Githzerai (or was it Githyanki?) Silver Sword questions

[atemu1234]

In the original Monster Manual, I noticed that one of the Giths carry silver swords with an antipsionic ability. My question is, since we run psionics, can this be used on anything that can use psionics? Because then it's not just a +1 enhancement. Then it's gamebreaking against any combat-based psionics-user. A Psychic Warrior becomes weaker than a fighter. A psion becomes a commoner with good will saves. Was this ever errata'd?

[PraxisVetli]

That's not even close to what a Silver Sword does. They use it on the Astral Plane, to cut the Silver Cords of travelers.

[atemu1234]

That's not even close to what a Silver Sword does. They use it on the Astral Plane, to cut the Silver Cords of travelers.


A target hit by the weapon must succeed on a DC 17 Fortitude save or lose any psionic abilities for 1d4 rounds.

Funny, that seems to be fairly explicit.

[Doc_Maynot]

Wait, with transparency would that also stop spellcasting?

The default rule for the interaction of psionics and magic is simple: Powers interact with spells and spells interact with powers in the same way a spell or normal spell-like ability interacts with another spell or spell-like ability. This is known as psionics-magic transparency.

Psionics-Magic Transparency
Though not explicitly called out in the spell descriptions or magic item descriptions, spells, spell-like abilities, and magic items that could potentially affect psionics do affect psionics.

When the rule about psionics-magic transparency is in effect, it has the following ramifications.

Spell resistance is effective against powers, using the same mechanics. Likewise, power resistance is effective against spells, using the same mechanics as spell resistance. If a creature has one kind of resistance, it is assumed to have the other. (The effects have similar ends despite having been brought about by different means.)

All spells that dispel magic have equal effect against powers of the same level using the same mechanics, and vice versa.

The spell detect magic detects powers, their number, and their strength and location within 3 rounds (though a Psicraft check is necessary to identify the discipline of the psionic aura).

Dead magic areas are also dead psionics areas.

[Urpriest]

Funny, that seems to be fairly explicit.

That said, the "+1 enhancement" part isn't. That affects how much it costs to enhance it, but the base price may be higher as well. IIRC, in 3.0 Silver Swords were artifacts, even if you can enhance them now that doesn't stop them from being prohibitively expensive.

That said, it's a powerful ability for +1, if not crazy, due to the non-scaling save DC and short duration. Compare to Paralyzing and Stunning Surge. It's better than Paralyzing, but arguably comparable to Stunning Surge given that it doesn't scale.

[atemu1234]

That said, the "+1 enhancement" part isn't. That affects how much it costs to enhance it, but the base price may be higher as well. IIRC, in 3.0 Silver Swords were artifacts, even if you can enhance them now that doesn't stop them from being prohibitively expensive.

That said, it's a powerful ability for +1, if not crazy, due to the non-scaling save DC and short duration. Compare to Paralyzing and Stunning Surge. It's better than Paralyzing, but arguably comparable to Stunning Surge given that it doesn't scale.


A normal githyanki silver sword is treated as having a +2 enhancement for this purpose: +1 for its bonus on attack and damage rolls and another +1 for the sword’s antipsionic ability.

That also seems fairly explicit. Were they really artifacts? Either way, this is a 3.5 copy, I believe.

[137beth]

It allows a save with a nonscaling, low DC. At the level at which that kind of save is relevant, a caster/psion can get away with a crossbow for one encounter.
Compare it to color spray, which completely disables its target at this level, but can hit several creatures and works on noncasters too.

Either way, I don't think it is a problem if there is an effect which briefly disables casters and psions but not martial characters. There are already effects which permanently harm martial characters (sunder/shatter).

[Urpriest]

That also seems fairly explicit. Were they really artifacts? Either way, this is a 3.5 copy, I believe.

Like I said, that just says it's enhanced like a +2 weapon. It may also have a high static cost, which wouldn't affect further costs to enhance it.

As to the artifact-ness, having checked it looks like that only applied to the high-end models.

[Mikeavelli]

Silver Swords are... complicated.

In 2E, which is their first appearance that I'm aware of, they would cut the astral cord of Astrally projecting travelers on the Astral Plane. Mechanically, if you were Astrally Projecting, it was a Save or Die for every hit, so quite powerful. One of very few things in the game that would do that. There was a +3 version and a +5 version, they weren't artifacts, but they were considered special holy objects by the Githyanki, who would go to any length to retrieve one that had been lost or stolen.

In the main campaign of Neverwinter Nights II, the Silver Sword was an Artifact from the Githyanki which also had the power to destroy the Shadow Lord for some reason. This is the only adventure I'm aware of where it's a full-fledged artifact, rather than just a powerful sword special to the Gith.

The current 3.5 Silver Sword is what's being discussed in this thread, with moderate anti-psionic capabilities.

As pointed out already, the nonscaling DC makes it a fairly trivial threat, even if it's applied transparently to casters as well.

[Vhaidara]

In the main campaign of Neverwinter Nights II, the Silver Sword was an Artifact from the Githyanki which also had the power to destroy the Shadow Lord for some reason. This is the only adventure I'm aware of where it's a full-fledged artifact, rather than just a powerful sword special to the Gith.

I think the basis was the ability to strike both on the material and an extraplanar aspect (Astral/Shadow). Also, that wasn't just a Silver Sword, that was Gith's Silver Sword, Gith being to the Githyanki roughly what George Washington is to America.

[Gemini476]

I think the basis was the ability to strike both on the material and an extraplanar aspect (Astral/Shadow). Also, that wasn't just a Silver Sword, that was Gith's Silver Sword, Gith being to the Githyanki roughly what George Washington is to America.

Weren't the Gith just the original race before the Githzerai/Githyanki split? Or do I have that confused?

[atemu1234]

Weren't the Gith just the original race before the Githzerai/Githyanki split? Or do I have that confused?

I said one of the Gith races. As in, each starting with Gith-. This means githzerai and/or githyanki.

[Vhaidara]

They were, named for their leader Gith who led them out of slavery (I believe under mind flayers).

[malonkey1]

Weren't the Gith just the original race before the Githzerai/Githyanki split? Or do I have that confused?

They were the Gith, named for Gith, as he was their first major representative, and led the rebellion against the Illithid.