Rate my pathfinder Rogue, if you please :)

[Odessa333]

Alright people!

It's final decision time and my other topic vanished on me, so here goes:

I'm making a Level 1 Half-Elf Rogue, only 1 Trait. DM says level progression will be roughly a level a month for a year long campaign, so roughly end at level 12/13. We are a four person group: My Rogue, a Ranger, a Fighter, and a Cleric.

With the starting low level, I am thinking I'm not going to be able to pull of TWF with a rogue, so I'll do what I can with a Dervish dance scimitar idea. Stats:


STR: 7 (-2)
DEX: 19 (17, with +2 bonus from half elf to 19) (+4)
CON: 14 (+2)
INT: 14 (+2)
WIS: 14 (+2)
CHA: 7 (-2)

Level up bonus's all to DEX.

Start by taking Heirloom weapon for my 1 trait and get proficient with Scimitar. Level 1, take Weapon finesse as my feat and start with a Rapier or something. I won't do much with a -2 for STR, but with any luck I can get some backstabs to hold my own for one level. Level 2 take Rogue Talent combat Trick to take Dervish dance.

From there, I'm not sure. I can stick with Rogue, getting things like Weapon Focus, Improved initiative, Trap Spotter, etc, and work on backstab damage. I'm also debating aiming for Shadow Dancer (with half elf multi talented). I could grab the 3 feats for it's tax at level 3, 4 (rogue combat trick), and 5, and start taking levels in at six. A two level dip nabs Hide in Plain sight and Dark vision, among others. If I go shadow dancer, I could take the Rogue scout archtype, and get Uncanny dodge back from Shadow dancer. The abilities sound tempting, but is the three feat tax (Combat Reflexes, Dodge, Mobility) and slight lose of sneak attack too pricey for this campaign?

Suggestions welcome!

[StreamOfTheSky]

Is this basically a core rule book only game? Everything other than mention of a trait and Dervish Dance sounded like it was from core, so I'm wondering. If it is not, is there any special attachment you have to rogue class specifically? Out of core, there are other options to make a sneak attacker that are...better. Ditto for why you chose Half-Elf. I prefer my rogues to have darkvision and choose races accordingly. If my rogue can't scout in the dark w/o a torch nor shank a fool in a dark alley...he's not a very good rogue. :smallsmile:

As for the trait...if you're using the original version of Heirloom Weapon (free proficiency, free masterwork property, AND +1 trait bonus on attack rolls), by all means keep that. If you're using the errata'd version that's not nearly as good...I might suggest other traits. There are other ways to get a weapon proficiency, such as multiclassing or using Half-Elf's Ancestral Arms variant.

How painful Shadowdancer's 3 feat tax is depends entirely on just how many feats you can pick from anyway.

Another thought if you can use it and are set on the Dervish Dance route is to look at the Dawnflower Dervish / Dervish of Dawn (latter is d20pfsrd's name for it) Bard. Gets the feat right from level 1, and while it has no sneak attack...self-only inspire courage for 2x the bonus is about as good and works all the time. They keep versatile performance, which by level 6 means bards have more skills than rogue. And of course, spellcasting. You could basically keep the current stats, just swap Wis and Cha. Ideal races would be Human (extra spells known racial favored class option; Half-Elf and Half-Orc can also choose this, though, thanks to counting as human) or my pick...Musetouched Aasimar (Gets +2 Dex/Cha, no stat penalty, blanket +2 to Perform checks, and favored class can add to effective bard level for inspire courage to get higher bonuses earlier).

[Odessa333]

Yes, races and classes are core only, no 3rd party anything. I'm committed to being a Half-elf Rogue, so I can't change anything there.

Heirloom weapon just gives proficiency. It's that, dipping, or a feat, really, and the trait seems the easiest route.

The DM seemed worried over my CHA, thinking I'd be the face as a rogue. Is it worth losing the bonus in WIS or CON for a boosted CHA? Doesn't seem worth it, but I'm second guessing myself.

[Odessa333]

(Looks around)

Hello? Anyone out there? It's not Margaret, but I'm still here...

[Kudaku]

A few thoughts...


Does your GM care about encumbrance? A Strength of 7 means you can carry 23 lb as a light load. Studded Leather Armor and a scimitar puts you at exactly 24 lb, which will hose your dexterity modifier and movement speed. Moreover, unless you invest in a heavyload belt or muleback cords, a handy haversack or a bag of holding won't help you since that weight is gear you'll have equipped - not tucked away in a bag.


In my opinion it's a dumb rule and if your GM is ok with it feel free to ignore it, but RAW you can't pick a prestige class as a favored class.


You can still do a decent job of "face" with a 7 charisma once you get a few levels going. That said, if the cleric has a decentish charisma then he might be better doing the main face job with Diplomacy. If the fighter is a classic "big strength low charisma" beefcake then point out Intimidating Prowess, it's a great feat for Fighters who want to contribute on the social side. Ideally they'd do the heavy lifting and you provide backup with Bluff when needed.

If you do decide to put some extra points in strength or charisma, I'd suggest drawing from intelligence - not wisdom. You really need a decent will save, whereas intelligence doesn't actually provide all that much since you already have a lot of skill points.