gestalt character concepts.

[Agamemmnoth]

So my party did a TPW on a boss fight today. So we're re-rolling new characters and starting a new campaign. The dm is allowing for gestalt characters with two flaws. I'm curious on character concepts and class combinations.

I'm thinking maybe a barbarian//druid (dire polar bear with bight of the werebear enraged anyone?)

Or a cleric//crusader

or maybe a little evil with cleric//dread necromancer.

Give me your best gestalt character concepts, class suggestions, and flaws. I'm open to anything.

[shadowseve]

So my party did a TPW on a boss fight today. So we're re-rolling new characters and starting a new campaign. The dm is allowing for gestalt characters with two flaws. I'm curious on character concepts and class combinations.

I'm thinking maybe a barbarian//druid (dire polar bear with bight of the werebear enraged anyone?)

Or a cleric//crusader

or maybe a little evil with cleric//dread necromancer.

Give me your best gestalt character concepts, class suggestions, and flaws. I'm open to anything.

personality wise a barbarian//druid would be perfect if I was allowed to do that since my character is a bit brash and she stays in bear form a lot anyways. So I'd choose the first. that's just on concept wise.

[Agamemmnoth]

wow. que in the crickets.:smallfrown:

[Togo]

Need a bit more input. 'All gestalt character ideas ever' is really too wide a range to write about.

There are a couple of patterns in Gestalt character creation

The first is to treat it as a single class character, and add bonuses. So you choose a race or template or some bloodline abilities, fill up one side of the gestalt with these, and run the other half as straight class X. Similarly, you can also run the character as a class X, and use the other side of the gestalt to take class features that will give you bonuses to achieve that. This would cover builds like minotaur half-fey/ranger, or your druid/barbarian. You're basically just looking to be a druid, and act like a druid, but have a better BAB, and rage, right?

If that's the route you want to go, I'd suggest something like druid/barbarian up to 5th level, and then taking p-classes like warshaper/master of many forms, nature's warrior, or fist of forest, on one side of the gestalt, and straight druid on the other.


The second approach is to use it combine two dissimilar classes, trying to make the abilities work together. This would cover just about any concept that would normally done with multiclassing, only without the drawbacks. So classic combinations like wizard thief, or monk/cleric. The key point here is to make sure that you don't run out of actions or high stats - a barbarian wizard can't easily both cast spells and rage at the same time, and will have to choose whether to have a high intelligence and be less good at fighting, or have a high strength and be less good at spellcasting. Try finding a good prestige class that covers the combination you want to try, like spellsword for a barbarian wizard, and then working backwards from there.


The third approach is to blend abilities that are similar, to make something that isn't exactly similar to either. So your classic bard/marshal, barbarian ranger, or sorcerer/cleric would go in here. This is the hardest to do well, but it's no more desirable or effective than any of the others.


These categories aren't exclusive, but should give you a start point from which to explore some options.

[Agamemmnoth]

Need a bit more input. 'All gestalt character ideas ever' is really too wide a range to write about.

There are a couple of patterns in Gestalt character creation

The first is to treat it as a single class character, and add bonuses. So you choose a race or template or some bloodline abilities, fill up one side of the gestalt with these, and run the other half as straight class X. Similarly, you can also run the character as a class X, and use the other side of the gestalt to take class features that will give you bonuses to achieve that. This would cover builds like minotaur half-fey/ranger, or your druid/barbarian. You're basically just looking to be a druid, and act like a druid, but have a better BAB, and rage, right?

If that's the route you want to go, I'd suggest something like druid/barbarian up to 5th level, and then taking p-classes like warshaper/master of many forms, nature's warrior, or fist of forest, on one side of the gestalt, and straight druid on the other.


The second approach is to use it combine two dissimilar classes, trying to make the abilities work together. This would cover just about any concept that would normally done with multiclassing, only without the drawbacks. So classic combinations like wizard thief, or monk/cleric. The key point here is to make sure that you don't run out of actions or high stats - a barbarian wizard can't easily both cast spells and rage at the same time, and will have to choose whether to have a high intelligence and be less good at fighting, or have a high strength and be less good at spellcasting. Try finding a good prestige class that covers the combination you want to try, like spellsword for a barbarian wizard, and then working backwards from there.


The third approach is to blend abilities that are similar, to make something that isn't exactly similar to either. So your classic bard/marshal, barbarian ranger, or sorcerer/cleric would go in here. This is the hardest to do well, but it's no more desirable or effective than any of the others.


These categories aren't exclusive, but should give you a start point from which to explore some options.

This does give me a few ideas. I was a druid in last campaign so I might try something different.

One I had was cloistered cleric//lock down crusader might be a good combo. If not for the theme aspect, maybe take the saint template and play a bad ass holy character. Or go completely evil. I do think I want something cleric based this time around. I also like the idea of filling one class with some really nice templates. Didn't think of that one. So this does give me a base to look at and at least think about. Thanks.

[John Longarrow]

For Badass Clerical ability;
Lvl 1 Archivist / Crusader
Lvl 2+ Archivist / Cleric

You get full BAB, D8 HP, 6 skill points / lvl, and you get double your fun for clerical spells AND you can grab druidic spells.

[Sception]

Bard/Dirgesinger|Dread Necromancer is a favorite of mine. Works either as a fey gothy Orpheus type who can bewitch the spirits of the dead with his melancholy songs, or a black metal rocker who literally wakes the dead, or something inbetween, a la Adventure Time's Marceline.

You'll be able to animate or summon undead with your dread necro abilities, then buff them in combat with your bard powers (once you qualify for dirgesinger). Between your bardic illusion abilities and your sky high cha skills, you'll also be able to hide your necromantic abilities from disapproving authorities. You'll be able to heal, bewitch, and dominate both the living and the dead, and between your spell lists you'll have something useful to contribute against most non-construct enemies, while your cha skills make you an excellent party face out of combat. The dred necro's durability will help you early on when you don't have regular access to minions, making you basically an extra tough bard, while the bards (slightly) better base attack with help with your dread necro's touch spells.

The minions make this a poor choice for large parties - and even in small parties I wouldn't keep anything like as many minions around as you can technically animate (in a mass battle campaign, I had a non-gestalt dread necromancer with several hundred minions totaling well over 1k hit dice, between animate dead, command undead the spell, rebuke/command undead, chain control spawning, and cohorts and followers with their own control pools). But creating one or two undead per party member and then ordering them to follow your allies' commands is usually workable, especially in small parties, which gestalt usually involves. Plus, unless there's a paladin, the party will tend to object less to your necromantic habits if they're providing the a beefy bodyguard who is immune to his area effect damage, a flanking buddy for the rogue, a tireless flying steed for the archer, etc, that they control themselves, instead of an army of personal servants that make your own turn take ages.

Speaking of paladins, do not play a necro, dread or otherwise, if you have one in the party. Too much unavoidable conflict there, even if you aren't personally evil (which I don't recommend anyway), and if it comes down to one or the other, the paladin is more iconic and is a core class, and 'heroic' fantasy is the D&D default, so unless the DM specified otherwise players really should be able to assume they can run one.

[Fouredged Sword]

Well, one idea that I have wanted to try out, but never did, was as follows.

Barbarian 1 / wildshape ranger 5 / warshaper 4 / master of many forms 10 // shapeshifter druid 20

Shapeshifter druid trades away your animal companion and wildshape for a cool ability to take a set of forms based on your natural stats, with boosts. Barbarian rage and warshaper grant boosts to that form. Wildshape ranger turns around and gives you wildshape back, and master of many forms takes it to the next level.

You are basically a super druid. Fast healing, immunity to critical hits, and a strength score in the upper double digits. (wildshape into a fire giant base 31, bite of the werebear +16, rage +4, Warshaper +4, shapeshift into the elemental form,

[shadowseve]

For Badass Clerical ability;
Lvl 1 Archivist / Crusader
Lvl 2+ Archivist / Cleric

You get full BAB, D8 HP, 6 skill points / lvl, and you get double your fun for clerical spells AND you can grab druidic spells.

would you not take the d10 eventually from the crusader since you apply the best of what you're taking?

[Rebel7284]

Well considering that arcane spellcasting is the best and taking more actions than your opponent is amazing, I think one of the strongest builds you can do in gestalt is:

Martial Wizard 5/Swiftblade 10/X 5 //
Factotum 5/Wizard 1/Factotum 2/Wizard 1/Factotum 2/Wizard 1/Factotum 2/Wizard 1/ Y 5

Add you intelligence to everything and take 3 standard actions a turn with full wizard casting and nearly full BAB thrown in too. Oh also overcome all spell resistance.

While cleric/crusader makes the best tank in the game, a ruby knight vindicator already does that without needing gestalt.

[Shining Wrath]

How high-op do you want to be? I suggest:

For class 1, take something from a high Tier.
For class 2, take something low Tier but flavorful or synergistic


Sorcerer / Healer - use the Sorcerer's high charisma to boost the healing spells of the Healer.
Wizard / Warblade - use the Wizard's high Intelligence to boost the class abilities of the Warblade
Cloistered Cleric / Factotum - you know almost everything, and can do almost anything
You mentioned Druid / Barbarian; Druid / Ranger is along the same lines. Take Mystical Ranger, trade away inferior animal companion for some healing spells
Cleric / Monk - buff yourself, then pummel them to death. Wisdom synergies.
Warforged Artificer / Warblade. You are a self-made man :smallsmile: who makes incredibly powerful swords which he wields better than anyone else alive

[Forrestfire]

I like using gestalt to take the caster classes you'd never take in a normal game.

Wizard 15/Abjurant Champion 5//Melee class 5/Arcane Duelist 10/Melee class 5 is a fun one. Lets you work towards that badass capstone and still have casting.

Wizard x/PrCs 10//Whatever you want/Master of the Unseen Hand 5 lets you have all the fun of a full caster and still be badass at telekinesis. Maybe use some Dungeoncrasher levels and a Marshal dip to buff your bull rushes, too.

Wizard 20//Something 5/Eunuch Warlock 10/something 5 gets you full casting and eleventh-level spells :smallbiggrin:

[Sception]

Keep in mind that, as a rule, PrCs that essentially combine the abilities of two classes (arcane trickster, eldritch knight, all dual caster progression PrCs) are not allowed in gestalt.

[A.A.King]

Martial Wizard 20 // Archivist 20 -> Learn all the Spells

You'll also be pretty decent at combat thanks to the Wizard's Fighter Bonus Feats, the Archivist's Dark Knowledge and the obvious "Knowledge Devotion".

If we're talking less powerful I've always liked the idea of:

Barbarian 4 / War Chanter 3 / Bear Warrior 5 / Warshaper 1 / War Chanter 7 // Bard 20

You can't cast spells while raging or in bear form but by RAW you can still use Bardic Music :P. Just take "Perform (Oratory)" because which army wouldn't be inspired to be courage if their leader just transformed into a bear and started charging at the enemy?

[Shining Wrath]

Martial Wizard 20 // Archivist 20 -> Learn all the Spells

You'll also be pretty decent at combat thanks to the Wizard's Fighter Bonus Feats, the Archivist's Dark Knowledge and the obvious "Knowledge Devotion".

If we're talking less powerful I've always liked the idea of:

Barbarian 4 / War Chanter 3 / Bear Warrior 5 / Warshaper 1 / War Chanter 7 // Bard 20

You can't cast spells while raging or in bear form but by RAW you can still use Bardic Music :P. Just take "Perform (Oratory)" because which army wouldn't be inspired to be courage if their leader just transformed into a bear and started charging at the enemy?

"We few ... we chosen few ... we band of brothers and one BEAR!"

[John Longarrow]

would you not take the d10 eventually from the crusader since you apply the best of what you're taking?

You get the D10 at 1st level. After that, its all about using spells. Plus with the levels off set you keep full BAB going. With the number of 2nd level spells you'll have, you can afford to keep Bears Endurance up for most fights to compensate for the lower HPs.

[A.A.King]

Btw, changing War Shaper to one level of Fist of the Forest might be better. Gives you Con to AC. If you worry about the Prerequisites you just take the Bear Totem Barbarian Variant and combine it with the City Brawler Barbarian Variant. Does mean you don't get pounce but overall I think it's a net win.



"We few ... we chosen few ... we band of brothers and one BEAR!"

xD