Fireball Mage

[Snownine]

This summer I will likely start playing a second campaign and thought it would be fun to try out a magic class. I wanted to to go with a damage dealing mage using largely evocation and conjuration. I know this is far from ideal and that the arcane classes are capable of a lot more but it sounds like fun and at the low optimization level we will be playing at I am not too worried about being underpowered. My questions are if I am going to be playing in this fashion would a wizard or sorcerer be the better class and what feats/metamagic feats would be good. Also suggestions on 0-3rd level spells would be appreciated as well.

[Kamin_Majere]

Why not just play a WarMage? All the blasty fun and the class is built to take advantage of it with a few nice bonus

[DrMike105]

I disagree. A wizard or sorcerer can do everything a warmage can do, plus more. If you want to focus on being blasty, a sorcerer might be better for the extra spell slots. Gold Dwarf is from Forgotten Realms, and trades the normal charisma penalty for a dex penalty. That gives you a nice con bonus, and the ninth level dwarf sorcerer substitution level (Races of Stone) lets you add your con bonus to your charisma to determine bonus spells. Human, of course, is always good, or strongheart halfling (also forgotten realms).

As far as feats go, empower is always useful. Reserve feats (Complete Mage) can guarantee you always have some form of blasting.

For spells, I'd only take one blaster per level, two at the most. That leaves you more room for utility. Magic missile at first; low damage, but nice range, auto hit, and force damage for ethereals (incorporeals? I forget which). Second level, I'd take scorching ray. At third, either fireball or lightning bolt (depending on which reserve feat you want). Fourth is where you get the Orb of X spells; these will wind up being your single target go-to's, with their good damage and no spell resistance.

Edit: Punctuation

[Cloud]

If you want to focus on the sick deepz, then probably Sorcerer, if only because you need to chuck out 2 or 3 spells to the Wizards 1 to keep up. Aside from Sorcerer, have you looked at the Warmage?

Feat wise, Improved Initiative and Versatile Caster are nice. To help with the damage, Empower, Maximise, Quicken, Twin, and Repeat metamagic feats are nice, as is using them with Residual Magic or Practical Metamagic.

Spell wise, lots of spells that could be useful;
1st Level: Magic Missile, Lesser Orb of X, True Strike, True Casting, Shocking Grasp, Kelgore’s Fire Bolt, Nerveskitter
2nd Level: Scorching Ray, See Invisibility, Glitterdust, Combust, Seeking Ray, Acid Arrow
3rd Level: Fireball, Alter Fortune, Primal Senses, Sound Lance, Acid Breath

[Captnq]

Okay, Honestly?

Be a wizard. Call yourself Pyrus Incendium. Take 1 level of clostered cleric. Dump all three domains for domain feats. Make sure two of those domains are chosen from Amaunator. Take the feat Initiate of Amaunator. Now you can:


...spontaneously cast any spell on your spell list that has the fire descriptor.

Your spell list is any cleric/sorcerer/wizard spell that has the fire descriptor, which should be a metric ton.

Go. To. Town.
Burn. It. Down.

Take metamagic feats Sculpt, Empower, Maximize, in that order. Take feats to reduce the metamagic cost.

https://i.chzbgr.com/maxW500/6347628800/hC73AA171/

[HighWater]

Have you considered Warlock for all-day-blastinesss?


Otherwise, sorcerer is probably a better low-op blaster. As for feats, take whatever screams "Moar DAMAAAAGE!!". Yes, this includes Improved Initiative (take this early).

If you're going to use Area of Effect blasts a bunch, take a look at the Complete Arcane Metamagic feat Sculpt Spell (+1). It will let you use those AoE spells much more effectively, and can help in not-hitting your teammates.

If you're not looking to blow the competition/opposition completely out of the water, being a blaster doesn't require all that much optimisation.

[Seerow]

Where are you getting a metric ton of fire descriptor spells on the cleric spell list after sacrificing all 3 of your domains for feats?

[Dorian Gray]

Scorching ray is going to be your bread and butter for damage- it can even surpass the orb line with the right feats. By which I mean split ray: for just +2 to spell level, double your ray damage!
For high-optimization blasting, sorcerer is better, just because of arcane fusion (ab)use, but really, sorcerer and wizard are both good options.
Of course, whisper gnome illusionists are the best blasters of all!

[Captnq]

Where are you getting a metric ton of fire descriptor spells on the cleric spell list after sacrificing all 3 of your domains for feats?

I count 82 fire spells that combinations makes available to YOUR WIZARD. Nothing in the feat limits it to your cleric. Yes, you need to blow one level getting access to all the spells in both lists that you can cast SPONTANEOUSLY, even if YOU DON'T HAVE IT IN YOUR SPELLBOOK. But it's a small price to pay to be able to pretend to be a sorcerer without any of the hangups. In fact, if you specialize in Evocation, I bet you will have just about as many spells per day as a sorcerer. Personally, I'd go with domain wizard: fire. Just as effective and you don't have to give up two schools in the process.

The three domain feats are just icing on the cake.

[jaybird]

You need Arcane Thesis. +2 CL and -1 level to every metamagic feat you apply to your chosen spell is golden. Easy Metamagic for a further -1 to a specific metamagic feat's adjustment. Searing Spell to ignore Fire Resist and deal half damage to Fire Immune. Firey Spell for +1 damage per dice on a [Fire] spell. Empower Spell as it's more efficient than Maximize Spell. If you have enough levels and feats, go into War Mage from Dragonlance. 5/5 casting class with +3 damage per dice on all your spells - that means each Scorching Ray goes from 4d6 to 4d6+12.

EDIT: Pick either Fireball or Scorching Ray as your bread and butter spell. Or Orb of Fire if you're a filthy filthy munchkin :smallbiggrin: No need for more.

[Captnq]

Go with the Risen Sun Heresy, and select the domains Knowledge, Fire, Sun. When you trade them in for domain feats, you'll get the most damage causing perks that way.

[Keld Denar]

Scorching ray is going to be your bread and butter for damage- it can even surpass the orb line with the right feats. By which I mean split ray: for just +2 to spell level, double your ray damage!

Common misconception. Split Ray actually only ADDS a single ray. It does double the number of rays present, as long as the original number of rays present was 1 (for Enervation or Seeking Ray or Stun Ray). For Scorching Ray, you'd end up with 3 rays at CL7 or 4 rays at CL11, an increase of 50% and 33% respectively. A better investment at CL11 would be Empower Spell which gives a flat 50% increase.

Funny, though...if you go Wizard5/Spellwarped Sniper5, you can cast Split Ray Fireballs for 20d6 at CL10. Not too shabby.

[chainer1216]

Go with Wilder? Expanded knowledge or whatever for one or two kinetisist only powers.

[WinWin]

Warmage is ok, but I feel they are better at Damage Over Time, than instantaneous damage delivery. Reason being that their Warmage edge applies to each instance of spell damage, even if it is only a petty one point of damage from something like Thunderhead.

Instantanous damage is usually optimal because a dead enemy can't retaliate, but you can work around that with something like Born of Three Thunders, which adds a save vs. stun and knockdown rider to damaging spells. Combine that with damage over time and you have a neat little killing lockdown combo. This can be advantageous if you're encountering tough enemies you can't normally One Hit Kill. It's not optimal against hordes of mooks you normally could OHK, unless you're effecting a large area.

Unfortunately, you can't pick up Bo3T before 6th level in most cases. Also, you may run into trouble adding Energy Substitution (Electricity or Sonic) to spells as a spontaneous caster.

Still, you can rock a Focused Specialist Evoker and be messing people up with Electricity Substituted Flaming Spheres by level 5, or as a Warmage, Sorcerer, Spirit Shaman or Druid by level 6.

[Snownine]

Are some energy types generally more useful than others? I don't want to be completely useless when we come across a bunch of enemies that resist my go-to spells.

[Cloud]

The 5 Energy Types are Acid, Cold, Electricity, Fire, Sonic. (Force is certainly a type of damage, but not an energy type. Even more annoyingly positive energy and negative energy despite having energy in their name aren't energies like the first 5 are, but I digress).

Roughly speaking, you'll probably find Sonic>>Acid>Electricity>Cold>=Fire in terms of how good the energy type is at avoiding resistance. Force while not technically an energy is also an extremely desirable damage type (looking at you, Orb of Force), as basically nothing can resist it. A healthy mix of spells (and possible the energy admixture feat) can go a long way in making sure you're not useless against any particular monster.

[Yorrin]

Sonic>>Acid>Electricity>Cold>=Fire

To further expound, Sonic effects are great, but are fairly rare, so it's difficult to specialize in them. For this reason I advise specializing Acid- it's plentiful and easy to boost. BUT don't overspecialize. It's always good to have more than one option for damage. Force is always good, and Fire has access to Searing Spell, which helps a lot.

[Red Fel]

The 5 Energy Types are Acid, Cold, Electricity, Fire, Sonic. (Force is certainly a type of damage, but not an energy type. Even more annoyingly positive energy and negative energy despite having energy in their name aren't energies like the first 5 are, but I digress).

Roughly speaking, you'll probably find Sonic>>Acid>Electricity>Cold>=Fire in terms of how good the energy type is at avoiding resistance. Force while not technically an energy is also an extremely desirable damage type (looking at you, Orb of Force), as basically nothing can resist it. A healthy mix of spells (and possible the energy admixture feat) can go a long way in making sure you're not useless against any particular monster.

This. Sadly, while fire is often the most fun, it's also the most commonly resisted, particularly by high-level creatures such as Dragons and Outsiders.

There are some interesting metamagic feats that add unique functions to various energy types. For example, Lord of the Uttercold turns any Cold-damage spell into half Cold, half negative energy. Similarly, Born of the Three Thunders turns any Electricity or Sonic spell into half-and-half, and then stuns enemies and knocks them prone. Fire... Doesn't really get cool effects like that. Off the top of my head, you've got Searing Spell, which hurts fire-immune enemies (for half damage) and is basically mandatory for any fire-caster; Fiery Spell, which simply gives you an increase in damage; and Blistering Spell, which deals extra damage and inflicts a penalty to hit on the target(s). Further, unlike LotU or BotTT, these metamagics increase your spell's level.

I also second the suggestion of Reserve feats. Remember that not only do they give you an easy form of repeatable blasting, they also grant you a bonus to your CL for certain spells. For example, Fiery Burst gives you a standard action 30-foot explosion, plus a +1 competence bonus to CL for Fire spells.

EDIT: As an aside, why not try a Psion? PP instead of spell slots means that you're using only spells as strong as you want, whenever you want, as little or as much as you want. Powers like Energy Ray let you pick your energy type at the time of casting, giving you amazing versatility.

[Snownine]

This. Sadly, while fire is often the most fun, it's also the most commonly resisted, particularly by high-level creatures such as Dragons and Outsiders.

There are some interesting metamagic feats that add unique functions to various energy types. For example, Lord of the Uttercold turns any Cold-damage spell into half Cold, half negative energy. Similarly, Born of the Three Thunders turns any Electricity or Sonic spell into half-and-half, and then stuns enemies and knocks them prone. Fire... Doesn't really get cool effects like that. Off the top of my head, you've got Searing Spell, which hurts fire-immune enemies (for half damage) and is basically mandatory for any fire-caster; Fiery Spell, which simply gives you an increase in damage; and Blistering Spell, which deals extra damage and inflicts a penalty to hit on the target(s). Further, unlike LotU or BotTT, these metamagics increase your spell's level.

I also second the suggestion of Reserve feats. Remember that not only do they give you an easy form of repeatable blasting, they also grant you a bonus to your CL for certain spells. For example, Fiery Burst gives you a standard action 30-foot explosion, plus a +1 competence bonus to CL for Fire spells.

EDIT: As an aside, why not try a Psion? PP instead of spell slots means that you're using only spells as strong as you want, whenever you want, as little or as much as you want. Powers like Energy Ray let you pick your energy type at the time of casting, giving you amazing versatility.


So the Fiery Blast reserve feat gives me unlimited fiery blasts as long as I do not expend all of my 2nd level spells? As for the Psion I will have to look it up as I have no info on that.

[Red Fel]

So the Fiery Blast reserve feat gives me unlimited fiery blasts as long as I do not expend all of my 2nd level spells? As for the Psion I will have to look it up as I have no info on that.

Re-read Fiery Burst. It's 2nd-level or higher, and specifically Fire spells. For example, Meteor Swarm, a 9th-level Fire spell, counts for the reserve feat; Nondetection, despite being 3rd-level, does not count, because it's not a Fire spell; Burning Hands, despite being a Fire spell, does not count, because it's only 1st-level. Note also that the damage of your Fiery Burst is based upon the highest-level Fire spell you have, so that's a minimum of 2d6 and a maximum of 9d6.

For Psion, I suggest you go to the SRD (http://www.d20srd.org/index.htm). There is a section there dealing with psionic powers generally (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/psionic/psionicPowersOverview.htm), and another dealing specifically with the Psion class (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/psionic/classes/psion.htm).

The gist is this: a Psion is a spontaneous caster, like a Sorcerer, who gets powers (instead of spells) known, in a list from which he can freely cast. Unlike a Sorcerer who uses slots, however, the Psion has power points, which he can spend on any power he knows. Thus, he could manifest the same power over and over, or switch things up as he likes. Unlike spells, powers don't automatically increase with caster level; however, they can be manually augmented as you like with the expenditure of additional power points.

Short version: You can pick a bunch of pewpew powers and pewpew as much or as little as you like, spending as much or as little PP on them as you like. And unlike spells, which are often tied to a particular energy descriptor such as Cold or Fire, many direct-damage powers can have their energy types switched on the fly.

[Snownine]

For a first level spell it seems like Kelgores Fire Bolt, Magic Missile, and the Orb of Lesser X spells would all be great. Any suggestions on which would be better, or some alternative?

[Cloud]

Well, in terms of raw damage, Kelgore's Firebolt is d6 a level (unlike the lesser orbs) while still getting to be medium range. So at say level 2 to 5 it's a great little spell, and hopefully fire resistance and SR isn't becoming an issue yet. Magic Missile isn't too impressive, but it's hard to argue with never missing (and a great counter to mirror image). The main advantage of the lesser orbs is that they don't allow SR, you can pick a 'better' damage type than fire, does 1d8 instead of 1d6 for the non-sonic ones, and has an effect. Though after level 1 and before level 9, they'll deal less damage. Of course 'late game' they're much more effective than Kelgore's Firebolt.

If you ended up being a Sorcerer, you get all of 5 of these, and start with only 2, so perhaps Magic Missile, Kelgore's Firebolt, Lesser Orb of Acid, Lesser Orb of Sound, replace Kelgore's Firebolt with True Strike, and True Casting? You'd start with Magic Missile and Firebolt, some reliable ranged damage, pick up Lesser Orb of Acid at level 3, Lesser Orb of Sound at 5th, swap out Firebolt at 6th level after you've already maxed it out and got 3rd level spells, and pick up some nice utility, though utility to still help you kill things in True Strike and True Casting. You could also replace one of the Orbs with Nerve Skitter, but you might be better served by a wand of that, if the DM will let you use the Rule Compendium rules on wands and activation times. Not a damage spell per say, but I find going first and getting to melt your enemy is something a build like this would appreciate. XD

[Endarire]

Nerveskitter (Spell Compendium) should be a level 1 spell pick or on a wand or another item. The +5 initiative is just that awesome.

[WinWin]

Damage:

Power Word: Pain (enchantment, single target, DoT)
Hail of Stone (Conjuration, AoE)
Jet of Steam (Evocation, Line effect)


Non damage but effective:

Wall of Smoke (Conjuration, short duration at low levels, but Nauseated is a crippling condition)
Fetid Breath (Conjuration)
Color Spray (Illusion)
Grease (Conjuration)
Sleep (Enchantment)

Effective, but dangerous to use:

Seething Eyebane (Transmutation, Corrupt, causes blindness and AoE acid splash damage, but is a touch spell with a corruption cost)

[gr8artist]

I apologize if it was already mentioned, but Purify Spell is hilarious. Spell becomes [good] and deals no damage to good creatures, and only half to neutral. Throw purified fireballs into the middle of an engagement, and blame the sinners when you burn them.
If your allies were as noble as you, they wouldn't be on fire.

[Jeff the Green]

I apologize if it was already mentioned, but Purify Spell is hilarious. Spell becomes [good] and deals no damage to good creatures, and only half to neutral. Throw purified fireballs into the middle of an engagement, and blame the sinners when you burn them.
If your allies were as noble as you, they wouldn't be on fire.

Can also be combined with Spell Focus (Good) for more fun; just make sure to get some metamagic reducers.

Another class to consider is Spirit Shaman. The Druid list has some fantastic blasting options, and Spirit Shaman has probably the best casting mechanic for blasting. It can also make good use of the Initiate of Amaunator trick, which incidentally lets you take advantage of your hefty Charisma modifier to perform Divine Metamagic.

[HammeredWharf]

Being a Fire Domain Evoker Wizard with Arcane Thesis [Fireball] is a good starting point. That gives you +2 CL on spells with the Fire descriptor and +4 CL on Fireball. Now, you've got a couple of options, most of which are a bit broken under normal circumstances. First of all, you have to get rid of the pesky 10d6 restriction Fireball has. Reserves of Strength does that. Get rid of its stun with Third Eye Clarity. The War Mage PRC from Age of Mortals gives you extra damage, but Age of Mortals is a pretty questionable book. Then there's the classic Master Specialist route, which isn't that great in Evocation's case. To raise your damage a bit, you could use the Luck Devotion feat, which is like a free Empower that stacks with Empower. It's raises d6's average damage to 4,5, so it's a ~30% increase in damage per Fireball.

At lvl 10, this Fireball guy would deal 17*4,5*1,5 + 17*5 ~= 200 damage per Fireball. Without War Mage's bonus damage, this drops to ~115 damage per Fireball, but of course you can also use some other metamagic tricks to throw extra Fireballs in the mix. By then, you should be able to Twin and Quicken at least a couple of them.

Of course, you're free to downgrade the whole thing a bit if you think it's OP.