriate spells are not needed, so long as the character has enough tokens of the appropriate types to cover their work.
Definitions
Be precise. A lack of precision is dangerous when the margin of error is small.
Donald Rumsfeld
Token:The thing taken from a creature after it is defeated. The eye of a newt, the toe of a frog, the blood of an Orcish Warleader, the heart of a Dragon. It does not have to be physical-so long as the challenge was overcome somehow, it can be as nebulous as the blessing of a scholar, or the respect of a rogue. (AKA, one does not have to be a complete murderhobo to acquire tokens.)
Enchantment:Any magical effect applied to an item. If I mean the Enchantment school of magic, I will specify the Enchantment school of magic.
'...that [x] embodies':For example, 'Alignment that the Outsider embodies.' This means that if they have the subtype of that alignment or element, or if they are particularly well known for the alignment or element (Such as a Red Dragon being known for Fire, Chaos, and Evil) then this is what that means. On rare occasion, this will be used for other things than alignment and elements.
Spellcaster:Any creature with spellcasting capability, spell-like abilities, or supernatural abilities to the point where they may as well be spellcasting. (Such as a Druid's ability to Wildshape.)
Score:Ability scores. Strength, Dexterity, Constitution, Intelligence, Wisdom, and Charisma. You know the drill.
Mechanics
Go to the highest mountain and slay the mightiest dragon in the kingdom, in order to craft his scales into fire-resistant armor before we go to Hell? No, I'm good. I bought a Ring of Fire Immunity last week for that instead.
-Arnold Swordshielderson, Adventurer
When a creature is beaten, killed, conquered, or otherwise vanquished, a token can be acquired from it. This token's value is equal to the creatures CR squared * 10, (And for 3.5, 1/25th that amount in XP) and the creature's Type counts towards certain types of bonuses, as outlined in the next post. These are towards the crafting price, not the base price. Simple, no? (These bonus goods can either be traded to a crafter for that exact amount off the price of their item, or made into items themselves. Whichever way it goes, a similar amount of treasure should be reduced from the party's future treasure finds, to keep WBL from bloating.)CR^2*10 wasn't quite picked from a hat, but it was a semi-random choice. While I feel that allowing difficult opponents to count for multiple tokens counteracts the low value, feel free to raise the GP value in your own games. Just be wary of the WBL beast.
Optional Mechanics
If more than five of the same creature are used in creating a single effect on the item, then the item will always have a randomly determined curse. Only rarely will they be benign or small things. (If a curse such as 'Change Name' or other small effect is rolled once, roll again.)
This is to prevent the players from clearing out, say, a Kobold encampment for a +6 Dexterity item with minimal threat to themselves. Also, curses are so rarely used in games that I play that I feel they need some love.
Creatures that are domesticated, harmless, or otherwise unlikely to intentionally harm the PCs do not count for tokens. Additionally, Tokens only count if the CR of the creature being slain is equal to the PC's level-2.
Similar to above, this is to keep PCs from simply buying a herd of cattle and slaughtering them all to gain a +6 Constitution belt.
If Planar Binding is used to force an outsider to give power to an item, they remain bound to the item, and are vengeful about the ordeal. It has a cumulative 1% chance every day to destroy the item of imprisonment, and seek vengeance on the creator to the best of their abilities. (Elementals will go for murder, devils will drag them to the hells, angels will inform religions about the blasphemer, and djinni will...well. If you can't think of something for wish-granting djinnis to use to screw over people, I can't help you.) The broken item is completely mundane afterwards, and even enchantments that came from sources beside the Outsider will be dispersed to the winds, or absorbed by the Outsider.
Even if the Outsider willingly gives help, they will often request goods or services equal to whatever they bestow. An Angel is unlikely to give his feathers to create a +1 Holy Longsword for less than goods near the value of 18,000 GP, even if the petitioner is a follower of his own deity and going on a quest that aligns with his own interests.
The third of the 'prevent abuse' series of optional rules, this one is to keep tricksy wizards from going crazy with binding elementals and churning out items with speed.
If Wish or Miracle is used to create a magic item, it does not create the item directly. Instead, it summons a number of creatures that one can use as components to create the item. If one defeats them all, their bodies will run together to create the item requested. For example, a request to create a +5 Vorpal Sword (A 200,000 GP item, but only 100,000 to craft) will summon a Balor, (CR 20, 4,000 GP value) and an accompaniment of six Mariliths (CR 17, 17340 GP total) and a small horde of 40 Nalfeshnee (CR 14 each, 78,400 total) to defeat for the base materials.
Alternatively, they may need to face something less physical. If one requests a Miracle for a +6 Headband of Intellect, they may be transported to face Boccob in his own realm, and explain to him something that he does not yet know. Or if one Wishes for a Staff of the Magi, they may find themselves with a puzzle box that requires a bit of each of the planes before it must open.
I've...always found it cheesy that an SU Wish can just create anything, no strings attached. But at the same time, I don't want to take that option away from people. So instead, challenges. Quests. Things to bring a bit of magic back.
Particularly difficult monsters may be worth more than the typical token. The Orcish Warchief who trampled over the civilized lands may be worth more than his general, despite them being within a level of each other. Dragons in particular are noted for being magical and dangerous opponents. At GM discretion, an opponent may be worth up to ten tokens, rather than just the single one.
And now we get to abuse again. Boss Monsters have to be worth something, and this lets you have special opponents that are particularly valuable for crafting. It's nice to go 'We have killed the Ice Wolf of Risia, and have made equipment from his body. His teeth were made into the Rogue's Adamantine +2 Wounding Daggers, his pelt grants the Barbarian new vigor as a +4 Belt of Constitution, his eyes now serve the Ranger and grant him a +10 bonus to survival checks, and his blood has coated my axe, granting it the Vicious property on top of its existing enchantments.' Or, y'know. Whatever.)
Instead of simply granting CR^2*10 GP with each creature killed, make it a skill check. Allow a Survival, Knowledge(Arcana) or other relevant check (Such as Knowledge(Religion) with Undead, or Knowledge(Architecture) with Golems, Craft(Taxidermy) with Animals and Magical Beasts, or Knowledge(Nature) with plants) to determine how much of the value you get.
Check exceeds CR+20:Add (1d6*10)% to the value of the acquired tokens.
Check is between CR+16 and CR+20:110% the value of the acquired tokens
Check is between CR+10 to CR+15:The tokens are worth full value.
Check is between CR+5 and CR+10:The tokens are worth 90% of the full value.
Check is lower than CR+5:The tokens are worth 50% value or less.
:Be sure to adjust those skill checks to match the skill investment of your players. This one is done for bare bones-the players are unlikely to acquire more than a +5 bonus over what is likely to be acquired. Of all the optional rules, this is the one I would be most wary about adding. That said, it does allow a measure of randomness that can be nice to have.
Tokens are nice-but they don't always encompass the feel you're going for. Rather than force players to save their bits of Ogre and blood of Wolf for ages on end and allow it to spoil, simply keep track of tokens for them. When they reach a pre-determined number (5 for small changes worth less than 15% of WBL, 10 for changes between 15% and 25%, 20 for anything above that) of tokens, upgrade the party's items. With the killing blow of the Troll Chieftain, the Fighter's Sword gains the Holy property, the Wizard's Staff is recharged and captures the Troll's spirit, adding 'Command Undead' to its list of spells, the Rogue's gloves become Gloves of Dexterity+6, and the Monk gets a rock.
Similar to the above-but not to the point of spontaneous conversion. Allow people to turn their tokens into magical items without having crafting feats. Crafting feats are required to spend XP and gold to cover gaps left, but no one is truly required to have them, nor have the appropriate spells, so long as they have the right tokens and a will to use them.
5/13/2014, 12:56 AM:Progressed from 'WIP' to 'Oh god, the critiques are coming.'
In the caldron boil and bake;
Eye of newt, and toe of frog,
Wool of bat, and tongue of dog,
Adder's fork, and blind-worm's sting,
Lizard's leg, and owlet's wing,—
For a charm of powerful trouble,
Like a hell-broth boil and bubble.
Double, double toil and trouble;
Many of us have come to dislike Magic Mart, but we also see its place-after all, most adventurers won't spend their hard-earned lucre elsewhere, or worse, they'll call on Djinnis and shapeshifted Zodaks and whatever else they can in order to just wish their equipment up if they don't get what they need. But at the same time, Magic Mart robs a lot of the mystical aspect from our magic games. So, here's the system I propose to counteract that, and bring a little bit of magic back while still having everything fully explained.
When a creature is killed, some parts of its body-the blood, the eyes, the brain, the tongue, something-is worth CR squared * 10 GP (And for 3.5, 1/25th that amount in XP) in value when used as a crafting component. At GM discretion, the creature does not need to be killed, but somehow bested in another fashion. (A blade that makes a thousand orcs flee is as potent as a blade that bathed in the blood of a thousand orcs, or a pair of gloves wagered against a dozen thieves guilds can become as legendary as a pair worn while killing the same amount.) It is expected that you lower acquired wealth by an equivalent amount.
These bits only count towards certain types of enchantments, determined by what type of creature that was slain. At GM discretion, gold and XP can cover the remainder of the crafting needs. Also at GM discretion, crafting feats and appropriate spells are not needed, so long as the character has enough tokens of the appropriate types to cover their work.
Definitions
Be precise. A lack of precision is dangerous when the margin of error is small.
Donald Rumsfeld
Token:The thing taken from a creature after it is defeated. The eye of a newt, the toe of a frog, the blood of an Orcish Warleader, the heart of a Dragon. It does not have to be physical-so long as the challenge was overcome somehow, it can be as nebulous as the blessing of a scholar, or the respect of a rogue. (AKA, one does not have to be a complete murderhobo to acquire tokens.)
Enchantment:Any magical effect applied to an item. If I mean the Enchantment school of magic, I will specify the Enchantment school of magic.
'...that [x] embodies':For example, 'Alignment that the Outsider embodies.' This means that if they have the subtype of that alignment or element, or if they are particularly well known for the alignment or element (Such as a Red Dragon being known for Fire, Chaos, and Evil) then this is what that means. On rare occasion, this will be used for other things than alignment and elements.
Spellcaster:Any creature with spellcasting capability, spell-like abilities, or supernatural abilities to the point where they may as well be spellcasting. (Such as a Druid's ability to Wildshape.)
Score:Ability scores. Strength, Dexterity, Constitution, Intelligence, Wisdom, and Charisma. You know the drill.
Mechanics
Go to the highest mountain and slay the mightiest dragon in the kingdom, in order to craft his scales into fire-resistant armor before we go to Hell? No, I'm good. I bought a Ring of Fire Immunity last week for that instead.
-Arnold Swordshielderson, Adventurer
When a creature is beaten, killed, conquered, or otherwise vanquished, a token can be acquired from it. This token's value is equal to the creatures CR squared * 10, (And for 3.5, 1/25th that amount in XP) and the creature's Type counts towards certain types of bonuses, as outlined in the next post. These are towards the crafting price, not the base price. Simple, no? (These bonus goods can either be traded to a crafter for that exact amount off the price of their item, or made into items themselves. Whichever way it goes, a similar amount of treasure should be reduced from the party's future treasure finds, to keep WBL from bloating.)CR^2*10 wasn't quite picked from a hat, but it was a semi-random choice. While I feel that allowing difficult opponents to count for multiple tokens counteracts the low value, feel free to raise the GP value in your own games. Just be wary of the WBL beast.
Optional Mechanics
If more than five of the same creature are used in creating a single effect on the item, then the item will always have a randomly determined curse. Only rarely will they be benign or small things. (If a curse such as 'Change Name' or other small effect is rolled once, roll again.)
This is to prevent the players from clearing out, say, a Kobold encampment for a +6 Dexterity item with minimal threat to themselves. Also, curses are so rarely used in games that I play that I feel they need some love.
Creatures that are domesticated, harmless, or otherwise unlikely to intentionally harm the PCs do not count for tokens. Additionally, Tokens only count if the CR of the creature being slain is equal to the PC's level-2.
Similar to above, this is to keep PCs from simply buying a herd of cattle and slaughtering them all to gain a +6 Constitution belt.
If Planar Binding is used to force an outsider to give power to an item, they remain bound to the item, and are vengeful about the ordeal. It has a cumulative 1% chance every day to destroy the item of imprisonment, and seek vengeance on the creator to the best of their abilities. (Elementals will go for murder, devils will drag them to the hells, angels will inform religions about the blasphemer, and djinni will...well. If you can't think of something for wish-granting djinnis to use to screw over people, I can't help you.) The broken item is completely mundane afterwards, and even enchantments that came from sources beside the Outsider will be dispersed to the winds, or absorbed by the Outsider.
Even if the Outsider willingly gives help, they will often request goods or services equal to whatever they bestow. An Angel is unlikely to give his feathers to create a +1 Holy Longsword for less than goods near the value of 18,000 GP, even if the petitioner is a follower of his own deity and going on a quest that aligns with his own interests.
The third of the 'prevent abuse' series of optional rules, this one is to keep tricksy wizards from going crazy with binding elementals and churning out items with speed.
If Wish or Miracle is used to create a magic item, it does not create the item directly. Instead, it summons a number of creatures that one can use as components to create the item. If one defeats them all, their bodies will run together to create the item requested. For example, a request to create a +5 Vorpal Sword (A 200,000 GP item, but only 100,000 to craft) will summon a Balor, (CR 20, 4,000 GP value) and an accompaniment of six Mariliths (CR 17, 17340 GP total) and a small horde of 40 Nalfeshnee (CR 14 each, 78,400 total) to defeat for the base materials.
Alternatively, they may need to face something less physical. If one requests a Miracle for a +6 Headband of Intellect, they may be transported to face Boccob in his own realm, and explain to him something that he does not yet know. Or if one Wishes for a Staff of the Magi, they may find themselves with a puzzle box that requires a bit of each of the planes before it must open.
I've...always found it cheesy that an SU Wish can just create anything, no strings attached. But at the same time, I don't want to take that option away from people. So instead, challenges. Quests. Things to bring a bit of magic back.
Particularly difficult monsters may be worth more than the typical token. The Orcish Warchief who trampled over the civilized lands may be worth more than his general, despite them being within a level of each other. Dragons in particular are noted for being magical and dangerous opponents. At GM discretion, an opponent may be worth up to ten tokens, rather than just the single one.
And now we get to abuse again. Boss Monsters have to be worth something, and this lets you have special opponents that are particularly valuable for crafting. It's nice to go 'We have killed the Ice Wolf of Risia, and have made equipment from his body. His teeth were made into the Rogue's Adamantine +2 Wounding Daggers, his pelt grants the Barbarian new vigor as a +4 Belt of Constitution, his eyes now serve the Ranger and grant him a +10 bonus to survival checks, and his blood has coated my axe, granting it the Vicious property on top of its existing enchantments.' Or, y'know. Whatever.)
Instead of simply granting CR^2*10 GP with each creature killed, make it a skill check. Allow a Survival, Knowledge(Arcana) or other relevant check (Such as Knowledge(Religion) with Undead, or Knowledge(Architecture) with Golems, Craft(Taxidermy) with Animals and Magical Beasts, or Knowledge(Nature) with plants) to determine how much of the value you get.
Check exceeds CR+20:Add (1d6*10)% to the value of the acquired tokens.
Check is between CR+16 and CR+20:110% the value of the acquired tokens
Check is between CR+10 to CR+15:The tokens are worth full value.
Check is between CR+5 and CR+10:The tokens are worth 90% of the full value.
Check is lower than CR+5:The tokens are worth 50% value or less.
:Be sure to adjust those skill checks to match the skill investment of your players. This one is done for bare bones-the players are unlikely to acquire more than a +5 bonus over what is likely to be acquired. Of all the optional rules, this is the one I would be most wary about adding. That said, it does allow a measure of randomness that can be nice to have.
Tokens are nice-but they don't always encompass the feel you're going for. Rather than force players to save their bits of Ogre and blood of Wolf for ages on end and allow it to spoil, simply keep track of tokens for them. When they reach a pre-determined number (5 for small changes worth less than 15% of WBL, 10 for changes between 15% and 25%, 20 for anything above that) of tokens, upgrade the party's items. With the killing blow of the Troll Chieftain, the Fighter's Sword gains the Holy property, the Wizard's Staff is recharged and captures the Troll's spirit, adding 'Command Undead' to its list of spells, the Rogue's gloves become Gloves of Dexterity+6, and the Monk gets a rock.
Similar to the above-but not to the point of spontaneous conversion. Allow people to turn their tokens into magical items without having crafting feats. Crafting feats are required to spend XP and gold to cover gaps left, but no one is truly required to have them, nor have the appropriate spells, so long as they have the right tokens and a will to use them.
5/13/2014, 12:56 AM:Progressed from 'WIP' to 'Oh god, the critiques are coming.'