is my weapon "hidden"?

[sideswipe]

OK guys I have a question about sleight of hand.

i have been told you can take a -20 on my sleight of hand check to hide as a free action.

now my question is. is the object now "hidden" and just hidden badly so all know its there or does the DM have to make a spot check with every enemy in the combat to see if it is hidden?

this is in reference to skill tricks like hidden blade. i want my opponents flat footed and need my weapon to be hidden to use it. so is it hidden even if they see it as i have "hidden" it or must they actually fail the check. there seems to be no ruling i can find.

thank you in advance

[Doc_Maynot]

Here is the relevant section.



You can hide a small object (including a light weapon or an easily concealed ranged weapon, such as a dart, sling, or hand crossbow) on your body. Your Sleight of Hand check is opposed by the Spot check of anyone observing you or the Search check of anyone frisking you. In the latter case, the searcher gains a +4 bonus on the Search check, since it’s generally easier to find such an object than to hide it. A dagger is easier to hide than most light weapons, and grants you a +2 bonus on your Sleight of Hand check to conceal it. An extraordinarily small object, such as a coin, shuriken, or ring, grants you a +4 bonus on your Sleight of Hand check to conceal it

[sideswipe]

i understand but it does not suggest that the check would be failed if they see it. just that they can see it. so would it be hidden?


edit - just checked rules compendium and losing an opposed check means the check is failed. so it would not be hidden.

[HammeredWharf]

The SoH check is pretty easy to boost. +2 from hiding a dagger, +2 from baggy clothing, +5 from an inside pocket (CS) for a total of +9 without even trying. You Dexterity is probably higher than your opponent's Wisdom, so you get an advantage there, too. There's also no limit to how many weapons you can have hidden, so just hide a dozen daggers inside your clothes before combat begins. They're cheap and your opponents won't get a check unless they frisk you.

[Darrin]

edit - just checked rules compendium and losing an opposed check means the check is failed. so it would not be hidden.

Here's what the Rules Compendium says:

"The observer’s success doesn’t prevent you from performing the act, but it keeps you from doing it unnoticed."

So by taking a -20 penalty on your roll, you can hide a weapon as a free action. If your opponent spots you, fine, he knows what you did with the weapon and as far as he's concerned, it's not hidden. But the fact that he observed you doesn't change the type of action you used, so it's still a free action.

The problem with hiding the weapon that way is getting it back into your hand. It's a standard action to draw a hidden weapon, or a move action if you have the Quickdraw feat. In this case, it doesn't matter if you were observed or not when you hid it. It becomes a "hidden" weapon when you spent an action to hide it, which presumably means you put it in a place where it's not as easy to draw as it normally is.

[Trasilor]

The problem with hiding the weapon that way is getting it back into your hand. It's a standard action to draw a hidden weapon, or a move action if you have the Quickdraw feat. In this case, it doesn't matter if you were observed or not when you hid it. It becomes a "hidden" weapon when you spent an action to hide it, which presumably means you put it in a place where it's not as easy to draw as it normally is.

Not a problems with Hidden Blade Trick. Combine with -20 free action to hide object means you can take a free action to hide your weapon - move action to draw the weapon, attack the opponent (rendering them flat footed) thus applying your precision damage.

If the character gets their Slight of hand Pumped through the roof, they could do this every round consistently.

[Flickerdart]

If the character gets their Slight of hand Pumped through the roof, they could do this every round consistently.
Skill Tricks are only usable once per encounter.

[nedz]

But there are several options. You should be able to use these to cover those instances when you can't sneak in any other way.


Flick of the Wrist — Feat ( Complete Warrior p99) once per opponent per encounter
Sudden Draw — Skill Trick ( Complete Scoundrel p89) on an AoO
Hidden Blade — Skill Trick ( Complete Scoundrel p87)