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Spore
2014-05-18, 10:27 PM
The RAW reads:


Each oracle must choose from among the following mysteries. Unless otherwise noted, the DC to save against these revelations is equal to 10 + 1/2 the oracle's level + the oracle's Charisma modifier. Spells marked with an asterisk (*) appear in Chapter 5 of this book.


Soul Siphon (Su): As a ranged touch attack, you can unleash a ray that causes a target to gain one negative level. The ray has a range of 30 feet. This negative level lasts for a number of minutes equal to your Charisma modifier. Whenever this ability gives a target a negative level, you heal a number of hit points equal to your oracle level. You can use this ability once per day, plus one additional time at 11th level and every four levels thereafter. You must be at least 7th level to select this revelation.

By RAW the DC for Soul Siphon from the Bones Oracle is 1/2 level + Charisma. But which save does it attack if it does attack one? I am fine with the revelation not attacking a save at all (since it's a ranged touch attack and only useable twice/day and I will get them to fail the save with a dual cursed oracle anyhow).

I can see two major arguments here:

1) No save because there is no targetted save described.

2) Fortitude save because any save in the necromantic spectrum attacks Fort. Still, some attack Will, so can I choose now?

3) Any rules lingo buried deep in the CRB which makes my thread trivial.

Spore
2014-05-19, 03:13 PM
No opinions?

Yanisa
2014-05-19, 03:43 PM
The ability doesn't mention a save, so there is no save. The generic line is for when there is a reference to a save and doesn't imply that all revelations have a save. In fact many spells are either "touch" or "save" and not both (albeit with exceptions).

Pex
2014-05-19, 06:10 PM
There is no saving throw because you have to make a range touch attack roll. With few exceptions, such as the Disintegrate spell, a magical effect where you roll to hit won't have a saving throw. Failing to hit is akin to an opponent making a saving throw for magical effects where you don't roll to hit. This isn't a rule, per se, merely a trend. For the ability itself, since no saving throw is mentioned none exists.

Spore
2014-05-20, 04:46 AM
I checked the most appropriate spell, Enervation, and was surprised that it didn't want a save. Well I spend a class feature to get a "minimized" Enervation 2/day so I guess it's great. Especially for cutting down those CR+2 encounters our DM throws at us because our sessions are short and thus most fights have to take more ressources.

(I can already see him weep when his precious epic monster gets hit by Soul Siphon, Greater Curse by my side and with Misfortune, Evil Eye and Dominate Monster by the Witch, effectively defeating an encounter in 3 combat rounds).