Looking for multiclass help

[Reprimand]

I'm trying to come up with a character that can do a bit of everything Heal/Fight/Use offensive magic.

My DM is not worrying multiclass penalties and would like to avoid going into PrCs because were trying to stay with core for the most part.


I also want to avoid bard because I don't want to bother with the music/preform/BardicKnowledge gimmicks

I wanted to get maybe 2nd or 3rd level casting in divine and arcane casting and have a decent bab

Is there a variant of the bard that gets rid of music and just adds more attack/magic etc?

Factotum is also banned.

Not worried about being MAD.

[Ratatoskir]

Bard is kinda perfect for this...

But if you don't want that, well, rogues gives you 3/4ths BAB, has plenty of skills for being versatile including Use Magic Device for getting your magic fix. If human, you could build into the Chameleon prestige class from Races of Destiny, whose whole schtick is doing a little bit of everything.

Edit: Didn't see the no prestige classes, ignore my last line

[Rebel7284]

Druid? Seriously, it can do all the things.

Druid 3/Wizard 3/Arcane Heirophant X also works, but is weaker than full druid and is also a prestige class.

[weckar]

Just before you discount Bard completely, if there ever was a class easily re-fluffed it was that. Remember that not all perform skills necessarily to do with music. Your magic can just as easily come from rousing speeches (perform[oratory]), punning and mocking enemies (perform[comedy]) or just standing there humming to yourself (perform [modern art]).

[Trundlebug]

Druid or DFI Bardsader? Cleric/Crusader/RKV does all those things. Mystic Fiii....crap core sorry. Druid? :smallbiggrin:

[Reprimand]

I'm sure I could get him to work in the completes but that'd be the LIMIT and complete champion would be off limits all together because he hates that book.

Um is there a variant of the bard that loses music/preform for combat/casting?

or does anyone know of any fairly balanced homebrew that would work?

[weckar]

Well, there's the archaeologist archetype in PF, but 3rd edition has no equivalent. You might take that as 'official homebrew'.

[Rebel7284]

There is also Fochlucan Lyrist if completes are available. The expected entry still requires you to take at least 1 level of bard, however.

The most powerful build that includes all your requirements is still Druid 20 by the way, even with completes included. :)

[Reprimand]

Not worried about power at all.

Just a guy who does lots of things...

Um, hell I might as well tell you the concept.

Ever heard of or play .hack// ? I'm trying to make kite / a twin blade character with some general magic

[weckar]

Wouldn't that be a straight Ranger, then?

[Reprimand]

Would that work? I'm not sure honestly.

I was trying to work in some evocation magic

[weckar]

Would be easier to put more magic in the ranger than to take perform out of the Bard.

[Reprimand]

What would be fair to trade off of the ranger class ability list for some spontaneous arcane casting?

[weckar]

Well, a Ranger in the league of getting spells could easily qualify for Spontaneous Healer (feat, complete divine). That at least covers that aspect of the character. Not sure about the more blasty stuff.

[Reprimand]

Fair enough I guess the rest is up to DM negotiation. Thanks for the help. I still feel stupid for not realizing ranger right off the bat. : P

[Person_Man]

Are there specific arcane spells that you want? Because Clerics can gain access to a variety of arcane spells through domains, including most of the sought after ones, like Alter Self, Polymorph, Invisibility/Greater Inv/Mislead, Sold Fog, etc. Cleric 5/Full spell progressing Prestige Class X or something close to it would be your Tier 1 option. (You can also access Domains for other divine classes with certain PrC and Feats, IIRC).

There are a bunch of Alternate Class Features (http://community.wizards.com/forum/previous-editions-character-optimization/threads/1151316) (and maybe some Racial Substitution levels?) which trade away Bardic music for other stuff. But in most cases, people who don't like the "music" aspect of Bard just refluff it (Perform: Oratory) or they take one or more Feats that burn Bardic Music uses, and they use that resource to power the Feats (like Snowflake Wardance, Doomspeak, Dragonfire Inspiration, etc.) instead of the default class abilities. This works particularly well for a Bard/Crusader or Bard/Whatever/Prestige Class.

You can also take the Sword of the Arcane Order Feat to memorize Wizard spells in your Ranger or Paladin spell slots. This works particularly well with Ranger if you also take the Wildshape alternate class feature, or with Paladin if your DM allows it to work with the Battle Blessing Feat (which lets you cast Standard Action Paladin spells as a Swift Action). You can also Share Spells with your Animal Companion or Special Mount (which can be further improved Leadership or various other Feats/Prestige Classes).