Barbarian/Frenzied Berserker

[m149307]

Would it be a bad idea to do this build if we have no healer in the group (but we can get wands)

[Red Fel]

Would it be a bad idea to do this build if we have no healer in the group (but we can get wands)

Repeat after me.

My party does not need a dedicated healer. Dedicated healers come from MMOs. D&D is not an MMO.

We also don't need a tank.

This handbook (http://www.minmaxboards.com/index.php?topic=2710.0) will tell you pretty much everything you need to know about healing. Read it. Then read it again. Share it with your friends.

The bottom line is that you don't need a healer. So play what you like. If it's fun for you and the other players, you're doing it right.

[Madara]

Just have a plan ready for when you start killing your allies. I recommend the Grease spell

[VoxRationis]

My parties get pretty cross if no one's around to heal them after a battle, though. You might want to make sure someone has healing abilities.

[Boci]

My parties get pretty cross if no one's around to heal them after a battle, though. You might want to make sure someone has healing abilities.

So ranks in UMD and wands of lesser vigour. See the handbook for a more detailed take.

[Ratatoskir]

With any type of power attack build if you actually get to attacking your party members healers aren't gonna be much help. Plan contingencies for when you get all murder-y, rather than planning to try and fix whoever you break.

[m149307]

The healer was to fix me, not the party lol. I would die after frenzy if I took enough damage

[Boci]

The healer was to fix me, not the party lol. I would die after frenzy if I took enough damage

That is what you carry a bucket around for...

In all seriousness this shouldn't be too much of a problem. Grab a blood stone for empowered vampire touch to give you a temp HP buffer, get miss chance as soon as you can, and go for it. Unless I'm missing something, frenzied berserkers aren't aren't going to be taking more damage than a barbarian would (except for the 2 sub per round, which is a pittance), so I don't see why frenzied berserker is a noteworthy bad idea in a party without a healer. If anything deathless frenzy is a boon in this reguard, because it gives the healer more time to fix you up. Just make sure they have a wand of grease/summon monster to keep you occupied whilst this happens.

[ArqArturo]

A warlock with UMD and some healing items can fill the healer role.

The only reason people need 'a healer' is when they know the DM throws monkeywrenches.

Also, whenever I see the Frenzied Berserker, I remember the Rorschach line from Watchmen:

None of you seem to understand. I'm not locked in here with you. You're locked in here with *ME*!

[Sith_Happens]

Friends don't let friends play Frenzied Berserkers, it's extremely bad for the party's health.

[m149307]

If they can stop the Barb, then it is fine. and since I play with semi-optimized counterparts, it should be fine.

[Andezzar]

If they can stop the Barb, then it is fine. and since I play with semi-optimized counterparts, it should be fine.The grease spell or marbles should be suitable off switches for the Frenzied Berserker.

The question then is, how would the party know to employ those?

[m149307]

We have a caster who has Celerity. Assuming they didn't use it (big assumption) he sees me coming at him or anyone else roaring with bloodlust and swinging my blade... yeah I assume the caster will disable me before I permanently disable him.

[Andezzar]

We have a caster who has Celerity. Assuming they didn't use it (big assumption) he sees me coming at him or anyone else roaring with bloodlust and swinging my blade... yeah I assume the caster will disable me before I permanently disable him.That's not what I meant. I meant that the characters need to know that the frenzied berserker will auto-fail balance checks (which raging barbarians don't). That's why Grease and marbles are so great against them. Otherwise the rest of the party might feel compelled to use more drastic measures.

[m149307]

idk, the group would go for nonlethal if possible (hopefully). And they would also see the damage that I took and kept going, so they would be able to safely assume that the only way to stop me is subdue me, not try and kill me. Thus, trip/lose balance/grapple (I hope they don't try this last one)

[Andezzar]

idk, the group would go for nonlethal if possible (hopefully). And they would also see the damage that I took and kept going, so they would be able to safely assume that the only way to stop me is subdue me, not try and kill me. Thus, trip/lose balance/grapple (I hope they don't try this last one)The problem is, with frenzied berserkers you need something that shuts them down in one action, because once the berserker gets to act, you are likely dead. It does not do to whittle him down with non-lethal damage. Also by the point that he simply keeps on going despite being mortally wounded, who is to know that non-lethal damage is not similarly ignored?

[Garktz]

wand of summon moster I

Cheap, keep summoning in a line away from the party and just go away chasing celestial owls or whatever you want

[ArqArturo]

Would Righteous Wrath work on FB?.

[RolkFlameraven]

DM preview... as it is written? No. Though it doesn't really make much sense as a feat as it is written either. "distinguish friend from foe even in the heat of your rage." Normal rage doesn't have that problem after all and that is the grey area.

[Garktz]

DM preview... as it is written? No. Though it doesn't really make much sense as a feat as it is written either. "distinguish friend from foe even in the heat of your rage." Normal rage doesn't have that problem after all and that is the grey area.

so you just have to rage while go on frenzy....

[Biffoniacus_Furiou]

Take the feat Righteous Wrath in BoED, no more risk of killing your whole party every time you stub your toe.

[Andezzar]

so you just have to rage while go on frenzy....That Is what you would do anyways for the +10 STR. Unfortunately by RAW Righteous Wrath does nothing to alleviate the drawbacks of Frenzy, it only removes nonexistent drawbacks from Rage.

And it does nothing to the fact that anyone with a readied action and marbles can shut the FB down.

[Biffoniacus_Furiou]

That Is what you would do anyways for the +10 STR. Unfortunately by RAW Righteous Wrath does nothing to alleviate the drawbacks of Frenzy, it only removes nonexistent drawbacks from Rage.

"While raging, you maintain clarity of mind unusual among
barbarians. You are perfectly able to deal nonlethal damage, stop
your attacks to show mercy, and distinguish friend from foe
even in the heat of your rage."

Even while in a Frenzy, you can do the above as long as you have Rage active.

[Andezzar]

"While raging, you maintain clarity of mind unusual among
barbarians.While this would technically also affect a character who is in a rage and a frenzy at the same time, it has no quantifiable effect.


You are perfectly able to deal nonlethal damage, stop
your attacks to show mercy, and distinguish friend from foe
even in the heat of your rage."So does the feat also make you immune to mind-affecting abilities that would cause you to attack friends or prohibit you from dealing non-lethal damage? The feat says nothing about changing other conditions besides rage. Does it mean you can still deal nonleathal damage while unconscious?

Even if it worked that way, you could only refrain from attacking your friends to show mercy, not for any other reason. Bering able to recognize a target as a friend does not prevent you from attacking it.