Brazil 2014 FIFA World Cup [Archive] - Giant in the Playground Forums

Cicciograna

2014-06-11, 04:21 PM

I'm aware that on these boards football is not the favourite sport, but...so, World Cup!

Who are you going to root for? I'm from Italy, but don't really share Prandelli's ideas for the team: I'd give more room to Immobile and Insigne, as they're clearly better than Cassano and Balotelli.
At the same time, the middlefielders are quite good, with Pirlo who's always one of the most formidable players in the world, and Verratti, who made a great season in PSG; the defenders are taken almost entirely from Juventus, and those that follow the italian league know that they can be a bit...rough, to use an euphemism. I really hope that Insigne will see the field a lot, he's from Napoli (the team) and from Napoli (the city) :smallwink:

So, given that my primary team is Napoli, I'll follow (almost) every country featuring a player from my team: first and foremost Belgium (Mertens), which can be the surprise of this World Cup; then Argentina (Higuain and Fernandez), and not only for the players from Napoli, but also because it is the country that gave births to Maradona, which is almost worshipped as a god here in Napoli.
Then we have Spain (Reina and Albiol), Colombia (Zuniga), Brazil (Henrique), Algeria (Ghoulam) and finally Switzerland (Inler, Dzemaili and Behrami), in that order.

So, then, who're you going to support?

SaintRidley

2014-06-11, 08:03 PM

It's all about Germany with a side order of Spain for me.

GPuzzle

2014-06-11, 08:36 PM

As a person born, raised and living in Brazil, I can safely say that's been a mixed bag so far.

Two Mexican turists were almost robbed, and they would've been had not the own turist nearly bitchslapped the robbers.

There's been a lot of traffic (as in, a lot of traffic for São Paulo, which means a LOT) and you can't watch a TV channel without them going on and on about the World Cup.

Tommorow's the big game, so it's a holiday. In other words, no school, no (or nearly no) business open... Yay, more chaos.

It ain't that bad, I'm actually quite excited for the World Cup (goddamn Uruguyans, stealing our World Cups!) - I'm even going to watch a quarterfinal in Brasilia!

But sure as heck, with the mixed bags of complaints and chaos from all directions, it's not going to be perfect.

Also, Brazil wins 2x0 vs Croatia.

Scarlet Knight

2014-06-11, 08:59 PM

I'm an American of Italian decent.

I went to buy a new USA shirt for tomorrow, and saw all these lonely Landon Donovan jerseys on the rack.....way to go Coach Jurgen!

I guess my Italian jersey ( the one I always wait to break out until the Americans get eliminated) will have to do.

Cristo Meyers

2014-06-11, 09:05 PM

I'm an American of Italian decent.

I went to buy a new USA shirt for tomorrow, and saw all these lonely Landon Donovan jerseys on the rack.....way to go Coach Jurgen!

No kidding...I think my facepalm at hearing that was so hard it registered on the Richter Scale...:smallsigh:

I guess my Italian jersey ( the one I always wait to break out until the Americans get eliminated) will have to do.

Yeah, I'll be surprised if we make it out of group this time: Ghana, Portugal, and Germany? Even beating one of those teams would be a tall order. I mean, they're the home team and they've got my support, but we are so boned.

GPuzzle

2014-06-11, 09:07 PM

Costa Rica's in deep trouble, though.

Uruguay, Italy and England... That's very tough.

rlc

2014-06-11, 09:15 PM

All i have to say is that it would be hilarious if usa ever won the world cup because none of us would know the difference.

Cristo Meyers

2014-06-11, 10:13 PM

All i have to say is that it would be hilarious if usa ever won the world cup because none of us would know the difference.

I dunno. We'd pick up on it pretty quick if it ever happened, I think. A lot of people started noticing when our women's team made it to the finals in 2012. Sure, going to the finals wasn't a surprise to anyone that knew better, but still.

rlc

2014-06-11, 10:19 PM

To this day, i still had no idea that happened.

Killer Angel

2014-06-12, 05:59 AM

Jon_Dahl

2014-06-12, 05:59 AM

I'm going to watch all the games.
I'm happy that I don't have anything or anyone to disturb me this time.

GPuzzle

2014-06-12, 06:29 AM

It's hard to say who'll be the favourite.

American teams generally do well in America (Uruguay won in 1930 and 1950, which were in Uruguay and Brazil, Brazil won in Chile, Mexico and the US in 1962, 1970 and 1994, Argentina won in Argentina and Mexico in 1978 and 1986), and Mexico has a tendency to go to the 2nd round but not much after that.

On the other hand, Netherlands, Spain, Germany, Italy, France, Portugal and England are very strong, so it's tough to say who'll go the quarterfinals.

If Costa Rica goes to the next phase, we'll be eating our own shoes.

Cicciograna

2014-06-12, 08:23 AM

My dear countryman, history is against us.
Italy plays the final every 12 years, alternating victories and debates (against Brazil).
Mexico '70: Brasil - Italy
Spain '82: Italy - Germany
USA '94: Italy - Brazil
Germany 2006: Italy - France

So, we'll have to wait at least 'til 2018. :smalltongue:

Interesting numbers. However, this year we'll already be lucky just to qualify to the next stage: England and Uruguay are bad beasts, and unfortunately our team has a long history of having an hard time against "lesser" teams, so we'll have to keep an eye on Costa Rica too. Ours is probabily one of the most balanced groups, there's no team that stands among the others.

GPuzzle

2014-06-12, 08:45 AM

Some are very unbalanced, some are very boring, and then there's Group D.

KuReshtin

2014-06-12, 08:54 AM

Not knowing a whole lot about the current form of teams and really not very interested, I still entered the office (well, one of them) prediction pools and came up with the following:

Group winners: Spain, Greece, Italy, France, Portugal, Brazil, Argentina and Russia.

I came to this result by very scientifically just looking at the countries playing each other in each game and putting random scores down based on, well, nothing.

My picks would create the following second round pairings:
Brazil - Netherlands
Greece - England
Spain - Croatia
Italy - Colombia
France - Nigeria
Portugal - South Korea
Argentina - Honduras
Russia - USA

In the second round, it seems I had all the designated home teams win, and in the quarter finals Brazil, Argentina, Portugal and Spain going through to the semis, where Argentina would beat Spain and Portugal beating Brazil to get to the finals, where Argentina wins the championship and Brazil beating Spain to grab the bronze.

Wholly unscientific and based solely on hunches on my part. At one point, I had Japan ending up in the group stages with three 1-1 draws. That looked a bit silly, though, so I changed those results a bit.

Aedilred

2014-06-12, 09:38 AM

For the first time in at least twenty years, I haven't been able to muster a huge amount of enthusiasm for this World Cup, for some reason, but I daresay I'll watch much of it. I think I became jaded by the last few major international tournaments, the ridiculous dominance of Spain (even if they are "my" team) and football that ranged from high-quality but dull to turgid and painful. So I haven't studied form, followed the build-up, really even looked at the squad lists in any detail.

Still, I will support Spain, because I have done for ages, and England, albeit I won't be too sorry when they're inevitably knocked out by a better team or on penalties. I will probably retain Uruguay as a tertiary team, and if Germany and the Netherlands have retained some of their previous flair (given I gather van Gaal is coaching the Dutch, I'd hope so) then I will enjoy watching them. I imagine Brazil will also be worth a watch. Other than that I'll take it as it comes.

Under normal circumstances I'd say Brazil were nailed-on favourites given the location and timing, but the last WC pretty much obliterated arguments from historical precedent, so really it could be anyone. Or at least, anyone good.

Cicciograna

2014-06-12, 12:43 PM

Look at my balcony! :smallwink:

https://scontent-a-mxp.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-xpa1/t1.0-9/q71/s720x720/10447771_718325474880324_2656965044182655761_n.jpg

TheTyrantis

2014-06-12, 02:33 PM

Group winners: Spain, Greece, Italy, France, Portugal, Brazil, Argentina and Russia.

I came to this result by very scientifically just looking at the countries playing each other in each game and putting random scores down based on, well, nothing.

My picks would create the following second round pairings:
Brazil - Netherlands
Greece - England
Spain - Croatia
Italy - Colombia
France - Nigeria
Portugal - South Korea
Argentina - Honduras
Russia - USA

You left off Germany making the Round of 16? That's just criminal, but you said you didn't really pay attention to much so I'll let it slide.

I'm a USA supporter, but I have no delusions about how far we'll go. If we make it out of the group, I'll call that a success and everything after is a bonus. I saw the Ghana friendly against South Korea and they just dominated, same when Portugal played the Republic of Ireland and they both looked good. Yes, there's a bit of a gap in play style and talent, but it was still worrying to see Ghana win 4-0 and Portugal 5-1 when we could barely get 2 goals in each of our friendlies leading up to the World Cup.

My Round of 16 prediction is:
Brazil - Netherlands
Colombia - England
France - Bosnia & Herzegovina
Germany - South Korea
Spain - Croatia
Uruguay - Ivory Coast
Argentina - Switzerland
Belgium - USA

I've got Brazil lifting the trophy at the end against Spain, and they've certainly got a winning squad.

comicshorse

2014-06-12, 03:08 PM

England supporter here ( though I have very little hope for us actually getting anywhere )

GolemsVoice

2014-06-12, 03:56 PM

I'll support Germany, being a German, but I can't stop being so damn pessimistic. Our last games weren't all that stellar, even against "inferior" teams, and I fear that Germany will do what it did in the last two Championships. Play stellar until it counts and then forget what a ball looks like.

Still, I'd not say no to winning the cup. :smallbiggrin:

Irk

2014-06-12, 03:57 PM

As an Italian myself, I suppose I'll just default to that team. However, I can't say I follow soccer as intensely as I ought to, so I'm not really sure.

Look at my balcony! :smallwink:
*sigh* I wish they cared as much where I am now.

Ellye

2014-06-12, 04:11 PM

I'm cheering for Uruguay again this year.

TheTyrantis

2014-06-12, 04:59 PM

Brazil wins the opener 3-1, but really should have ended 2-1. That penalty the ref gave was as soft as a box of fluffy kittens.

Mrc.

2014-06-12, 05:02 PM

Firstly, congrats to Brazil on a 3-1 win! Secondly, as an Englishman it's been a weird build-up. Normally, the England team is atrocious, the English media is full of "We can win this" and the rest of the world correctly writes us off. This time, the team is halfway decent, the media are all "No chance" and the rest of the world label us Dark Horses. What's going on?

Cicciograna

2014-06-12, 05:02 PM

Okay, after this first match I think I'll leave the thread. I care too much for my presence on this forum to be banned for excess of profanity.

GPuzzle

2014-06-12, 05:10 PM

Oscar played an epic game, to say the truth. That penalty was so bad I think the referee needs a pair of glasses. But, hey, I'm not complaining.

England's in a pretty weird spot. I mean, there's Italy and Uruguay in the group, and if anyone doesn't win against Costa Rica, bam, they're out.

Slayn82

2014-06-12, 05:40 PM

SaintRidley

2014-06-12, 06:26 PM

DraPrime

2014-06-12, 06:40 PM

I'd cheer for Poland, but like fools we didn't qualify. Since that team is out I guess I have only one other country to seriously support...

USA! USA! USA! USA! USA!

Cristo Meyers

2014-06-12, 07:11 PM

And bad refereeing is off to a wonderful start. I daresay it'll win the Cup.

I can't wait until Monday. I've got another Germany supporter nearby, so she and I will be chilling at my place for every Germany game.

Same here. I've got Monday off to watch Portugal v Germany and US v Ghana.

Going to be a good day.

AtomicKitKat

2014-06-12, 07:22 PM

I'm betting on Argentina, though Maradona disappointed me a few years back. Not that I ever bother to watch any of the matches(and even less likely to now, given that it's at 3am my time).

Scarlet Knight

2014-06-12, 09:04 PM

Look at my balcony! :smallwink:

https://scontent-a-mxp.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-xpa1/t1.0-9/q71/s720x720/10447771_718325474880324_2656965044182655761_n.jpg

That's so cool!

As far as Italy's group, tradition dictates that Costa Rica, Uruguay, Italy and England will all finish tied with Uruguay & Italy sneaking through and England in mourning due to some arcane tie-breaker.

Arlion

2014-06-12, 10:31 PM

Betting on Argentina. It has potentially the best offensive of the cup,although it suffers a lot on defense. We also has Messi and one of the weakest groups (everyone could surprise us,tough...) . Its also my home-country :p

Ellye

2014-06-12, 10:44 PM

Well, as a fellow Brazilian, i'm on the complaining camp. Getting our second goal due to a bad call by the judge, when there are enormous LED monitors at the stadiums, is ridiculous, and soccer must implement a challenge rule, as even volleyball has implemented.Yeah...

Disregarding video footage, when said video footage is being broadcast live, instantly, in an large screen at the stadium...
This is making soccer look sillier and sillier.

TheTyrantis

2014-06-12, 11:57 PM

I wonder what Ref Miyagi saw from his position, though. He obviously saw some atrocious foul being committed, they can't all be MLS refs that call a penalty for anything (or the usual fixing theory).

KuReshtin

2014-06-13, 03:57 AM

You left off Germany making the Round of 16? That's just criminal, but you said you didn't really pay attention to much so I'll let it slide.

I didn't actually realise I'd left Germany out of the top 16, but going back through the results I put in (again, by randomly just putting in scores) I can see that I have the USA beating Germany 2-1, which would get the US through, and leaving Germany out. Portugal winning the group kind of makes sense, though. I think.

Ellye

2014-06-13, 11:39 AM

Fifa should really start using video footages...

This is getting just silly to watch, knowing that the official results are different from what they should have been.

GolemsVoice

2014-06-13, 12:28 PM

At least the goal didn't make the difference between victory or defeat, since Brazil won 3:1.

Killer Angel

2014-06-13, 01:41 PM

Brazil wins the opener 3-1, but really should have ended 2-1. That penalty the ref gave was as soft as a box of fluffy kittens.

Well, given that the third goal was after that generous penalty... :smallwink:

GolemsVoice

2014-06-13, 02:24 PM

Still beats winning 2:1 with the questionable goal, I guess.

TheTyrantis

2014-06-13, 03:40 PM

I'm confident I can say with 10 minutes left on the clock that Spain isn't coming back in this match. Good on the Dutchies for a nice match, not that Iker Casillas did much to stop the carnage.

Kobold-Bard

2014-06-13, 03:54 PM

Well that was....unexpected.

Good for you Dutch-folks.

Asta Kask

2014-06-13, 03:56 PM

Sweet merciful Thor, what the Hel happened to Spain?

dehro

2014-06-13, 04:48 PM

Sweet merciful Thor, what the Hel happened to Spain?

Dunno. Don't care. Too busy gloating.

As usual, I'll support both Italy and the Dutch team for as long as they manage to stay in the tournament. In case of a direct confrontation, if that's possible, I'd side with the Dutch who really deserve a win after 3 finals reached... And after tonight.
(also, if the Dutch win against the Italians, I get to mock my friends)
That said, I barely follow football in italy and don't know much about the younger players of that team, meaning I know next to nothing about any other player in the world who wasn't playing either in the last world cup or the European cup, so I have no way at all to even make an educated guess as to who will do well in this tournament

GPuzzle

2014-06-13, 04:52 PM

Spain should stop gloating and start winning. Lost in the Confederacies Cup, lost in the World Cup. They're not exactly "great", are they?

Cicciograna

2014-06-13, 05:09 PM

Literal curbstomping. Quite unexpected.

Cuthalion

2014-06-13, 06:48 PM

Germmaaaaaannnnnnnyyyyy!

Autopsibiofeeder

2014-06-13, 06:58 PM

Sweet merciful Thor, what the Hel happened to Spain?

The Netherlands happened, with a side-dish of revenge. Spain did not play bad per se, they just got ganked where they didn't see it coming.

GloatingSwine

2014-06-13, 07:32 PM

That's so cool!

As far as Italy's group, tradition dictates that Costa Rica, Uruguay, Italy and England will all finish tied with Uruguay & Italy sneaking through and England in mourning due to some arcane tie-breaker.

Nah, England limp through the group stages, display a brief moment of competence in the round of 16 then get crushed in the quarter finals and act like we had a chance really.

That's what we do at world cups.

Aedilred

2014-06-13, 08:34 PM

Spain should stop gloating and start winning. Lost in the Confederacies Cup, lost in the World Cup. They're not exactly "great", are they?
Great teams still lose matches. In fact Spain have lost their opening match in previous years and still gone on to win comfortably. This was an outrageous scoreline, though. I'm torn between sorry I missed it and glad I wasn't there to see the carnage.

Killer Angel

2014-06-14, 02:30 AM

Literal curbstomping. Quite unexpected.

It was about time. :smalltongue:

But it's too early to consider Spain out of the game.

Cicciograna

2014-06-14, 03:14 AM

Great teams still lose matches. In fact Spain have lost their opening match in previous years and still gone on to win comfortably. This was an outrageous scoreline, though. I'm torn between sorry I missed it and glad I wasn't there to see the carnage.

4 out of 5 goal scored by Holland were absolutely gorgeous: if you can, watch some highlights and enjoy.

It was about time. :smalltongue:

But it's too early to consider Spain out of the game.

That's true, but now it's hard: Chile won't give up so easily, and Spain seemed way too under tone.
Were I Del Bosque, I'd swap Casillas for De Gea or Reina *wink wink*: Pepe is really in shape after a great season. Had played himself from the beginning, probabily the score would have been different: maybe the Spain would have lost altogether, but the passive would have been lesser. Or perhaps not, football is strange.

dehro

2014-06-14, 04:37 AM

I've heard people talk about Chile like it's a serious contender/opponent.
Is it, really?

Aedilred

2014-06-14, 04:47 AM

I've heard people talk about Chile like it's a serious contender/opponent.
Is it, really?
They're not one to be written off lightly. Their world ranking is higher than the Netherlands, and while the FIFA rankings can and do throw up some strange results, they have a respectable recent record, beating Uruguay and England in the last eighteen months and holding Spain to a draw.

Of course, there's a big gap between "a team to be taken seriously" and "a serious challenger for the title". They will do well to make it out of the group, and if they make even the quarter-finals that would be a big achievement - although part of that is down to the draw.

dehro

2014-06-14, 05:31 AM

cheers for the insight... I'm going to say that it will probably be up to them to kick Spain out of the game...if they can do it.
So far I'm most intrigued by the possibilities of the following matches:
a do-over of last time's final match, Holland Vs Spain... unlikely but if it ever came to it, it would be epic and no holds barred. Italy Vs Brazil, which is a potential quarter final or a final match, and Italy Vs Holland, also a quarter final or final match.

Cicciograna

2014-06-14, 05:41 AM

Meanwhile, in Westeros Brazil...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iytLTAD1oyg

dehro

2014-06-14, 05:52 AM

on a separate note:
https://media.zenfs.com/it-IT/blogs/the-rio-report/BqCctPxCUAEoSFS.jpg

batVan and Robben

FinnLassie

2014-06-14, 07:15 AM

Ok, I always root for Netherlands in these games, but daaaamn. 5-1? Did not see that one coming against Spain. At all. Was expecting something more intense result wise. Nevertheless, I'm happy.

ORANJE! :smallbiggrin:

GPuzzle

2014-06-14, 07:25 AM

Van Pierse became the Flying Dutchman that day.

Cicciograna

2014-06-14, 08:26 AM

Van Pierse became the Flying Dutchman that day.

One of the decerebrated italian speakers made the same pun.
Nothing that comes out of the mouths of the decerebrated italian speakers can be good.
Shame on you :smallbiggrin:

Aedilred

2014-06-14, 08:52 AM

TheFallenOne

2014-06-14, 09:10 AM

But it's too early to consider Spain out of the game.

Actually, Spain is in dire straits and may not advance even if they win both remaining group games because their goal difference is now messed up. Netherlands should achieve a comfortable victory against Australia and then they can afford to sit out their best players in the last game against Chile.

I think it is quite likely now that Chile, Netherlands and Spain will end up with a 6:6:6 points draw, with Netherlands and Chile advancing due to goal difference.

Aedilred

2014-06-14, 09:51 AM

At least they're not using that ridiculous head-to-head system for determining qualifiers they had in the Euros.

GPuzzle

2014-06-14, 11:19 AM

One of the decerebrated italian speakers made the same pun.
Nothing that comes out of the mouths of the decerebrated italian speakers can be good.
Shame on you :smallbiggrin:

Part of my family comes from Italy, what can I do?

The other part comes from Spain. Well, and Portugal too.

FinnLassie

2014-06-14, 11:42 AM

Referring to them as the Flying Dutchmen is an old one. I last remember hearing it in 2008, when they had a gloriously attacking style - and came utterly unstuck against (iirc) Russia, but I'd be very surprised if it hadn't been used before or since.

Oh man, I remember the Russia match. Wasn't Russia's coach originally Dutch? I remember being so butthurt watching the game, haha.

Ellye

2014-06-14, 11:49 AM

I've heard people talk about Chile like it's a serious contender/opponent.
Is it, really?While one could simplify things and say that Chile is stronger than Australia, but weaker than Spain and Netherlands, there are way too many variables in football.

One such variable, that will probably be important here, is that Chile has been on a roll. They had a good Qualifying season, they had good friendlies leading up to the World Cup, they just got a nice win over Australia; couple that will the fact that they just watched Spain, their next opponent, showing vulnerability and getting trashed... I'm guessing Chile will be fired up for their match against Spain, and morale is a powerful factor in pretty much everything, clearly including sports.

Aedilred

2014-06-14, 12:23 PM

Oh man, I remember the Russia match. Wasn't Russia's coach originally Dutch? I remember being so butthurt watching the game, haha.
Yeah, it was Guus Hiddink, iirc. I can't remember who was coaching the Dutch, probably van Basten.

Mrc.

2014-06-14, 04:18 PM

Yet another shock result! This world cup is getting good! With the possible exception of the first Van Persie goal none of them have been top drawer but there's been controversy and surprise. Long may it continue!

GPuzzle

2014-06-14, 04:22 PM

Dear Lord, what the hell is going on? Spain gets destructed, Uruguay loses to Costa Rica... All my what.

Ellye

2014-06-14, 06:56 PM

I support Uruguay, but... that 3-1 was totally deserved.

Uruguay was playing with a weirdly slow pace, and lacked the ability to bring the ball forward.
Costa Rica was much better than I expected.

TheTyrantis

2014-06-14, 06:57 PM

England looked really sketchy in the back against Italy. Shrek's gonna need to trek back to help defend next game, it didn't give them any advantages to stay forward as a winger.

Speaking of Rooney, the ball he took the corner with is probably floating in space with his penalty kick.

Irk

2014-06-14, 06:58 PM

Oh, I'm so excited! ITALIA!

Kobold-Bard

2014-06-14, 07:03 PM

Stupid English media, getting me excited and making me forget we have absolutely no chance.

Cicciograna

2014-06-14, 07:07 PM

GO ITALY!!! FORZA AZZURRI!!!

Good match against a great team: I didn't quite expect such an intensity on behalf of England, Sturridge and Sterling have been quite a pain in the ass, especially since Paletta didn't seem quite up to the role, and with Chiellini playing out of his usual position.
On Italy' side, great match from Candreva, Darmian and Sirigu, and that last free kick from Pirlo...

Aedilred

2014-06-14, 07:57 PM

Yeah, while England lost, I thought they actually played better and more optimistically than they have in many wins, so I'm not too disheartened (inasmuch as I retain any emotional investment in the England football team anyway; I gave up on them long ago). Uruguay really need to sharpen up. I didn't see the first hour or so of play, but on the highlights they looked reasonably in control for the first few passages of play then it went to pot. It looks like they really miss Suarez. Was Forlan effective at all?

Also, Google's new feature of showing a massive graphic of the final score whenever you enter a vaguely relevant search is not at all helpful when what you're looking for is a highlights video and don't want to know the score in advance. :smallsigh:

Cuthalion

2014-06-14, 10:49 PM

Ahhhahahah Spain squish them.

Cicciograna

2014-06-15, 04:08 AM

Uruguay really need to sharpen up. I didn't see the first hour or so of play, but on the highlights they looked reasonably in control for the first few passages of play then it went to pot. It looks like they really miss Suarez. Was Forlan effective at all?

After the goal (on penalty kick), Uruguay played very smugly, not caring to deal the definitive stroke and just administering the advantage, whereas the not so good Costa Rica, led by a really good Campbell, played its honest match becoming more and more aggressive up to the first goal. Then Uruguay completely lost its nuts.
Forlan was, simply put, completely useless.

Killer Angel

2014-06-15, 08:52 AM

Good match against a great team

Indeed, it was a pleasant surprise. :smallsmile:

Aedilred

2014-06-15, 10:22 AM

Prandelli has called England "one of the strongest teams at the World Cup". While there's obviously an element of victor's magnanimity there perhaps he does have a point, albeit mainly because other normally strong sides are unusually weak. Brazil have been tentative, Spain and Uruguay have been floored, and Germany are apparently not what they were two or four years ago. Of course we're yet to see Argentina (or Germany for that matter) in action, but on current evidence England look competitive.

dehro

2014-06-15, 11:22 AM

Not so sure that Prandelli's word should be taken at face value this time. After all Julius Caesar also praised the valour of the various tribes he faced... after he did so, to better enhance his victory

Cuthalion

2014-06-15, 11:43 AM

England looked much sharper than Italy, even though they lost.

comicshorse

2014-06-15, 01:00 PM

Aedilred

2014-06-15, 03:03 PM

Gotta say despite the defeat I was happy with England's performance. It seemed much more sharper and, vitally, much more positive than previous matches. I do wonder thought is Rooney really up to it ? I've never been much impressed by his performance at international level and this game did nothing to change that opinion
Yeah, I've got to agree. I actually feel much the same way (whisper it) about his close contemporary and best mate, Cristiano Ronaldo: they are/were both amazing talents, highly impressive at club level, gushed over by the media, and often effective in internationals (they're both at or near the top of the goalscoring list for their country), but they never quite replicate that in big competitions. Rooney hasn't really delivered for England in a finals competition for ten years, and (for all I think Ronaldo cost Portugal Euro 2004 in the final), I haven't really been impressed with him since over a similar period at a top international level.

France look fairly decent, although, like England, they appear to lack a cutting edge. My word, though, Honduras have played cynically so far. I was glad to see Pogba only got a yellow: for all Robbie Savage's ridiculous protestation from the pundit box, in context it was a sensible decision regardless of what the guidelines say.

Canuck617

2014-06-15, 10:21 PM

My picks would create the following second round pairings:
Brazil - Netherlands
Greece - England
Spain - Croatia
Italy - Colombia
France - Nigeria
Portugal - South Korea
Argentina - Honduras
Russia - USA

Your musings of a Russia - USA match-up intrigue me. Perhaps their respective leaders need to wager a little something on the game. :smalltongue:

I fear that Germany will do what it did in the last two Championships. Play stellar until it counts and then forget what a ball looks like.

Hahahahaha, too true!! They do this all the time, which frustrates me as a non-German to cheer for them. Some mention that they play too technical and too lacking of emotion in the later stages. I'll be watching them closely again Portugal, but we won't know for sure until they smash the competition and put themselves in a position to play keep away against a top team while the other team plays football.

Actually, Spain is in dire straits and may not advance even if they win both remaining group games because their goal difference is now messed up. Netherlands should achieve a comfortable victory against Australia and then they can afford to sit out their best players in the last game against Chile.

I think it is quite likely now that Chile, Netherlands and Spain will end up with a 6:6:6 points draw, with Netherlands and Chile advancing due to goal difference.

I'm not so sure Holland would sit their guys against Chile if it came to it, as the difference would be getting Brazil in the Knockout Stage as opposed to being on the other side of the bracket completely and drawing Mexico at worst. Also, Australia gave Chile a run for quite a while. In addition, that game was probably the worst officiated game so far, and yes, that includes the first game. I would have sworn that the refs were racist against Australia, the reffing was so bad. Having said that, Spain is not nearly as bad as many are making them out to be. I still think they'll get out of the group and will face Brazil in the Round of 16, which would be HUGE!!!

Moreover, I think England looked good against Italy as well, but Pirlo was too much for them, which is more a statement about how much I admire Pirlo than it was a knock against the rest of the Italian squad. England ran out of steam in the latter stages of the game, but I know they'll be a good side for years to come. (Random aside, I was intending to type "I think" but I typed "I know" instead. Helluva typo.) I'll put up my bracket once I take a look at it. I'll assume a bracket from before the games, where I have Spain beating Holland, England beating Italy, and Uruguay beating Costa Rica.

Cuthalion

2014-06-15, 11:13 PM

France looked wonderful out on the field. Very nice.

And Bosnia deserved to win. The self goal killed it, but they were playing, I thought, much better.

SaintRidley

2014-06-16, 01:36 AM

Referring to them as the Flying Dutchmen is an old one. I last remember hearing it in 2008, when they had a gloriously attacking style - and came utterly unstuck against (iirc) Russia, but I'd be very surprised if it hadn't been used before or since.

I'm still holding out for Spain-Germany after the footballing gods denied it to me in 2012, but neither team is quite what it was then, I think.

While I was gobsmacked by the result last night I wasn't entirely sorry. This is more like the Spain I remember! Here's hoping they bounce back.

It's not so much the team as Van Persie, because of this goal:

https://d3j5vwomefv46c.cloudfront.net/photos/large/856755342.gif

Looking forward to tomorrow's matches for Group G. Gonna cheer the Germans on - they're my hope to win - I'm too young to actually remember their last World Cup win, though I was alive.

Aedilred

2014-06-16, 04:22 AM

I'm not so sure Holland would sit their guys against Chile if it came to it, as the difference would be getting Brazil in the Knockout Stage as opposed to being on the other side of the bracket completely and drawing Mexico at worst. Also, Australia gave Chile a run for quite a while. In addition, that game was probably the worst officiated game so far, and yes, that includes the first game. I would have sworn that the refs were racist against Australia, the reffing was so bad. Having said that, Spain is not nearly as bad as many are making them out to be. I still think they'll get out of the group and will face Brazil in the Round of 16, which would be HUGE!!!
The problem Spain have (and advantage the Netherlands have) is goal difference because they've left themselves with an awful hole to climb out of. The Dutch already have a +2 advantage over Chile, and Spain is -6 behind Chile. If we work on the principle that Spain will beat Chile, and all three teams will beat Australia, the Dutch would be looking at qualifying at the top of the group almost regardless of their result against Chile. Spain on the other hand need to score a bucket of goals in their next two matches, especially against Chile, and even at their absolute peak a few years ago this Spanish side often struggled to beat opponents by more than one. If the Netherlands beat Australia (which they should) and rest the squad against Chile, qualification might effectively be taken out of Spain's hands. They're in serious trouble, and there's no realistic chance of their qualifying at the top of the group unless the Netherlands seriously screw up.

Which is possible. The Dutch have coasted their opener before and blown it in later group matches, and the Czechs did it in 2006 when they were comfortably the best team in their group, but all the same it doesn't look like the most likely outcome. Off-pitch politics and shenanigans may yet claim the Dutch scalp, but that tend to wait for later in the competition to really make its presence felt.

England looked much sharper than Italy, even though they lost.
While this is true, I think part of this is that Italy weren't playing at full throttle, and didn't really need to apart from in very brief patches. Italy are also a much more experienced team; that they were able to defeat England without really being quite 100% bodes well for them if they do indeed have the ability to raise their game.

dehro

2014-06-16, 04:51 AM

While this is true, I think part of this is that Italy weren't playing at full throttle, and didn't really need to apart from in very brief patches. Italy are also a much more experienced team; that they were able to defeat England without really being quite 100% bodes well for them if they do indeed have the ability to raise their game.

I would also add that there were at least 2-3 starting lineup players who were benched due to injury and that on top of that the other players on the bench are at least as threatening/challenging as the players on the field. no idea if this is/was true for the English side as well.
on another note, someone give Paletta a haircut. he's an eyesore and looks like Conte before the hair transplant

Aedilred

2014-06-16, 06:17 AM

no idea if this is/was true for the English side as well.
That's debatable. The decision on whether to play Sterling was the only real controversy, although I (and it seems, most pundits) think it was absolutely the right move. He might not start every game, but he's proved a point there. Lampard didn't play at all, but I've always felt Lampard was the McManaman of his generation anyway, and he's also about a hundred years old. There are also a couple of younger players who either didn't play at all (Oxlade-Chamberlain) or didn't play much (Wilshere) who are considered talents, but that's still "future prospect" territory rather than established superstar. There are a couple of other good players in the squad but nobody to have the oppositon quaking in their boots. Rooney was playing out of position, but he was on the pitch all the same. England doesn't really have any major super-subs like some of the other big teams. On paper, this is probably the weakest England World Cup side since... actually, very possibly the weakest England World Cup side ever to qualify. But attitude and positivity means they've already earned more credit than the 2010 lot did.

dehro

2014-06-16, 06:21 AM

very true... usually even the press give the English side very little credit.. this time they seem more optimistic. good for morale.

TheFallenOne

2014-06-16, 08:23 AM

I'm not so sure Holland would sit their guys against Chile if it came to it, as the difference would be getting Brazil in the Knockout Stage as opposed to being on the other side of the bracket completely and drawing Mexico at worst.

You are quite mistaken. In case of a 6-6-6 tie Netherlands would still place first due to goal difference unless they get completely trounced by Chile, which is rather unlikely, or Spain scores a spectacular number of goals on Australia, which is also unlikely. Spain has a very strong lineup but their playing style isn't designed to achieve high victories.
Netherlands are 4 ahead, Australia should make another 2 easily. After that they pretty much already won their group. Mark my words, if Spain beats Chile and Netherlands beats Australia the Netherlands will not field their A-game against Australia in their last match. And if Chile beats a weaker Netherlands squad Spain is a goner even if they win both their remaining games.

Aedilred

2014-06-16, 10:30 AM

TheFallenOne, you are completely right. The main hope, I think, for both Spain and football, is that the Netherlands put out a full-strength side against Chile in the last game and go out to hammer them. Strategically it would make sense to rest players, but given the way they've come a cropper before with psychological issues and fallings-out and losing momentum in the past it might be worth their while to go for it even if the result is irrelevant. What's more, while they've already made a significant statement in thrashing the defending champions and world #1s, it lays down yet more of a marker to qualify flawlessly - especially if they are to face Chile again later in the competition, which isn't impossible.

Whether they actually do it, of course, is a different question, and it's pretty unlikely, but if anyone's going to do it it would probably be van Gaal.

Mrc.

2014-06-16, 11:47 AM

SaintRidley

2014-06-16, 11:49 AM

This would be the perfect time to bring Klose in at the start of the second half if they're interested in giving him a bit of exercise and a shot at tying/exceeding Ronaldo.

Cristo Meyers

2014-06-16, 11:53 AM

Well, I don't think Pepe is going to be popular at half time. Headbutting someone whilst they're down is just wrong. They don't even do that in Krav Maga! Still, looks like Germany have this in the bag, and with good reason. They've looked organised, disciplined and physically fit/unaffected by the heat. Looks like the first of the major team to show what they're capable of.

Agreed. This is honestly looking brutal.

I honestly have to wonder what exactly was going through Pepe's head. He had to know doing that was only asking for trouble. That lack of discipline probably locked in a German win.

TheTyrantis

2014-06-16, 12:00 PM

I honestly have to wonder what exactly was going through Pepe's head. He had to know doing that was only asking for trouble.

As I've learned today from twitter, Pepe is the Portuguese version of Joey Barton. (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uh_C8CIFN7M&feature=youtu.be)

Just realized that probably won't translate to anyone outside of people who watch English soccer... if you're one of those people, then just know they both lack common sense and have a laugh at Barton's disciplinary record.

SaintRidley

2014-06-16, 12:09 PM

As I've learned today from twitter, Pepe is the Portuguese version of Joey Barton. (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uh_C8CIFN7M&feature=youtu.be)

How in the hell is he even allowed on a pitch? Soccer might want to take a cue from fencing and introduce a black card - ejection from tournament for that sort of thing.

Cristo Meyers

2014-06-16, 12:14 PM

How in the hell is he even allowed on a pitch? Soccer might want to take a cue from fencing and introduce a black card - ejection from tournament for that sort of thing.

That kick did get him banned for 10 games, I think. But yeah, seems like small change. But then again, there's the player from Chile who's killed people drunk driving, so...

...and Portugal just screwed up it's best opportunity to get onto the board...wow. I don't know whether to be hopeful that the US can beat this team or afraid because Portugal's going to be out for blood.

dehro

2014-06-16, 12:32 PM

so... I'm not even watching this game but... how do you headbut someone who's lying on the ground without jumping off the ropes of a ring or something like that?

AtlanteanTroll

2014-06-16, 12:37 PM

Cristo Meyers

2014-06-16, 12:43 PM

so... I'm not even watching this game but... how do you headbut someone who's lying on the ground without jumping off the ropes of a ring or something like that?

I think it's more a matter of definition. The German player (Muller?) got a hand in the face during a tackle and started being dramatic about it (I think he might have caught a finger in the eye, but whatever). While he's on the ground Pepe comes up to him and goes forehead to forehead with him. It was more smack-talk than a Zidane-style headbutt, but by FIFA rules definition it counts (and was incredibly disrespectful besides).

SaintRidley

2014-06-16, 12:52 PM

It's a little surprising that with Portugal a man down and having such a solid lead that Germany didn't bring out Klose. Perfect conditions to bring him out. Wonder when they will.

Brilliant performance by Germany.

I think it's more a matter of definition. The German player (Muller?) got a hand in the face during a tackle and started being dramatic about it (I think he might have caught a finger in the eye, but whatever). While he's on the ground Pepe comes up to him and goes forehead to forehead with him. It was more smack-talk than a Zidane-style headbutt, but by FIFA rules definition it counts (and was incredibly disrespectful besides).

Looked to me like he might have caught a few knuckles under his nose. He didn't get particularly dramatic until Pepe put his head to his.

Cuthalion

2014-06-16, 01:04 PM

Germany was fantastic.

Portugal was very good at the beginning but slowed down after some time. Ronaldo, of course, is... dramatic.

Hat trick!

Cristo Meyers

2014-06-16, 01:05 PM

It's a little surprising that with Portugal a man down and having such a solid lead that Germany didn't bring out Klose. Perfect conditions to bring him out. Wonder when they will.

Brilliant performance by Germany.

I think they were trying to put a little bit of the fear of God into everyone watching. They're against Ghana on Saturday and the US next Thursday, and I know I'd be a little intimidated after a performance like that. Portugal's a Top 5 ranked team, right? And Germany crushed them.

Looked to me like he might have caught a few knuckles under his nose. He didn't get particularly dramatic until Pepe put his head to his.

Yeah, but at that point getting into Pepe's face was justified.

Now on to US v Ghana. Though I'm a lot more optimistic about our chances against Portugal next Sunday too.

SaintRidley

2014-06-16, 01:13 PM

Yeah, but at that point getting into Pepe's face was justified.

True. I was more pointing out that he didn't seem to be very dramatic about it at all - relatively quiet up until that point.

Cuthalion

2014-06-16, 01:15 PM

I'm really not sure if I prefer Ghana or US. The thing is, I have a softness for West African teams, the US team is terrible, and anyway my main allegiance is to Germany.

GolemsVoice

2014-06-16, 01:21 PM

As it should be.

Joking of course, but still. GERMANYYYYYY!!!!!!!

Cristo Meyers

2014-06-16, 01:22 PM

True. I was more pointing out that he didn't seem to be very dramatic about it at all - relatively quiet up until that point.

Ah, fair enough. I just have a pretty dim view of all the rolling around on the ground the players seem to do at times.

I'm really not sure if I prefer Ghana or US. The thing is, I have a softness for West African teams, the US team is terrible, and anyway my main allegiance is to Germany.

I'd like to see the US win. I'm just realistic enough to know that us even making it out of the Group Stage is...less than likely. Though my opinion of our chances has improved after seeing Portugal play.

This ability to see that my chosen team isn't actually all that good makes me something of an oddity here in Chicagoland...:smallwink:

Cuthalion

2014-06-16, 01:36 PM

As it should be.

Indeed, indeed.

TheFallenOne

2014-06-16, 01:57 PM

I could only watch the last ten minutes :smallfrown: seems I missed quite a show.

I kinda feel sorry for this generation of Portugal, they run into Germany in most World/European Cups(2006, 2008, 2012, 2014) and it never ends well for them. I imagine a collective groan went through their country when they were drawn into our group :smallbiggrin:

This would be the perfect time to bring Klose in at the start of the second half if they're interested in giving him a bit of exercise and a shot at tying/exceeding Ronaldo.

That's an excellent point. Hopefully he'll be fielded sometime in the other group games, would be nice to have a German guy again as the top goal scorer.
Though I think with time Thomas Müller might well surpass both Ronaldo and Klose. Boy's only 24 and he already got 8 World Cup goals. He could beat the record by 2018 and even if not that won't be his last one.

Killer Angel

2014-06-16, 02:44 PM

I kinda feel sorry for this generation of Portugal, they run into Germany in most World/European Cups(2006, 2008, 2012, 2014) and it never ends well for them.

...still better than Benfica's performances.

Aedilred

2014-06-16, 03:30 PM

Portugal were desperately mediocre, which, to be honest, is much as I expected. They have a couple of decent players, and one outrageous talent, but they have no discipline, and CR put in the sort of thing I've come to expect from him at world finals. The theatrics and spectacle the work-rate are there, but his touch and vision is off. His passing is imprecise, his free kicks were generally pretty poor, and he was lucky not to get carded for his outburst to the referee after the denied penalty - a penalty shout I should point out that only came about because the referee accidentally intercepted a German play and gave the ball to Portugal and thus was entirely unearned by actual Portuguese input anyway.

I didn't think it was a vintage German performance, compared to how they looked a couple of years ago, but this was still impressive, and comprehensive.

When it comes to Klose, I've nothing against the guy but it would seem something of a travesty to me - if an amusing statistical quirk - for him to become the leading WC goalscorer. After all, for all we like to see an underdog doing well, the World Cup is really about superstars, and for all that he's been astonishingly successful at poaching goals for Germany, Klose has never been much more than an honest journeyman. If the German team hadn't been historically weak when he first appeared, he'd probably never have made the team (albeit he'd have played for Poland instead). He's already won a Golden Boot, after all (which included a handy three against an abject Saudi side). But the all-time record-holder? Pele, Ronaldo, Muller, Fontaine, he is not.

Cuthalion

2014-06-16, 04:00 PM

Canuck617

2014-06-16, 04:11 PM

The problem Spain have (and advantage the Netherlands have) is goal difference because they've left themselves with an awful hole to climb out of.

You are quite mistaken.

Indeed I am, good sirs. For some reason I considered head-to-head as relevant, which is a severe brain fart on my part. Seeing as how that isn't the case, yeah, Spain is in very much in trouble.

Still, any unanswered goals they score against Chile count as double for their relative GDs, so they're not out of it yet. Furthermore, I really didn't like how Chile looked against Australia, so a 3-goal Spain victory over Chile is very probable, not to mention possibly a bit more achievable by their current desperation. For this reason, I think Spain hammering Chile a better shot for Spain than the Netherlands hammering Chile.

As far as Germany is concerned, I like this style of play a little better than in past years, as they seemed more attacking in the 1st Half where they would be more controlling in past years, not to mention they were almost just as controlling in the 2nd Half, so they seemed more balanced to me, but then again, I only pay attention every other year, so any criticism or differing opinions would be appreciated.

Also, what are your thoughts on Portugal now? I don't see them beating the US, and I think the US will pull out a win today against Ghana having been victimised by them so many times in the recent past, so to me, it seems Portugal might be the hard luck loser of Group G, whereas I had the US pegged for that before.

Cristo Meyers

2014-06-16, 04:15 PM

Laughed myself silly during this last match. I could only watch the last 30 minutes, but a few things struck me.

Both teams were very sportsmanlike.

They fell over a lot.

If in doubt, they kick the ball as hard as possible.

I noticed that too. Both Iran and Nigeria seemed to love just booting the ball as hard as possible. That was a dull game.

Also, what are your thoughts on Portugal now? I don't see them beating the US, and I think the US will pull out a win today against Ghana having been victimised by them so many times in the recent past, so to me, it seems Portugal might be the hard luck loser of Group G, whereas I had the US pegged for that before.

I have my doubts we can beat Ghana, but if Portugal plays against the US like they played against Germany I think we can win.

I'm loathe to be very optimistic about our chances of getting out of the group, though.

comicshorse

2014-06-16, 04:35 PM

It's certainly been a World Cup of surprises. Spain in trouble, Costa Rica top of their group and serious considerations as to wether Portugal can make it out of the early stages

Canuck617

2014-06-16, 04:49 PM

I'm loathe to be very optimistic about our chances of getting out of the group, though.

I agree with your reticence, but I have to think that the US had this game circled on their calendar once it was announced, and I think they would have made it their nigh all-consuming mission to beat Ghana. Also, Portugal is hurting real badly in terms of players, not to mention that they're -4 already on this Goal Differential that I hear is so very important :smalltongue:

TheTyrantis

2014-06-16, 05:00 PM

Not the diamond formation again... the US is better as a 4-2-3-1, not a 4-4-2 diamond.

SaintRidley

2014-06-16, 05:02 PM

And 30 seconds in, the U.S. gets a goal against Ghana. Good job, Dempsey.

Cristo Meyers

2014-06-16, 05:02 PM

I agree with your reticence, but I have to think that the US had this game circled on their calendar once it was announced, and I think they would have made it their nigh all-consuming mission to beat Ghana. Also, Portugal is hurting real badly in terms of players, not to mention that they're -4 already on this Goal Differential that I hear is so very important :smalltongue:

Agreed. But it really all hinges on this game right now.

Here's hoping!

Screw that...a goal in the first thirty seconds?! :smallbiggrin:

Don't be like the Bears in the Superbowl...don't be like the Bears in the Superbowl...

The last time the Chicago Bears made it to the Superbowl, they returned the first kickoff for a touchdown...and then fell apart spectacularly.

BaronOfHell

2014-06-16, 05:23 PM

Wow, what a world cup so far. Why aren't there any girls in this topic when for once WC is awesome?

CWater

2014-06-16, 05:42 PM

Wow, what a world cup so far. Why aren't there any girls in this topic when for once WC is awesome?

Well, I'm reading this thread. (And watching the games of course.:smalltongue:) I just got back home from a trip around central Europe and I had some good time watching some games in hostels with random people.

For example, I watched the Netherlands-Spain in Hamburg, where they... clearly rooted for their neighbours. The enthusiasm was fun to witness.:smallbiggrin:

Aedilred

2014-06-16, 06:03 PM

For example, I watched the Netherlands-Spain in Hamburg, where they... clearly rooted for their neighbours. The enthusiasm was fun to witness.:smallbiggrin:
And I thought Germany-Netherlands was a big rivalry! Although Germany seem to take a different attitude towards sporting rivalries than us: here it means "support whoever your enemy is playing", there, iirc, it seems to mean "support your rivals in the hope it sets up an epic encounter with you later on".

In fact the unbelievably puerile England end of the England-Germany rivalry has started to seriously wind me up in recent years, but that's starting to verge on RL politics so I'll leave that...

I think Ghana have had the better of the game so far, the goal aside, but they have been appalling in front of goal and never even looked like scoring despite dominating midfield play. The US have been alright since the opener, but they don't seem to be able to get any play going (possibly because Ghana keep fouling them). I'm giving up on the match now.

Is it just me, or have referees been interfering with play - by which I mean obstructing players, blocking passes, generally getting in the way - more at this WC so far than usual?

Cristo Meyers

2014-06-16, 06:06 PM

Is it just me, or have referees been interfering with play - by which I mean obstructing players, blocking passes, generally getting in the way - more at this WC so far than usual?

I noticed that too. At least two passes were blocked by the ref in the Germany/Portugal game and at least one in this game was a close call. They really need to start paying attention.

Chessgeek

2014-06-16, 06:44 PM

There goes a big two points :smallfrown::smallsigh:

Or maybe not!

TheTyrantis

2014-06-16, 06:48 PM

There goes a big two points :smallfrown::smallsigh:

Spoke too soon! USA! USA!

Cristo Meyers

2014-06-16, 06:53 PM

Spoke too soon! USA! USA!

Good Lord, my poor nerves...:smalleek:

#edit: oh hell YES! :smallbiggrin:

SaintRidley

2014-06-16, 06:57 PM

Damn. Shaky performance overall, but they pulled it out.

TheTyrantis

2014-06-16, 06:59 PM

Damn. Shaky performance overall, but they pulled it out.

Oh yeah, I totally thought they were ghana take away our 3 points, but somehow John Brooks put it in the back of the net. Let's hope those hamstring injuries aren't too serious...

Cristo Meyers

2014-06-16, 07:01 PM

Damn. Shaky performance overall, but they pulled it out.

No joke. I'm thrilled that we won, but we're going to have to do better against Portugal and Germany.

Oh yeah, I totally thought they were ghana take away our 3 points, but somehow John Brooks put it in the back of the net. Let's hope those hamstring injuries aren't too serious...

Altidore might be done. Won't know until tomorrow. The halftime sub was taken out probably preempted a serious injury.

Dempsey (?)...I'm surprised he doesn't have a broken nose, honestly.

Cuthalion

2014-06-16, 07:05 PM

I noticed that too. Both Iran and Nigeria seemed to love just booting the ball as hard as possible. That was a dull game.

Was not dull. Amusing is what it was. It was like World Cup Blooper Reel.

USA: Mmmm.... that game was boring until it wasn't. Good job though on defense.

Canuck617

2014-06-16, 07:08 PM

Holy Beardstains of Thor! That game was way more exciting than it needed to be! I'm so glad the US pulled it off!

That said, I had such high hopes for the US, but I really didn't like what I saw at all. Dear Mjolnir, that was a bad showing. The US looked so outclassed, even taking into account the loss of Altidore. I guess it's serendipitous Ghana wasn't as up to the task as they needed to be. They looked very good most of the game, but wow. I'll add to this later. Steak calls.

Why aren't there any girls in this topic when for once WC is awesome?

Well, I'm reading this thread.

Ask and ye shall receive, eh, BaronOfHell?

SaintRidley

2014-06-16, 07:09 PM

No joke. I'm thrilled that we won, but we're going to have to do better against Portugal and Germany.

Altidore might be done. Won't know until tomorrow. The halftime sub was taken out probably preempted a serious injury.

Dempsey (?)...I'm surprised he doesn't have a broken nose, honestly.

Post match interview right now his nose definitely looks like it was knocked crooked. I wouldn't be surprised if it is broken.

I'm hoping for a win on Portugal for the U.S., and as far as Germany's concerned I'm going to hope the U.S. doesn't do badly. Coming out of the group second is good enough for me (I also just prefer the German team, so).

Irk

2014-06-16, 07:09 PM

TheTyrantis

2014-06-16, 07:14 PM

Chessgeek

2014-06-16, 07:14 PM

Oh yeah, I totally thought they were ghana take away our 3 points
:smallcool:

Definitely that level of play will not be enough for the next two games. But at the end of the day a win is a win, and 3 points is tremendous, especially with Portugal offering us a huge advantage in tiebreaks right now.

Cuthalion

2014-06-16, 07:15 PM

Germany kills US, and I think US has a fighting chance otherwise. I'd actually say it's a tossup for me between them and Portugal now.

But I love how the country Americans are rooting against is... the US (http://www.nytimes.com/2014/06/11/upshot/world-cup-opinions-in-19-countries-likes-dislikes-predictions.html?_r=0). Badoom-tsh.

BaronOfHell

2014-06-16, 07:16 PM

Ask and ye shall receive, eh, BaronOfHell?

Indeed!

Interesting when they played in Africa, Ghana won, playing in America, USA won. Both games were close, and it's probably just a coincidence. I think Ghana was the best team. Now if only Portugal drops disappointing, they've a much better team than either US or Ghana, but somehow I think once again Portugal shall disappoint against these teams.

About African teams, Nigeria is for some reason one disappointment after the other. Cameroon have had their golden generation. Ghana and Ivory Coast are usually the stronger teams, where Ivory Coast have been unlucky (they were in the GoD with Brazil and Portugal 4 years ago), this time around they should be able to go through and hopefully finally will the strongest African team show how strong they can be.

Chessgeek

2014-06-16, 07:22 PM

How far do you suppose the U.S. will go?

If they manage to draw Portugal they might be able to make a bit of a run, since there isn't a tremendous force to be met the first two rounds out of groups. With a loss, Germany would be the last game for them without a shocker.

Could Ghana still get enough points to perhaps beat Portugal?

Probably not. It's possible they beat Portugal in the last game, especially if Portugal has nothing to play for by then, but this was Ghana's only legitimate winning opportunity IMO.

TheTyrantis

2014-06-16, 07:32 PM

About African teams, Nigeria is for some reason one disappointment after the other. Cameroon have had their golden generation. Ghana and Ivory Coast are usually the stronger teams, where Ivory Coast have been unlucky (they were in the GoD with Brazil and Portugal 4 years ago), this time around they should be able to go through and hopefully finally will the strongest African team show how strong they can be.

Cote D'Ivorie should be making the runner-up in the stage behind Colombia (if I remember the right group), but they were rather lackluster in their match with Japan until Drogba came on and suddenly the lights came on. They certainly have quality players, even if Yaya Toure played as a CAM against the Blue Samurai (which he doesn't play as at Manchester City). I had predicted that they would play against Uruguay as the winner of the England/Italy group, but that pick is a bit up in the air right now. Who knows, they might make the quarterfinals.

AtlanteanTroll

2014-06-16, 07:33 PM

GPuzzle

2014-06-16, 07:48 PM

And we got them out in the last two second rounds.

Then again, we got beaten by the second best in the quarter finals.

Also, I wasn't expecting to see Brazil as the second-most team Brazilians are rooting against, nor was I expecting SO many people to believe that Brazil will win the World Cup.

We should've used the climate. Send the African countries to play in the South, send the European countries to play in the North, spread the rest out, beat due to them not being used to the climate.

Aedilred

2014-06-16, 08:25 PM

While I totally feel sympathy for the U.S. player who was injured, I really wanted Ghana to win. They aren't a stellar team, but soccer is so much more important there than in the U.S. There are more than 50 countries in Africa and only a few ever qualify, due to a lack of money to support a team. I would have loved to see a victory from Ghana, and it would be great if somehow an African team won, having never done so before. I mean, the U.S. really has everything, they can't have soccer too.

About African teams, Nigeria is for some reason one disappointment after the other. Cameroon have had their golden generation. Ghana and Ivory Coast are usually the stronger teams, where Ivory Coast have been unlucky (they were in the GoD with Brazil and Portugal 4 years ago), this time around they should be able to go through and hopefully finally will the strongest African team show how strong they can be.
I'd love to see an African team win the World Cup. But I don't want one to win for the sake of it, or because everyone else is useless, or they get a favourable draw or their opponents get some dodgy refereeing decisions or something (no, South Korea 2002, I will never forget). I want an African team to be good enough to win fairly and squarely against the best in the world, and go on to win. Unfortunately, on the evidence here Africa is as weak collectively as it's ever been. Cote d'Ivoire is the pick of the bunch but they still look a fair way off the top teams. I think they would struggle even against Portugal, say.

I have Portugal on the brain today. They're weak, and what's more they have been for ages, and rather like Mugatu I'm starting to wonder if nobody else has noticed, given the way pundits and commentators talk about them. They looked halfway decent in 2008 which was the absolute last gasp of the golden generation, they scraped their way to the semifinals in 2012, thanks to Dutch-Czech implosions, where they were an absolute embarrassment - England habitually play better, more attractive football than Portugal did then - and for all that Ronaldo is a great club player he's scored a grand total of two goals in World Cups - one against North Korea and the other a penalty. In 2010 Portugal failed to score against anyone other than North Korea.

Portugal used to be great. Players like Pauleta and Joao Pinto may have been little-remarked on the international club scene but fitted perfectly into the team, they had a couple of genuine stars, and when they clicked they would play magnificent football and just blow teams - any team - away. Remember that "Ole!" advert - Portugal were - genuinely - comparable to that superstar-studded Brazil team. But that era ended ten years ago, and I think the presence of Ronaldo and a couple of other top-flight club players combined with their formidable reputation built on the backs of the Figo-Rui Costa generation has deluded everyone into thinking they're still a blue chip team when I just can't see any evidence for it.

Rant over. For now. Expect a renewal the next time Portugal play.

Irk

2014-06-16, 08:40 PM

I'd love to see an African team win the World Cup. But I don't want one to win for the sake of it, or because everyone else is useless, or they get a favourable draw or their opponents get some dodgy refereeing decisions or something (no, South Korea 2002, I will never forget). I want an African team to be good enough to win fairly and squarely against the best in the world, and go on to win.
Yes, absolutely.

Unfortunately, on the evidence here Africa is as weak collectively as it's ever been. Cote d'Ivoire is the pick of the bunch but they still look a fair way off the top teams.
Sadly, I must agree.

Scarlet Knight

2014-06-16, 09:00 PM

I'm thrilled that we won, but we're going to have to do better against Portugal and Germany.

Portugal is down a man for the next match...might the US see the second stage....dare I even hope?

Cristo Meyers

2014-06-16, 09:03 PM

Portugal is down a man for the next match...might the US see the second stage....dare I even hope?

I think it's really going to come down the Portugal game. If we can win that, I think we're good unless Ghana can also win their next two games. It's our only shot, really, because us beating Germany is nothing but a pipe-dream.

Chessgeek

2014-06-16, 09:56 PM

Portugal is down a man for the next match...might the US see the second stage....dare I even hope?

It isn't 11 vs 10 though is it? Pepe being out is good, but if he's replaced I'd still give Portugal better odds.

US fans should be content with a draw against Portugal. A loss is (most likely) elimination, a win (though unrealistic) ought to be enough to move on. But a draw would be a small upset and still give the US squad good chances of advancing, provided they can avoid a blowout from Germany and Ghana can do the same from Portugal.

Kasanip

2014-06-16, 09:56 PM

Fight Japanese representative team! Even in breathtaking loss, Samurai Blue won't give up! let's do our best! :smallredface:

Cristo Meyers

2014-06-16, 10:09 PM

It isn't 11 vs 10 though is it? Pepe being out is good, but if he's replaced I'd still give Portugal better odds.

US fans should be content with a draw against Portugal. A loss is (most likely) elimination, a win (though unrealistic) ought to be enough to move on. But a draw would be a small upset and still give the US squad good chances of advancing, provided they can avoid a blowout from Germany and Ghana can do the same from Portugal.

If we draw against Portugal then we have to hope Ghana at least draws against Germany. If we draw and Ghana loses then Ghana won't have anything to play for in their last game against Portugal. They won't be able to advance even with a win.

SaintRidley

2014-06-16, 10:20 PM

Portugal is down a man for the next match...might the US see the second stage....dare I even hope?

Not down a man, just can't use Pepe. Which is probably better for the world.

Chessgeek

2014-06-16, 10:26 PM

If we draw against Portugal then we have to hope Ghana at least draws against Germany. If we draw and Ghana loses then Ghana won't have anything to play for in their last game against Portugal. They won't be able to advance even with a win.

Well everyone knows Ghana won't draw with Germany. But I feel like they would still play hard anyway. I'm told they have a lot of respect for the game. And anyway, for Portugal to win the tiebreak Germany and Portugal would have to win by a combined margin of 5 on the last day. This is relatively unlikely.

Canuck617

2014-06-16, 10:31 PM

Portugal is down a man for the next match...might the US see the second stage....dare I even hope?

Well, they'll be playing without at least Pepe and possibly up to three in total (Hugo Almeida and Fábio Coentrão) so it's... more likely than I previously thought; however, Jozy Altidore looks like he might be out for the next game as well, so we'll see. Truth be told, I hope they're all back except Pepe. To go down via hammies in the World Cup would really suck.

Also, to clarify, Portugal will be missing Pepe, but they will still field 11 guys. Pepe just won't be one of them. The red card disadvantage is only for that game. (Or I'm wrong and am a complete idiot. Either or.)

us beating Germany is nothing but a pipe-dream.

Dude, the US should even BE so lucky as to call it even a pipe dream. Also, Ghana is not beating Germany. No one in this group is.

Again, I'm glad the US won, but they looked... slow against Ghana, not to mention sloppy and crampy. I liked their chances against Portugal, but then I saw the US play. Unless Altidore comes back and Portugal is down three starters, I don't like their chances. I guess it just depends on how deep Portugal's team is, and I can't speak to that. Also, I kind of suspect that Klinsmann will have a plan for Cristiano Ronaldo. I'll tell you right now Klinsmann's plan for the Germany game is to win the two games before that one. :smallwink:

SaintRidley

2014-06-16, 10:46 PM

And, since we're done with matches for the night, I give you Buzzfeed's 54 Reasons the German World Cup Team Might Actually Be the Hottest World Cup Team (http://www.buzzfeed.com/mattbellassai/reasons-the-german-world-cup-team-might-actually-be-the-h) full of delicious German team eye candy.

TheTyrantis

2014-06-16, 10:51 PM

Also, to clarify, Portugal will be missing Pepe, but they will still field 11 guys. Pepe just won't be one of them. The red card disadvantage is only for that game. (Or I'm wrong and am a complete idiot. Either or.)

This is correct. Red cards are just ejections that result in a game ban (1 for the World Cup, as far as I know), so just like any sport the team will be full strength for the next game.

Ellye

2014-06-16, 11:20 PM

Tomorrow will be Belgium vs Algeria and Russia vs Korea, for Group H, wrapping up the first round.
And Brazil vs Mexico to start the second round in Group A.

It's likely we'll see three solid wins, for Belgium, Russia and Brazil, though I won't be completely surprised if Mexico manages to pull off an upset.

Well, Brazil game days are happy days for me - I get off work earlier! Best reason ever to cheer for our home team, I guess?

Aedilred

2014-06-17, 12:24 AM

Also, I kind of suspect that Klinsmann will have a plan for Cristiano Ronaldo. I'll tell you right now Klinsmann's plan for the Germany game is to win the two games before that one. :smallwink:
I see the "CR" words were mentioned :smallwink:

I think the way to deal with Ronaldo at this level is basically to defend in front of him rather than go to him and try to tackle him off the ball. With the ball at his feet and moving at speed his control is good enough that he can take it past almost any defender running at him, but when presented with an impassive line he tends to slow play down, dribble, do a lot of step-overs to try to entice the defence forward and eventually lose patience. At his club(s) the quality of his team-mates is such that they draw the defence away to open space for him to run into, or get into good receiving positions for him to pass to and return the service, but watching him today and previously for Portugal he just hasn't got the support - or perhaps doesn't have confidence in his support - and ends up trying to do it himself. Which means he tends to run into the defence and fall over, take a wild shot at goal and miss, or try to thread a pass through the defence and surrender possession.

Of course, I'm not as accomplished an international footballer, or football coach, as Jurgen Klinsmann. So hopefully he will have identified Ronaldo's vulnerabilities even more acutely than I have and has a plan to exploit them or neutralise him.

dehro

2014-06-17, 03:14 AM

If in doubt, they kick the ball as hard as possible.

This reminds me of an old italian player and coach from back before I was born, by the name Nereo Rocco, who had a few good quotes to his name, most of them not even in italian but in dialect.
This one in particular went something like "get on the field and hit anything that moves.. if it happens to be the ball, that's just too bad"

In fact the unbelievably puerile England end of the England-Germany rivalry has started to seriously wind me up in recent years, but that's starting to verge on RL politics so I'll leave that...

You mean the whole "one world cup and 2 world wars, doo-dah, doo-dah" thing? it makes me laugh really.
anyhoo, there are quite a lot of sport rivalries that are in fact only participated to in one direction.
Italy still has it in for Germany but I don't think the Germans are even aware of this, since they're focused on the Dutch..but not half as much as the Dutch themselves resent the Germans (and love to beat them when they can).. facing Germany being usually a national tragedy/event... and so on.

Oh yeah, I totally thought they were ghana take away our 3 points
you should be a little bit ashamed of yourself.
on that same note, one for the other italians on the forum:
http://media-cache-ec0.pinimg.com/236x/66/4d/49/664d49f07f2f969f9e5d4a14e9ddea24.jpg
to explain it, in Italian, "l'apparenza inganna" (and not "in ghana", which is kind of the point of the joke) means appearances deceive

Cicciograna

2014-06-17, 03:31 AM

This reminds me of an old italian player and coach from back before I was born, by the name Nereo Rocco, who had a few good quotes to his name, most of them not even in italian but in dialect.
This one in particular went something like "get on the field and hit anything that moves.. if it happens to be the ball, that's just too bad"

Ah, the good ol' Nereo, exponent of the good ol' italian football tradition that nothing has to do with the current state of football in Italy. Good ol' times.

you should be a little bit ashamed of yourself.
on that same note, one for the other italians on the forum:
http://media-cache-ec0.pinimg.com/236x/66/4d/49/664d49f07f2f969f9e5d4a14e9ddea24.jpg
to explain it, in Italian, "l'apparenza inganna" (and not "in ghana", which is kind of the point of the joke) means appearances deceive

I'm torn between pissing myself off laughing or just shooting myself for the absurdity of the joke.
Maybe I'll go for a compromise, pissing myself off while shooting myself.

banjo1985

2014-06-17, 03:51 AM

Bit Fiend

2014-06-17, 04:36 AM

Excellent performance last night from Germany, against an ordinary looking Portugal side. Didn't help that Pepe couldn't laugh off that ludicrous play-acting from Muller, but they were being outplayed before that anyway.

I would comment on Nigeria vs Iran, but unfortunately it sent me to sleep after ten minutes.

Aye, Nigeria vs. Iran was the first really boring match of the World Cup. Expected more from Nigeria, to be honest.

Anyway, Germany had a fantastic start. 4:0 against the strongest competitor in the group is quite an accomplishment... though we do have a history of crushing Portugal in the big cups, so I wasn't that surprised. Still, the team I'm most afraid of is Italy. It's Germany's big nemesis so far, and Balotelli is downright scary.

dehro

2014-06-17, 05:04 AM

I'm torn between pissing myself off laughing or just shooting myself for the absurdity of the joke.
Maybe I'll go for a compromise, pissing myself off while shooting myself.

I like to think that the flashy light effect is in the shape of a certain football trophy

BaronOfHell

2014-06-17, 06:11 AM

TheTyrantis

2014-06-17, 10:39 AM

you should be a little bit ashamed of yourself.
on that same note, one for the other italians on the forum:
http://media-cache-ec0.pinimg.com/236x/66/4d/49/664d49f07f2f969f9e5d4a14e9ddea24.jpg
to explain it, in Italian, "l'apparenza inganna" (and not "in ghana", which is kind of the point of the joke) means appearances deceive

Nope, I have no shame for pun usage. I love puns when the opportunity arrives. Besides, I'm sure I could think of worse, far-fetched ones.

As for rivalries, the only rivalry that really matters for the United States is our continental neighbor Mexico that has gone back for years. Mexico used to be a scary team to face and usually the stronger of the two, but Mexico seems to have lost a lot of their flair lately and only just barely got by in qualifying after dominating the Kiwis from New Zealand. The crowd doesn't really respond as well when they played their matches at the Azteca, and many of their points came from scoreless draws, if I remember correctly. In fact, it was thanks to the United States that they had the opportunity to still make it, which is a little ironic.

dehro

2014-06-17, 10:40 AM

I think they'll be better against "weaker" teams.

http://fc01.deviantart.net/fs70/f/2013/364/f/0/1536740_716430268368308_1934485862_n_by_redbluteam-d703qcs.jpg

Cuthalion

2014-06-17, 10:48 AM

I highly approve of the latest google doodle.

GolemsVoice

2014-06-17, 11:26 AM

But I love how the country Americans are rooting against is... the US (http://www.nytimes.com/2014/06/11/upshot/world-cup-opinions-in-19-countries-likes-dislikes-predictions.html?_r=0). Badoom-tsh.

They ALSO think they'll win the World Cup. That's some split personality right there.

GPuzzle

2014-06-17, 11:27 AM

On rivalries - Argentina and Brazil. 'Nuff said.

Asta Kask

2014-06-17, 11:33 AM

El Salvador and Honduras have fought a war over football. That's rivalry.

GPuzzle

2014-06-17, 11:43 AM

...

Holy moley.

Aedilred

2014-06-17, 12:02 PM

@Aedilred
It may seem slightly odd that I'm to defend the position of Portugal after they just 0-4 to Germany, but in my opinion they're far from weak. I rank them as the fourth strongest European team, following Spain, Germany and Netherlands. (I don't find Italy to be anything special since 08, or England since 02) Portugal however has a tendency to disappoint.
I do not find the era of Pauletta as the lonely striker much better than today. Back then Portugal had Figo, Rui Costa and that Brazilian dude who took Rui Costa's spot. They were what made Portugal powerful back then, but Portugal had a lot of problems scoring goals. In this new Ronaldo era, Portugal has had an easier time scoring goals, and I think they'll be better against "weaker" teams.
I'm not 100%, and having just run some numbers I was actually surprised at the results - although I think they bear me out.

The golden generation period at senior level was from roughly Euro 96 - Euro 2004. They played 57 tournament qualification or finals matches in that period and scored 135 goals, at a ratio of 2.4 goals/game.

The period between Euro 2004 and the 2006 World Cup was a transitional period; during this time they played 18 matches and scored 41 goals, at a fairly similar rate of 2.3/game.

Since 2006 they have played 55 qualification or finals matches (not counting the one against Germany) and scored 102 goals; their goals/game has dropped to 1.85.

At tournament finals for which they've qualified they have played on average 4.3 matches per finals since 2006, compared to 4.25 before that, so almost identical. They have been more consistent at finals since 2006, and have never failed to reach the second round, but have scored on average fewer goals at each finals - 6.67 compared to 7.25 between '96 and 2004.

Obviously none of this is adjusted for quality of opposition: it's difficult to judge that in any case and you kind of have to assume that it essentially evens out, which I think it probably does. And Portugal did sometimes struggle to defeat weak teams away from home back in the day... but then again in recent years they've managed to draw with Cyprus, Northern Ireland and Israel, the latter two at home, so I think that largely balances itself out too. But the overall impression I get is that Portugal's defence has got better in recent years, rather than that their attack has got sharper. And they haven't actually met with any more meaningful success in the newer era than they did previously in terms of progress in competitions.

Asta Kask

2014-06-17, 12:44 PM

El Salvador and Honduras have fought a war over football. That's rivalry.

...

Holy moley.

Might be a slight exaggeration for humerus effect. 1969 (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Football_War)

SaintRidley

2014-06-17, 12:54 PM

They ALSO think they'll win the World Cup. That's some split personality right there.

Hard to blame them - in American sports context "world champions" is synonymous with "champion of America."

Bit Fiend

2014-06-17, 12:55 PM

And here I thought Belgium vs. Algeria would stay boring... great 2nd half.

Asta Kask

2014-06-17, 01:16 PM

Hard to blame them - in American sports context "world champions" is synonymous with "champion of America."

They don't watch must sports, do they?

Cristo Meyers

2014-06-17, 01:20 PM

Didn't catch as much of the game as I'd have liked. Damn I feel for Algeria, that had to hurt.

Really wish I was going to be home in time for Mexico v Brazil.

They don't watch must sports, do they?

Just the ones where the US is already pretty much the center of the universe...:smallsigh:

Asta Kask

2014-06-17, 01:25 PM

An American is a person who thinks you have to don 60 pounds of armor to play rugby.

Spiryt

2014-06-17, 01:28 PM

Didn't catch as much of the game as I'd have liked. Damn I feel for Algeria, that had to hurt.

To be honest, they've entered Belgian 16 meters zone like, literally, 2 times, managed to get one penalty kick out of it, and then defended the score with full tank mode. So they had a lot of luck anyway.

Ellye

2014-06-17, 01:34 PM

On rivalries - Argentina and Brazil. 'Nuff said.I'm Brazilian and I frankly don't get this rivalry. Most people I know don't, either. But they still keep it alive, "just because". It's way too weird for me. People will cheer for pretty much any of our other South America neighbors, but will boo Argentina. Why? "Because they're Argentina, duuuuh", it's the only sort of answer I heard so far.

I don't care much for Argentina either way. Just consider them to be a very strong contender, as they pretty much always are.

Mrc.

2014-06-17, 01:35 PM

An American is a person who thinks you have to don 60 pounds of armor to play rugby.

As someone who used to play Union until I severely injured my hand, this amuses me greatly. Although, American football does have a few good features and if I'm honest they need that padding. The hardest hits in American football aren't exactly pretty. Just like the people on the end of said hits.

Well, the World Cup is well underway, what are everyone's thoughts so far? Clear contenders? Wooden spoon rivals?

GPuzzle

2014-06-17, 01:39 PM

I'm Brazilian and I frankly don't get this rivalry. Most people I know don't, either. But they still keep it alive, "just because". It's way too weird for me. People will cheer for pretty much any of our other South America neighbors, but will boo Argentina. Why? "Because they're Argentina, duuuuh", it's the only sort of answer I heard so far.

I don't care much for Argentina either way. Just consider than to be a very strong contender, as they pretty much always are.

It's weird, I know. Well, one of the main reasons I've noticed was "They call themselves European and white and superior and stuff", which people just mocked around with it. And AFAIK, the MOBA community isn't great especially with those guys, but what the heck, no MOBA community is anywhere near good.

Seems like the rivalry comes less from football and more from MOBAs right now.

Also, Viper and Bounty Hunter mid, feeding Keeper of the Light. *facepalms repeatdly*

Fragenstein

2014-06-17, 02:01 PM

As someone who used to play Union until I severely injured my hand, this amuses me greatly. Although, American football does have a few good features and if I'm honest they need that padding. The hardest hits in American football aren't exactly pretty. Just like the people on the end of said hits.

I really need to find some good rugby coverage. I've seen American football. On almost every level from pee-wee to professional, impacts on every play risk serious injury. Pads are an attempt to extend playing careers by dissipating those most severe collisions.

And still the players end up with a lifetime of crippling injuries -- particularly the concussions that have been making themselves known of late.

Are the unprotected Australian rules and other non-padded persuasions just as rigorous?

Aedilred

2014-06-17, 02:59 PM

There is a theory that the padding in American football, if not increasing the risk of injury per se, is actually contributory to the injury problem, because it encourages players to hit harder and more dangerously than they would do if they were unarmoured. What's more while it protects against impact it doesn't afford the same level of protection to torsion-related injuries and in particular neck support is insuffiicent. But I haven't seen enough American football to know.

Rugby certainly has injury problems, but really serious injuries are thankfully pretty rare. Most matches will see a number of low-level injuries, cuts, grazes, bashed ears and noses, etc. but not as much as you'd expect. Of course rugby, unlike American football, doesn't allow tackling off the ball, so while there is still the scope for collisions and there are still some big melees - each team in a scrum will weigh the best part of a ton, and if the front row doesn't do its job properly there is the possibility of really serious injury - the number of individual collisions and tackles in a game may be lower. Although since the substitute rules are different, each player probably takes more punishment in rugby over the course of a match; it's swings and roundabouts I guess.

Irk

2014-06-17, 03:29 PM

on that same note, one for the other italians on the forum:
http://media-cache-ec0.pinimg.com/236x/66/4d/49/664d49f07f2f969f9e5d4a14e9ddea24.jpg
to explain it, in Italian, "l'apparenza inganna" (and not "in ghana", which is kind of the point of the joke) means appearances deceive
I really hope we get more of these.

Mrc.

2014-06-17, 03:33 PM

Yeah, this is similar to how the boxing glove is the most dangerous thing in boxing: by reducing the impact you feel in your hands it encourages people to go for the harder face as opposed to the softer stomach. In rugby there are loads of minor injuries as you get bashed about a lot, especially in a turnover in a rook because pretty much by definition you have your team being forced back across where you are lying on the ground. You get hurt a bit there.

Back on topic, is anyone here actually in Brazil for the world cup? An idea as to what the facilities are like would be good, especially with all the grumbling the British media have been doing.

Ellye

2014-06-17, 03:55 PM

Back on topic, is anyone here actually in Brazil for the world cup? An idea as to what the facilities are like would be good, especially with all the grumbling the British media have been doing.Hey, I'm in Brazil!... not for the world cup, though, I just live here. :smalltongue:

Pretty weak display from Brazil. Thankfully the officials didn't gave in to the silly attempts at creating fake penalties, near the end. That would have been disgraceful.
Mexico played better than Brazil today, frankly. Pretty solid defense and good counter-attack.

Aedilred

2014-06-17, 04:08 PM

Yeah, I went into that as a complete neutral and by the end was thoroughly rooting for Mexico. Having said that, while Mexico's defence was good (and their keeper was awesome) their finishing was weak: there were periods where they were raining shots in but none of them on target. All the same they're looking good value to qualify if they put in something similar against Croatia.

Fred was very poor, again. I'd be surprised to see him start against Cameroon, but Scolari doesn't tend to like changing his plans.

dehro

2014-06-17, 04:13 PM

If the Mexican side had been a bit more agressive forward, they would have won this game. Without that, the end result is pretty fair. Mexico losing would have been entirely unfair.
The Mexican goalkeeper was pretty much awesome

Ellye

2014-06-17, 04:15 PM

It's interesting to note that he's a free agent at the moment. I'd guess that he just raised the interest of at least a few more clubs.

dehro

2014-06-17, 04:20 PM

Ssc Napoli seems to be interested
So far he makes "only" 300 grand a year, which makes him very affordabe for a lot of clubs

SMEE

2014-06-17, 04:26 PM

Viva Mexico! And Viva Ochoa!

Cuthalion

2014-06-17, 05:10 PM

They ALSO think they'll win the World Cup. That's some split personality right there.
Indeed.

Just the ones where the US is already pretty much the center of the universe...:smallsigh:
And online you only get to watch the pieces of the Olympics that are:

Americans
Medalists

It's so sad.

Viva Mexico! And Viva Ochoa!

Ochoa was wonderful today. It was a good match, very even.

Cicciograna

2014-06-17, 05:19 PM

Ssc Napoli seems to be interested
So far he makes "only" 300 grand a year, which makes him very affordabe for a lot of clubs

According to news, SSC Napoli is interested in anyone.
Seriously, when it comes to transfers, here in Naples we do not lend credit to newspapers: the number of names which we should be following, according to regular newspapers and online sources, is simply sheer.

Aedilred

2014-06-17, 05:46 PM

According to news, SSC Napoli is interested in anyone.
Do you reckon they'd sign me? I could do with the cash. Not willing to travel (maybe they can loan me to Millwall. Home games only).

Cristo Meyers

2014-06-17, 05:47 PM

And online you only get to watch the pieces of the Olympics that are:

Americans
Medalists

It's so sad.

I feel your pain. But it's getting better on the soccer front, at least.

Seems the '94 World Cup did its job.

Ochoa was wonderful today. It was a good match, very even.

I wish I could've seen the match. It sounded like a good one.

Looking at the group Mexico's almost a lock for advancing. But then I don't know anything about the strength of Croatia's or Cameroon's team...

Aedilred

2014-06-17, 05:51 PM

I wish I could've seen the match. It sounded like a good one.

Looking at the group Mexico's almost a lock for advancing. But then I don't know anything about the strength of Croatia's or Cameroon's team...
It wasn't a particularly high-quality match, unless you're a defensive purist (Marques did really well at managing the back three, but forward play was fairly poor from both teams), but it was pretty exciting especially towards the end.

I thought Cameroon were unimpressive against Mexico, and Croatia looked ok against Brazil. If they play like this, Mexico should get at least a point from the Croatia match, and Brazil should beat Cameroon, which would put both today's teams through.

Cristo Meyers

2014-06-17, 06:12 PM

It wasn't a particularly high-quality match, unless you're a defensive purist (Marques did really well at managing the back three, but forward play was fairly poor from both teams), but it was pretty exciting especially towards the end.

Well, still being really new to the international football scene also helps.

I thought Cameroon were unimpressive against Mexico, and Croatia looked ok against Brazil. If they play like this, Mexico should get at least a point from the Croatia match, and Brazil should beat Cameroon, which would put both today's teams through.

I hope so. I'd like to see more of this Mexico team.

TheTyrantis

2014-06-17, 06:30 PM

Cristo Meyers

2014-06-17, 06:44 PM

You'd think that if you were a goalkeeper in the World Cup, someone could have taught you to hold a ball.

Yeah, just ask Robert Green :smalltongue:

Aedilred

2014-06-17, 07:04 PM

Well, still being really new to the international football scene also helps.
Heh. It is easy to become quite jaded, and also quite nostalgic. The way I remember teams like Brazil and Columbia playing in the 90s, even a mediocre game was still a delight to watch because of the flair all over the pitch. Brazil did make a determined effort to de-flair the team in the early 00s (largely after the humiliation of the '98 final, I think) but I do suspect my memory is playing tricks and selectively editing out a lot of the dullness. I do think the quality of football today is probably higher - and certainly higher on average, but it does seem like it's not quite so spectacular and fun as it used to be. Part of that too I think is that the draw of the big European leagues is so high you don't tend to get surprise superstars in the same way you once did (although that factor was seriously in decline even by the time I started watching).

But all the same, I'll leave this here, one of the most underrated World Cup goals ever:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y8w89sl7Grc
(Worth bearing in mind that Belgium were seeded third for that WC, ahead of both finalists).

Cuthalion

2014-06-17, 07:08 PM

I feel your pain. But it's getting better on the soccer front, at least.

Seems the '94 World Cup did its job.

I wish I could've seen the match. It sounded like a good one.

Looking at the group Mexico's almost a lock for advancing. But then I don't know anything about the strength of Croatia's or Cameroon's team...

If they ever quit showing World Cup online for Free, I will cry.

It was.

I'd say Brazil and Mexico.

Ellye

2014-06-17, 07:38 PM

You'd think that if you were a goalkeeper in the World Cup, someone could have taught you to hold a ball. I feel for that Russian keeper, but sheesh, that shot had no right to be a goal if he had just got his hands right.Yeah, their goalkeeper committed quite a bit of mistakes in that match, but this one in particular was pretty big. If anyone missed it: http://nextimpulsesports.com/2014/06/17/russian-goalkeeper-flubs-easy-save-allows-embarrassing-goal-world-cup/.

Well, I figure Guillermo Ocho used up all the goalkeeping energy quota for the day.

dehro

2014-06-18, 02:40 AM

so... is there any way to watch the AUS-NDL match online today? in Italy they only show it on sky, which I don't have...

Bit Fiend

2014-06-18, 03:56 AM

so... is there any way to watch the AUS-NDL match online today? in Italy they only show it on sky, which I don't have...

You could try to get German TV on your receiver, they show all the games. We can get some Italian TV here if we try, so... give it a shot?

KuReshtin

2014-06-18, 03:57 AM

Man, I suck at predicting matches in this World Cup.
In the office pool, I'm currently shared third from last out of 42 participants.

I'm still hoping that my pick of Argentina winning it in the end comes through, though.

dehro

2014-06-18, 04:58 AM

Bit Fiend

2014-06-18, 06:05 AM

I'm still hoping that my pick of Argentina winning it in the end comes through, though.

Don't think so. IMHO they're weaker than Portugal, and we've seen what Germany did to them. (No, this is not German bias speaking... at least not entirely. :smalltongue:) Can't see them beat teams like Holland, Spain or even Italy either.

Killer Angel

2014-06-18, 06:39 AM

I'm still hoping that my pick of Argentina winning it in the end comes through, though.

Kinda optimistic, I'd say. :smallwink:

KuReshtin

2014-06-18, 06:39 AM

I don't see it.

Don't think so.

Guys. I'm 39th in a pool of 42 in picking games. I don't know anything about kickyball football. I'm not saying I THINK they will win. I'm saying I hope they win, since that would make my pre-tournament pick come through. it was a random pick. Based on no valuable information, or rather. based on no information at all.
You don't need to feel obligated to tell me why I'm wrong.

dehro

2014-06-18, 06:54 AM

lol.. you do have a point

Bit Fiend

2014-06-18, 07:09 AM

Guys. I'm 39th in a pool of 42 in picking games. I don't know anything about kickyball football. I'm not saying I THINK they will win. I'm saying I hope they win, since that would make my pre-tournament pick come through. it was a random pick. Based on no valuable information, or rather. based on no information at all.
You don't need to feel obligated to tell me why I'm wrong.

Oh... never mind, then... :smallbiggrin:

EDIT: I'm really looking forward to Chile vs. Spain tonight. Not that I'm rooting against Spain per se, but I'm a big fan of drama, and what a drama it would be if the current world (and European) champion gets kicked out during preliminaries. Not that likely to happen, but still I think we're in for a good game.

Aedilred

2014-06-18, 07:56 AM

For all that it provides drama for big teams to go out early, it's also always something of a disappointment. Everyone likes to see underdogs performing well, and surprises are always good, but what people really come to World Cups to see is heavyweight clashes and high-quality knockout matches in the later stages. This is one of the reasons the 2010 world cup felt like such a success, and 2002 such a disappointment, with only one of the pre-tournament favourites reaching the semis and many of them being eliminated in the group stages (while Germany have a proud history, they were not considered a very strong team in 2002).

The tournament would no doubt survive Spain's departure at this point, but while it's entertaining to lose the defending champions in the group stages (unless you support them, as I do...) I'm not sure it would be a positive all things considered. If you get all the shocks and drama out of the way in the group stages the knockouts can fizzle. But I am biased.

Bit Fiend

2014-06-18, 08:39 AM

You're right, but we had Spain in a titan clash already and they performed... poorly. Biggest matchup I see will be Germany vs. Holland, and Spain has to go for this to happen either way.

SaintRidley

2014-06-18, 08:40 AM

Yeah, I'd rather see the Spanish go through the Group stage. Getting knocked out in Group when you're defending champions is, well, it's French (as is self-destructing hilariously).

Cuthalion

2014-06-18, 08:58 AM

so... is there any way to watch the AUS-NDL match online today? in Italy they only show it on sky, which I don't have...

Can you get it on watchespn.com?

Aedilred

2014-06-18, 09:35 AM

Now that I think about it, it is odd that the finalists from the last WC played each other as their opening fixture. Previously the seeding system would ensure that didn't happen. In fact, this is the only the fourth time there's been a rematch between the two previous finalists at a WC at all. And the defending champion has won none of them to date.

It would be good to see Spain play Brazil at some point, firstly as a Confederations Cup rematch, also because they're two of the best teams in the world on paper. (I'd like to see Spain/Brazil - Germany too). And because matches between the hosts and defending champions don't come along very often - five times previously. Honours there are a bit more even, with champions winning three of the matches, and the hosts two.

dehro

2014-06-18, 10:04 AM

Can you get it on watchespn.com?

wrong continent for that.. but I should be ok for tonight. thanks anyway

SaintRidley

2014-06-18, 11:22 AM

Australia doesn't want to look like a pushover today with a response like that.

Cuthalion

2014-06-18, 11:57 AM

Must say I rather prefer the bright orange jerseys.

EDIT: 7 for 7 penalties this Cup!

Aedilred

2014-06-18, 12:47 PM

It'll be a shame if Australia go home with nil points. They've played really well considering the group they're in; I thought they didn't deserve to lose the Chile match, certainly by the margin they did, and they've probably deserved a draw today too.

Bit Fiend

2014-06-18, 01:19 PM

dehro

2014-06-18, 01:22 PM

I think that the two teams weren't evenly matched in terms of individual talent, but the ozzies made up for it with grit, heart and perserverance. Being biased, I'm glad it ended with a Dutch victory, but it is true that it would be a shame if they went home completely empty-handed.

Ebon_Drake

2014-06-18, 02:15 PM

I'll give german TV a try.. if I can get it. I have a way of watching english and US tv in streaming, provided it's not pay per view, but I have no idea if any channel in those countries will show the matches for free. anyhoo, I've been given a streaming option, so I should be all set. thanks.

Kind of late now, but all World Cup matches are free to view in the UK on the various BBC and ITV channels. I'm not sure how it works for international streaming, but if you've got a way to watch those channels you should hopefully be able to catch any games you want. A quick bit of Googling turned up this site (http://www.live-footballontv.com/live-world-cup-football-on-tv.html) for the listings of which matches are on which British channel.

SaintRidley

2014-06-18, 02:24 PM

And Chile is up one against Spain. Spain's got to get it together - they need to win here, pure and simple if they hope to go on.

Make that up two at the half.

Cuthalion

2014-06-18, 02:46 PM

And Chile is up one against Spain. Spain's got to get it together - they need to win here, pure and simple if they hope to go on.

Make that up two at the half.

2-0. I think Spain's going down.

Cicciograna

2014-06-18, 02:51 PM

Ahi ahi ahi, pobrecita España.

Aedilred

2014-06-18, 02:55 PM

Spain look as poor as I've ever seen them. As poor as any Spain side I've seen. This is exactly the sort of thing I've been worried was going to happen for years... This is where Del Bosque needs to earn his carrots, because as far as I can tell his input as manager has been nonexistent across his whole period in charge. Judging by everything I've previously seen from him, though, he won't have a Plan B, and I'm not sure he has faith in the right players to execute one anyway.

Bit Fiend

2014-06-18, 03:04 PM

Spain is France-ing it...

SaintRidley

2014-06-18, 03:42 PM

It's 2002 and 2010 all over again.

Cuthalion

2014-06-18, 03:53 PM

I feel bad for Spain. They're trying.

Bit Fiend

2014-06-18, 04:16 PM

I feel bad for Spain. They're trying.

Not hard enough. They weren't playing like they knew what's at stake, especially not in the first half. Honestly expected them to go serious about it and turn it around after the first goal, but nothing happend. Sad as it may be, they had it coming.

CWater

2014-06-18, 04:23 PM

I agree, Spain's game was clumsy and it didn't feel like they were trying enough.. AUS-NED was much more fun to watch than this one.

Bit Fiend

2014-06-18, 04:59 PM

Cameroon vs. Croatia underway... go black Zangief! :smallbiggrin:

Aedilred

2014-06-18, 05:06 PM

Del Bosque has to go. While I was never an enormous fan of Aragones, it was Aragones who built this team and Del Bosque has done nothing with it. He clearly hasn't put measures in place to cope with ageing players, to adjust their gameplay for when teams have worked them out, contingency plans or anything; the team's won loads of trophies but I've always felt they won them without any significant input from him and when they really needed him at this World Cup he had nothing.

When you need two goals in the last twenty minutes why take off one of the few players who's been positive from the start and replace him like-for-like? If that's your miracle plan, something's gone wrong. Why not play Fabregas, one of the few players who has ever given this Spain team some urgency? Why not Villa, for goodness' sake? Trailing 2-0 in effectively a knockout match and you leave your all-time goalscorer on the bench? Madness. If Del Bosque didn't have faith in Villa to deliver he should have brought Llorente instead.

Cuthalion

2014-06-18, 06:05 PM

Cameroon looks pretty good. But the uniforms are killing my eyes.

Wdwune

2014-06-18, 06:09 PM

Wow... I can't decide if it was Spain that disappointed or Chile that surprised. :smalleek:

comicshorse

2014-06-18, 06:24 PM

Well no one can see its been a low scoring WC so far ! May it continue so :smallcool:

Cristo Meyers

2014-06-18, 06:24 PM

Wow... I can't decide if it was Spain that disappointed or Chile that surprised. :smalleek:

I'm thinking the former. Spain just never seemed to step up like they really needed to. I remember the Spain of the 2010 Cup, and this team sure wasn't playing like that one did.

Aedilred

2014-06-18, 06:29 PM

Chile have looked pretty good in recent matches before the WC, so a strong showing from them was not a huge surprise. However they were still not expected to beat Spain, let alone so comfortably, and I think the blame for that rests largely with Spain.

While it might well drop in the knockout stages, the goals/game ratio so far in this World Cup is the highest since 1958.

Killer Angel

2014-06-19, 12:23 AM

But it's too early to consider Spain out of the game.

Apparently, I was wrong. :smallbiggrin:

banjo1985

2014-06-19, 02:53 AM

dehro

2014-06-19, 02:55 AM

Bit Fiend

2014-06-19, 03:32 AM

when I saw this guy on the TV, I just knew his face was going to spread all over the internet.
https://scontent-b-mxp.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-xpa1/t1.0-9/10438349_10203944077780127_3252304248601428233_n.j pg
though I wonder if he's misspelling things or if he's from a country where Spain is actually spelled that way..and which country that may be.

Quick check on all of Wikipedia articles about Spain in different languages reveals that none of them use this exact spelling. So unless it's a really obscure language, it's likely a misspelling.

TheTyrantis

2014-06-19, 04:53 AM

Quick check on all of Wikipedia articles about Spain in different languages reveals that none of them use this exact spelling. So unless it's a really obscure language, it's likely a misspelling.

I'm guessing either he really thought it was spelled like that or he was in such a rush to get on television that he left off the E.

dehro

2014-06-19, 06:19 AM

Either way his enthusiasm made me giggle

Aedilred

2014-06-19, 07:09 AM

Spain were appalling - no end product to all their tidy passing football. That seems to be what has gone since the last tournament, their end product. The football is still the same, a possession game based on short passes to tire out the opposition, but they rarely looked like scoring against Chile.
To be honest I thought what was missing as much as anything was the control of possession. The neat triangles were gone, and too many passes were wayward. Spain always struggled to deliver an end product anyway especially when they went with that silly 4-6-0 formation in 2012, but their possession game was good enough that they got away with it. This time out they were surrendering possession more easily, putting in longer passes, running at defenders, crossing from wide positions rather than passing back, and until Torres came on they still didn't have anybody capable of finish the moves.

For all that I've always thought Xavi was rather overrated by the pundits, he was missed. Iniesta and Busquets looked almost lost without him.

To be honest, I'm quite happy they went out - almost as dull to watch as England. The game against Uruguay tonight should be interesting though, Neither side can defend, I think it may come down to just how fit Suarez is.
You can't just insult both my teams like that! :smalltongue: England have been a lot less depressing to watch this WC though, in, admittedly, their one match so far. But England's defence is (uncharacteristically) poor, yes. For all that Ashley Cole and John Terry were horrible people, they were quite good. Uruguay's isn't as bad as it looked in the first match, though: Lugano knows what he's doing.

Ellye

2014-06-19, 08:26 AM

I'm really looking forward to England x Uruguay.
Both because I think it will be a good game, and because I'm mainly supporting Uruguay - and, after losing to Costa Rica, they need to win this one if they want to have any chance at advancing.

And sorry, Spain supporters, but I'm glad that Spain isn't advancing. Their football style might be (or have been) effective, but I've always found it extremely dull and boring to watch.

Aedilred

2014-06-19, 10:21 AM

And sorry, Spain supporters, but I'm glad that Spain isn't advancing. Their football style might be (or have been) effective, but I've always found it extremely dull and boring to watch.
Well I never liked you either! :smalltongue:

Although for what it's worth I do agree to an extent. I've never particularly liked the "total tiki-taka" style they developed. Passing the ball around with precision in midfield was quite attractive, but it caused me no end of frustration how slow progress was. The refusal to lift the ball into the air by almost anyone, or put in a long pass, or to take anything other than a short corner... has probably cost me much of my hair.

And I think that's where they went wrong this time, in part. In 2008 they had Marcos Senna, who was prepared to "play ugly" when necessary, and was the only player prepared to take a chance and hoof it occasionally - a play which bailed them out once or twice in that competition. In 2010 and 2012 they had Fabregas, who can pass the ball on the ground almost as well as Xaviesta but isn't afraid to play a bit more directly and urgently when called for. Here they didn't have anyone really prepared to play against type, and just fizzled out.