PDA

View Full Version : D&D 3.x Class Wielder of Ancestral Weapon(?) PEACH (WIP)



Ilinoris
2014-05-20, 12:47 PM
Hello!
I am currently running a campaign using Tome of Battle and Asian inspired themes!
I have been working on this PrC (based on other people's previous works((can't remember source! Sorry!)), aswell as the Eternal Blade from ToB) and I would love to get a second pair of eyes to look this over, just to see if it seems ridiculous or needs balancing or something :-)
Edit: My main concern is that giving a magic weapon can be dangerous, since my campaign is based on Low/to no-Magic.
So here goes:

Wielder of Ancestral Weapon
Requirements:
Base Attack Bonus: +10
Feats: Weapon Focus (with selected weapon)
Proficiency: Proficient in selected weapon.
Special: In order to pursue the path of the Ancestral Weapon, you must acquire a masterwork weapon that was used regularly by at least one of your deceased ancestors; all feat prerequisites must match the selected weapon.

Hit Dice: D8
http://i60.tinypic.com/20psu8g.jpg
Class skills (2 + Int modifier per level): Climb, Concentration, Diplomacy, Handle Animal, Intimidate, Jump, Martial Lore, Ride, Sense Motive, Tumble.

Ancestral Weapon (Su): Starting at 1st level, the wielder learns to use her heirloom weapon as a channel for the spirit of her dead ancestor, granting the object increasing magical power as the wielder advances and achieves deeper levels of meditation. The maximum power of the enchantment is equal to half her class level(minimum 1), so that at 1st level, she can grant her weapon a +1 enhancement bonus, while at 10th level, she could enchant it with powers up to the cost equivalent of +5.
Each time the Wielder wishes to increase the power of her ancestral weapon, she must spend 24 hours at a shrine paying homage to her ancestors.
If the weapon used to fulfill the "Special" prerequisite for this class is already magical, the bearer may not further enhance the weapon's power until her class level exceeds its current total "plusses". The wielder may only have one Ancestral Weapon at a time; if it is destroyed, she must locate another heirloom that belonged to one or more of her ancestors and begin the process anew. If the new weapon belonged to a different ancestor, the DM is free to have a different spirit possess it.

Unity of Purpose (Su): The magic of the Ancestral Weapon is such that the weapon wants to remain whole and in its descendant's hand. Add the wielder's class level to opposed attack rolls to resist attempts to disarm the weapon from her. The weapon cannot be sundered while it is wielded by the bearer, though it can be damaged or even destroyed while unattended or in the hands of another.

Eternal Training (Ex): Each night, your ancestor's spirit enter your mind. Instead of the usual 8 hours of sleep, you are able to reduce this to a 4 hour meditative trance, in which you spar with your ancestor's spirit. Once per day, you can draw upon this nightly training to aid you in a single battle. You gain an insight bonus equal to your Wisdom bonus (if any) on attack rolls and damage rolls against creatures of a single type. If you select humanoid or outsider as the type, you must also choose a subtype. You gain an additional use per day of this ability at 4th, 6th, 8th, and 10th level. Even if you have multiple uses of this ability per day, you can use this ability only once per encounter. You can use this ability only while you are wielding your Ancestral Weapon.

Greater Unity (Su): By 5th level, whenever the weapon is separated from the bearer, she can sense its direction by concentrating for a full round. She cannot sense the weapon if it lies on another plane.

Island in Time (Ex): At 10th level, you can throw yourself into a fight under your blade guide’s careful direction. You meld with it, allowing it to control your actions while you draw upon its vast combat experience. Once per encounter, you can take your turn as an immediate action. Using this ability does not change your initiative count, and you can use all your actions as normal. For example, if your initiative count is 15, you could act normally, use this ability to act again on initiative count 14, then act normally on the following round on initiative count 15. If you lose access to your blade guide, you lose this ability until it returns.

Spirit of the Ancestor (Su): As the bearer learns to channel her ancestor, the previous owner's spirit comes to reside in the weapon itself. Starting at 2nd level, the Ancestral Wow becomes an intelligent magical item; the bearer does not need to spend any time, money, or XP for this metamorphosis to occur. The ancestor has difficulty manifesting its will at first, but as the bearer continues her meditations and follows the path of the weapon, the spirit gains in power. Eventually, the weapon takes on the full personality and memories of the ancestor. The bearer presumably attempts to contact an ancestor of similar tendencies as her own; the spirit's alignment is thus always within one step of that of the bearer herself. However, the ancestor may have its own ideas on how to solve problems, and might even attempt to take control of the bearer if their views differ sharply on an issue. The weapon's Ego score is equal to that of a weapon with the sum of its accumulated powers. The DM should fully detail the ancestor's history and personality as he or she would any NPC, and play them appropriately.

The spirit of the ancestor gains the following powers:
Empathy (Su): Starting at 2nd level, the weapon can communicate via empathy, pulsing or throbbing to indicate approval or dissent while the bearer wields it.
Speech (Su): By 4th level, the spirit learns to speak aloud, learning one language per point of Intelligence bonus (and gaining an additional language whenever the spirit's Intelligence raises).
Telepathy (Su): At 8th level, the Ancestral Weapon has mastered telepathy, and can communicate with its bearer silently while within 30 feet. Either the bearer or the sword can initiate telepathic communication as a free action on their turn.
Senses (Ex): As the spirit becomes more adept at channeling itself through the heirloom, its ability to perceive the world increases. Its vision and hearing ranges increase, and eventually evolves Blindsense.

Edit: Removed the Requirement which was specific only to the homebrew campaign :-)

Edit: Made a typo in the title...

Inevitability
2014-05-21, 10:01 AM
I like the fluff of this class, and the fact that you get your own sentient weapon is something I've not seen anywhere else.

A few notes:

-I didn't really get if you can enhance the Ancestral Weapon when it's already magical. I got that if you had, for example, a +3 weapon, you have to be at least 4th level to augment it. But what happens if you augment it then? Does the weapon's enhancement bonus remain +3, because that's more than +2? Or does it become +5?

-Maybe add something on what happens if the weapon is destroyed. How about a ritual that costs some XP or gold?

-Eternal training seems... a bit weak. I think you should expand the range of enemies that can be affected by it.

Just my http://www.sitepoint.com/forums/images/smilies/smiles2/twocents.gif

EDIT: Also, just a thought, but how about bumping the hit dice? This class seems accessible by all ToB classes, so making the HD 1d10 would mean that most of them wouldn't be lowering their HP by taking this class.

Loek
2014-05-21, 12:07 PM
Realistically, the easiest (and probably best) way of handling this, is giving the class a variant on the item familiar (http://www.dandwiki.com/wiki/UA:Item_Familiars) (and its [url=http://www.dandwiki.com/wiki/UA:Item_Familiar_%28Feat%29]feat[/url) from UA.

Currently a number of things are missing, such as mental abilities of the weapon and powers other than gaining a +5 equivalent abilities (plus would you be able to trade in your +1 ability to get a +2 ability when you level up? or will you only be able to get a +2 ability if you save it up until you can afford it? Also, can you change things under other circumstances?)

The rest seems nice (though I have limited experience with the whole combat maneuver thing).


And yes, if you have a low magic setting, this kind of free "super" item will be a problem.

Tempestfury
2014-05-21, 12:39 PM
Reminds me a lot of the Kensai class, only without the exp requirement, and maneuvers and Island of Time added on... for that matter, you don't say what disciplines your are limited to? In fact, having a martial-adept PrC, without any martial-adept requirements is very strange and actually a little off-putting as well.

Still... the PrC really isn't all that engaging and interesting to me tbh... very much like the Kensai class, but doesn't really have the same factor of awesomeness/respect that the Kensai class has.

Overneath
2014-05-21, 02:15 PM
I know where the idea for this came from, incidentally. (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showsinglepost.php?p=9622876&postcount=5)

Making it a martial adept class instead of spellcasting is intriguing, but I don't feel it stands out against the original. I think you should pick and choose whether the class focuses on improving the weapon, improving the wielder, or improving both to a lesser degree. Any of those requires a little bit more to the class features.

Ilinoris
2014-05-22, 11:45 AM
I know where the idea for this came from, incidentally. (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showsinglepost.php?p=9622876&postcount=5)

Thanks for the source! - I just copy pasted the post and closed down the page - totally forgetting where I had it from. So thanks! :smallsmile:
I have read all your comments, and they are much appreciated. A revised version should be on its way :smallbiggrin:

Ilinoris
2014-05-24, 10:15 AM
Alright, here comes the revised version.


Requirements:
Base Attack Bonus: +10
Feats: Weapon Focus (with selected weapon)
Proficiency: Proficient in selected weapon.
Special: In order to pursue the path of the Ancestral Weapon, you must acquire a masterwork weapon that was used regularly by at least one of your deceased ancestors; all feat prerequisites must match the selected weapon.

Hit Dice: D10
http://i58.tinypic.com/2qslxcn.jpg
Class skills (2 + Int modifier per level): Climb, Concentration, Diplomacy, Handle Animal, Intimidate, Jump, Martial Lore, Ride, Sense Motive, Tumble.

Unity of Purpose (Su): The magic of the Ancestral Weapon is such that the weapon wants to remain whole and in its descendant's hand. Add the bearer's class level to opposed attack rolls to resist attempts to disarm the weapon from her. The weapon cannot be sundered while it is wielded by the bearer, though it can be damaged or even destroyed while unattended or in the hands of another.

Eternal Training (Ex): Each night, your ancestor's spirit enter your mind. Instead of the usual 8 hours of sleep, you are able to reduce this to a 4 hour meditative trance, in which you spar with your ancestor's spirit. Once per day, you can draw upon this nightly training to aid you in a single battle. You gain an insight bonus equal to your Wisdom bonus (if any) on attack rolls and damage rolls for a number of rounds equal to half your Wisdom modifier(minimum 1). You gain an additional use per day of this ability at 4th, 6th, 8th, and 10th level. Even if you have multiple uses of this ability per day, you can use this ability only once per encounter. You can use this ability only while you are wielding your Ancestral Weapon.

Greater Unity (Su): By 5th level, whenever the weapon is separated from the bearer, she can sense its direction by concentrating for a full round. She cannot sense the weapon if it lies on another plane.

Island in Time (Ex): At 10th level, you can throw yourself into a fight under your Ancestor Spirit's careful direction. You meld with it, allowing it to control your actions while you draw upon its vast combat experience. Once per encounter, you can take your turn as an immediate action. Using this ability does not change your initiative count, and you can use all your actions as normal. For example, if your initiative count is 15, you could act normally, use this ability to act again on initiative count 14, then act normally on the following round on initiative count 15. If you lose access to your Ancestral Weapon, you lose this ability until it returns.

Spirit of the Ancestor (Su): As the bearer learns to channel her ancestor, the previous owner's spirit comes to reside in the weapon itself.
Ancestral Weapon (Su): Starting at 1st level, the bearer learns to use her heirloom weapon as a channel for the spirit of her dead ancestor, granting the object increasing magical power as the bearer advances and achieves deeper levels of meditation. The maximum power of the enchantment is equal to half her class level, so that at 2nd level, she can grant her weapon a +1 enhancement bonus, while at 10th level, she could enchant it with powers up to the cost equivalent of +5.
The process for awakening the ancestor spirit is actually a quite simple one.
The wielder must find a quite, safe spot to spend 24 hours paying homage to her ancestors. At the end of the session, the wielder sacrifices a number of experience points, essentially sacrificing her own power to awaken her ancestors spirit's power.
Each time the Wielder wishes to increase the power of her ancestral weapon, she must spend 24 hours at a shrine(or other quiet and safe spot) paying homage to her ancestors.
Use the following table to determine XP cost and class level limits.
http://i61.tinypic.com/1zbxonn.jpg
**The XP cost presented here assumes that the weapon being imbued does not already have an enhancement bonus. If it does, the cost to imbue it with additional power is reduced. For instance, if a kensai has a +1 longswordand wants to imbue it with the power to be a +3 longsword, he may do so by paying the difference in XP cost between creating a +1 weapon and a +3 weapon (360 minus 40, or 320 XP).

If the ritual is interrupted, it can be begun again at any time, but it must run for a full 24 hours for the signature weapon to be imbued. The wielder pays the XP cost as soon as the ritual has been completed.

If the weapon used to fulfill the "Special" prerequisite for this class is already magical, the bearer may not further enhance the weapon's power until her class level exceeds its current total "plusses". The bearer may only have one Ancestral Weapon at a time.

If the Ancestral Weapon is destroyed, only the current wielder can repair it. If enough if left of the weapon to salvage (the shattered shards of a sword, for example), the wielder can reforge the weapon as if he were using the Craft (weaponsmithing) skill to make a masterwork weapon. If he takes the reforged weapon and then meditates for 24 hours, he may pay the appropriate XP cost to restore his weapon to full strenght.
Should nothing remain of the weapon the wielder must locate another heirloom that belonged to one or more of her ancestors and begin the process anew. If the new weapon belonged to a different ancestor, the DM is free to have a different spirit possess it.

Starting at 2nd level, the Ancestral Weapon becomes an intelligent magical item; the bearer does not need to spend any time, money, or XP for this metamorphosis to occur. The ancestor has difficulty manifesting its will at first, but as the bearer continues her meditations and follows the path of the weapon, the spirit gains in power. Eventually, the weapon takes on the full personality and memories of the ancestor. The bearer presumably attempts to contact an ancestor of similar tendencies as her own; the spirit's alignment is thus always within one step of that of the bearer herself. However, the ancestor may have its own ideas on how to solve problems, and might even attempt to take control of the bearer if their views differ sharply on an issue. The weapon's Ego score is equal to that of a weapon with the sum of its accumulated powers. The DM should fully detail the ancestor's history and personality as he or she would any NPC, and play them appropriately.

The spirit of the ancestor gains the following powers:
Empathy (Su): Starting at 2nd level, the weapon can communicate via empathy, pulsing or throbbing to indicate approval or dissent while the bearer wields it.
Speech (Su): By 4th level, the spirit learns to speak aloud, learning one language per point of Intelligence bonus. The spirit always speaks common.
Semi-telepathy (Su): At 8th level, the Ancestral Spirit becomes able to communicate via telepathy, and can communicate with its wielder silently, as long as the wielder is touching her weapon. Either the bearer or the sword can initiate telepathic communication as a free action.
Senses (Ex): As the spirit becomes more adept at channeling itself through the heirloom, its ability to perceive the world increases. Its vision and hearing ranges increase, and eventually evolves Blindsense and Darkvision.
Ability Scores (Ex): The spirit of the weapon begins at 2nd level with two mental ability scores of 12 and one of 10; the DM allocates these between Intelligence, Wisdom, and Charisma as he sees fit.


PEACH! :smallbiggrin:

andreichekov
2014-05-31, 05:06 PM
Why is Eternal Training limited in daily use? First off, is it eternal or not? And, you get it at level 12, and so, it would be just fine if you just gave a bonus to attack and damage rolls based on wisdom all the time.

Greater Unity should just summon the weapon. YOu are level 15. Sensing the weapon sounds like level 4

Island in time is really super cool.

You have a requirement of base attack bonus +10. You should be able to grant the +X abilities to your weapon much sooner than what you have here. You could buy a weapon that is better than your ancestral weapon, which makes this class a waste of time. You should make it a +1 bonus per level. Then there is a reason to take the class. Or otherwise, someone might take the class for the ancestral weapon as a scouting item, and not fight with it.

As for maneuvers go, just say "+1 level of existing maneuvers and stances", and if you can't then you get pick a martial class and use its technique to begin getting your maneuvers.

Why no Swim? And what about this class requires it to have only 2 skill points? Also, wouldn't you need Knowledge history and Appraise to recognize one's ancestral masterwork weapon? And if so, shouldn't they be class skills?

Ilinoris
2014-05-31, 05:13 PM
Why is Eternal Training limited in daily use? First off, is it eternal or not? And, you get it at level 12, and so, it would be just fine if you just gave a bonus to attack and damage rolls based on wisdom all the time.

Greater Unity should just summon the weapon. YOu are level 15. Sensing the weapon sounds like level 4

Island in time is really super cool.

You have a requirement of base attack bonus +10. You should be able to grant the +X abilities to your weapon much sooner than what you have here. You could buy a weapon that is better than your ancestral weapon, which makes this class a waste of time. You should make it a +1 bonus per level. Then there is a reason to take the class. Or otherwise, someone might take the class for the ancestral weapon as a scouting item, and not fight with it.

As for maneuvers go, just say "+1 level of existing maneuvers and stances", and if you can't then you get pick a martial class and use its technique to begin getting your maneuvers.

Why no Swim? And what about this class requires it to have only 2 skill points? Also, wouldn't you need Knowledge history and Appraise to recognize one's ancestral masterwork weapon? And if so, shouldn't they be class skills?

Greater Unity and Eternal Training will return to the workshop.

The reason for the "weak" magical weapon is that I'm currently running low-to none- magic campaign, which actually makes this real good. Alternatively, replace the table with the one from Kensai PrC.

The reason for not writing "+1 level of existing maneuvers and stances" is that PrC's from ToB actually gain maneuvers and stances faster than the average ToB base classes. Also, I've yet to see a PrC use this formular.

Hmm. I have considered revising the skills, although I did not feel this class was supposed to be the big skill monkey. Skills will be revised :smallsmile:

Feedback much appreciated! :smallbiggrin:

andreichekov
2014-05-31, 05:58 PM
The reason for not writing "+1 level of existing maneuvers and stances" is that PrC's from ToB actually gain maneuvers and stances faster than the average ToB base classes. Also, I've yet to see a PrC use this formular.

It is okay to do something new. The PRCs are also very limited in what they can choose for maneuvers and stances.

Ilinoris
2014-06-04, 06:04 AM
Here comes some revised pieces.



http://i59.tinypic.com/sw2txg.jpg
Class skills (4 + Int modifier per level): Climb, Concentration, Diplomacy, Handle Animal, Intimidate, Jump, Knowledge (history), Martial Lore, Profession, Ride, Sense Motive, Swim, Tumble.

Eternal Training (Ex): Each night, your ancestor's spirit enter your mind. Instead of the usual 8 hours of sleep, you are able to reduce this to a 4 hour meditative trance, in which you spar with your ancestor's spirit. You draw upon this nightly training to aid you in combat. You gain an insight bonus equal to your Wisdom bonus (if any) on attack rolls and damage. You can use this ability only while you are wielding your Ancestral Weapon.

Greater Unity (Su): By 5th level, whenever the weapon is separated from the bearer, she can sense its direction by concentrating for a full round. Additionally, by concentrating for another full round she is able to use Scrying on her Ancestral Weapon, ignoring all casting components. The Wielder is able to see and hear everything within 10 feet of her Ancestral Weapon, and is treated as touching the weapon for the duration. (Meaning Semi-telepathy works from 8th level.) The Scrying can be maintained for a number of rounds equal to her Wisdom bonus.
She cannot sense the weapon if it lies on another plane.

Added a few skills, and bumped skill points to 4 instead of 2.
Eternal Training and Greater Unity now feel more like they're level 10+ abilities.
Also, the class now gains an additional stance at 10th level.

andreichekov
2014-06-04, 10:17 PM
I really like the new greater unity.

Someone steals your weapon, and you use it to spy on them :D then you crash the cultist trying to summon a demon party, as you get your weapon back.

Ilinoris
2014-06-05, 11:04 AM
I really like the new greater unity.

Someone steals your weapon, and you use it to spy on them :D then you crash the cultist trying to summon a demon party, as you get your weapon back.

I was considering putting a greater limit on the Scrying, considering you could just keep restarting it as it is now.
Thoughts?

andreichekov
2014-06-05, 05:24 PM
You should just leave it as it is. Right now, it does it's job, and has some weird, but not op, utility in it. If you really want to throw away your class abilities and plant your weapon on a subject to chase them, then you lose basically all of your class powers.