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RPGaddict28
2014-05-23, 08:48 PM
I'm playing a PF game, starting at 1, and I want to know what the best race LA0 race is for wizard, with all non-third party 3.5 and Pathfinder materials. Right now I'm thinking about Gray Elf.

Angelalex242
2014-05-23, 08:51 PM
In PF, Tieflings don't have a level adjustment anymore. +2 int, +2 Dex, -2 Cha should serve you well.

Kudaku
2014-05-23, 09:21 PM
Peri-blooded aasimar isn't too shabby at +2 INT, +2 CHA.
Humans are, as always, pretty darn awesome at everything.

Biffoniacus_Furiou
2014-05-23, 10:11 PM
Venerable Dragonwrought Desert Kobold (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/variant/races/environmentalRacialVariants.htm#desertKobolds) gets Str -4, Dex +2, Int +3, Wis +1, Cha +3, and all the expanded Kobold traits (http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/we/20060420a). You can get the Spellhoarding mental disorder and associated template from Dragon magazine 313, which gives additional ability modifiers, Scribe Scroll and Eschew Materials for free (use this Wizard variant (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/variant/classes/variantCharacterClasses.htm#wizard) to replace Scribe Scroll with Improved Initiative), you copy your spells onto your scales instead of in a spellbook so there's no risk of losing it, you can counterspell and sacrifice a gem to add the countered spell to your spellhoard and be able to cast it from now on even if it's not on the Wizard spell list, and other benefits. Spellhoarding also converts Sorcerer spellcasting to Wizard spellcasting of equal level, so you can use the Greater Draconic Rite of Passage (http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/we/20060420a) to add +1 level to your Wizard spellcasting. If your DM agrees that Kobolds are true dragons (per Dragon Magic p87, the most recent authority on the matter), you could start with the Loredrake archetype to gain another +2 levels of converted Wizard spellcasting.

Gildedragon
2014-05-23, 10:13 PM
Do you count Dragon Magazine as third party or not (cause it was published by Paizo and was pretty key to 3.5)
If you don't: Athasian Human is GREAT, albeit with a +1 la, but PF seems to have docked 1 la from everything...
and arcane gnome is pretty good as well

If you do: Alethian Dwarves (+con and int!) and deep imaskari (like elves but no con penalty)

These are of course presuming you are going PF specialist, not generalist
because elf for elven generalist is pretty good

Then this Drow (http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/sp/20040213a) seems more toothsome +2 dex and int, -2 con. no other penalties and some SLAs

Gildedragon
2014-05-23, 10:16 PM
Greater Draconic Rite of Passage (http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/we/20060420a) to add +1 level to your Wizard spellcasting. If your DM agrees that Kobolds are true dragons (per Dragon Magic p87, the most recent authority on the matter), you could start with the Loredrake archetype to gain another +2 levels of converted Wizard spellcasting.
It doesn't add to your wizard spellcasting though. It explicitly acts as if you
"[gained] one level in the sorcerer class." Even if you can use the dragon templates

Biffoniacus_Furiou
2014-05-23, 10:28 PM
It doesn't add to your wizard spellcasting though. It explicitly acts as if you
"[gained] one level in the sorcerer class." Even if you can use the dragon templates

Spellhoarding converts any Sorcerer spellcasting capability you have or gain to equal levels of Wizard spellcasting capability. Just like if a Spellhoarding Juvenile Red Dragon ages to Young Adult, instead of gaining two more levels of Sorcerer spellcasting he would instead gain two levels of Wizard spellcasting due to Spellhoarding converting it. The same goes for the Greater Draconic Rite of Passage, if you have Spellhoarding it gives you a level of Wizard spellcasting.

Gildedragon
2014-05-23, 10:48 PM
Spellhoarding converts any Sorcerer spellcasting capability you have or gain to equal levels of Wizard spellcasting capability. Just like if a Spellhoarding Juvenile Red Dragon ages to Young Adult, instead of gaining two more levels of Sorcerer spellcasting he would instead gain two levels of Wizard spellcasting due to Spellhoarding converting it. The same goes for the Greater Draconic Rite of Passage, if you have Spellhoarding it gives you a level of Wizard spellcasting.

Nope.
GDRP acts as if you took a level in sorcerer.

Or are you saying that a dual classed sorceror 5 /wizard 5/ultimate magus 10 becomes a wizard 27 if they become spellhoarding? better argument than appeal to absurdity:

It changes the spellcasting, but it does not say such (converted) wizard casting stacks with wizard levels, as dragon sorcerer casting does not stack with sorcerer class levels.
Monsters with innate casting that stacks with class levels says so.

Biffoniacus_Furiou
2014-05-23, 11:39 PM
Nope.
GDRP acts as if you took a level in sorcerer.

Or are you saying that a dual classed sorceror 5 /wizard 5/ultimate magus 10 becomes a wizard 27 if they become spellhoarding? better argument than appeal to absurdity:

It changes the spellcasting, but it does not say such (converted) wizard casting stacks with wizard levels, as dragon sorcerer casting does not stack with sorcerer class levels.
Monsters with innate casting that stacks with class levels says so.

I'm going to disagree with you there. If a Juvenile Red Dragon takes a level of Sorcerer, it can cast spells as a Sorcerer 4. You'll need to give a book and page reference if you're going to say otherwise. If that same dragon were a Spellhoarding dragon, it would instead cast spells as a Wizard 4, even with that level of Sorcerer. If that dragon were to gain a level of Wizard, it would cast spells as a Wizard 5. Your assertion that racial spellcasting levels don't stack with class levels of the same name requires a RAW reference before it will convince anyone.

Gildedragon
2014-05-24, 12:15 AM
I'm going to disagree with you there. If a Juvenile Red Dragon takes a level of Sorcerer, it can cast spells as a Sorcerer 4. You'll need to give a book and page reference if you're going to say otherwise. If that same dragon were a Spellhoarding dragon, it would instead cast spells as a Wizard 4, even with that level of Sorcerer. If that dragon were to gain a level of Wizard, it would cast spells as a Wizard 5. Your assertion that racial spellcasting levels don't stack with class levels of the same name requires a RAW reference before it will convince anyone.

You are right.

There is something iffy of the spellhoarding template being applied to Class Levels, but yeah... it transforms sorcerer casting into wizard casting, and essentially forbids any sorcerer leveling until it is cured.

Kurald Galain
2014-05-24, 04:11 AM
I'm playing a PF game, starting at 1, and I want to know what the best race LA0 race is for wizard, with all non-third party 3.5 and Pathfinder materials. Right now I'm thinking about Gray Elf.

Samsaran.

You get to pick the five best arcane spells you can find and add them to your wizard list. That includes any Witch or Bard spell, of any level, that wizards don't normally get.
Also, you get to add two skills to your class skills, such as perception, and of course you get +2 to intelligence.

Erik Vale
2014-05-24, 04:41 AM
I'll expand upon that with at any level. You could add 5 level 9 spells to your list should you so chose.

Gemini476
2014-05-24, 06:46 AM
I'm playing a PF game, starting at 1, and I want to know what the best race LA0 race is for wizard, with all non-third party 3.5 and Pathfinder materials. Right now I'm thinking about Gray Elf.

Although it isn't as awesome as it is for spontaneous casters, Half-Elf is a pretty good choice because of Paragon Surge.
Although if you aren't going for Eldritch Heritage then you can get the spell as a Human as well, which is probably better for a Wizard. Or an Aasimar, IIRC, although I'm not sure about that.

Aasimar also gets you early entry into a bunch of PrCs due to it's SLAs, which is pretty awesome.