Cool tricks for a low-level Alchemist?

[Urpriest]

I've got a chance to play in a Pathfinder game for the first time in some time, and I've been meaning to try an Alchemist for a long while. The game starts at third level, and I probably won't be sticking around long enough to get past fourth, so I'm looking for a build that matures fast and feels unique early on. What are some cool things you can do as a low-level Alchemist? Or should I try a class that hits its stride earlier?

I'd like to stick to pure PF content, with no third party. Not sure on the DM's source rules yet, but I'm assuming that's the baseline.

[jaydubs]

1) Take the accelerated drinker trait. Use spring loaded wrist sheathes. Now you can swift action retrieve a potions/extract/mutagen, move action drink, and use your standard action to throw a bomb. Even better than wrist sheathes, play a tiefling with a prehensile tail to do this with all of your drinkables.

2) It might be too expensive for level 3, but a sipping jacket can be quite useful. Pour an extract of targeted bomb admixture into it, and you can use a swift action to switch to single target damage whenever you like.

3) If you are afraid of running out of bombs at low levels, pick up a hybridization funnel. With crafter's fortune, you can take 10 at that level to combine acid and alchemist's fire flasks for what's basically extra bombs at that level.

4) If you're allowed to craft before the game, do so. Lots of alchemical items are useful at low levels, and you can save money crafting your own.

5) This is less of a tip, and more of a reminder. Bombs target touch AC. I've played with quite a few people who don't know this.

Edit: Some other stuff.

Take a look at this guide for some more ideas. http://pathfinder.ogrehut.com/2010/07/alchemist-build-guide/

Also, if you want something other than bombs, consider a vivisectionist with feral mutagen. 3 attacks, 2d6 sneak attack, high strength.

[NamelessNPC]

Number 1 doesn't work, drinking an extract is always a standard action

[avr]

A grenadier archetype alchemist can attach alchemical weapons to normal weapons. Works well with the hybridisation funnel jaydubs mentioned. You're a bit vulnerable in melee so use a reach or ranged weapon.

The bramble brewer is a half elf racial archetype which makes your bombs into decent battlefield control, without costing damage. Compatible with the grenadier if you want to do both.

[StreamOfTheSky]

I hate the bomb mechanic and prefer vivisectionist alchemist, but level 3 is actually a pretty magical level for bombers. If you take Smoke Bomb at level 2, you can use your feat at level 3 for Stink Bomb to be the only person in the game w/ stinking cloud (albeit smaller radius and only 1 round after they leave are they nauseated) that early. Everyone else has to wait till level 5+. That's pretty potent.

As always with a bomber, you want to be a Mindchemist, the int boost will buff save DCs (and damage dealt, which I guess is still not a horrible use of bombs at lower level). Pick a race that can get an int bonus and max it out like you were a wizard, and ideally also a race that gives more bombs per day or higher bomb damage (it applies to the splash too, which is nice) as a favored class choice. Normally, races w/ +1/6 of a discovery would be amazing, but if you're stopping at level 4, that will never hit pay dirt.

Your level 1 feat can be Splash Weapon Mastery (extra 5 ft square of splash, better accuracy), or whatever else you want. Extra traits is always solid, there's a ton of great traits and you might want more than 2.

[Urpriest]

1) Take the accelerated drinker trait. Use spring loaded wrist sheathes. Now you can swift action retrieve a potions/extract/mutagen, move action drink, and use your standard action to throw a bomb. Even better than wrist sheathes, play a tiefling with a prehensile tail to do this with all of your drinkables.

As has been mentioned by NamelessNPC, the applicability of Accelerated Drinker to extracts is a little dubious. In other games I might try to argue it, but in this case I don't want to rock the boat. Is it worth it at this level if it only applies to potions?



2) It might be too expensive for level 3, but a sipping jacket can be quite useful. Pour an extract of targeted bomb admixture into it, and you can use a swift action to switch to single target damage whenever you like.

Like Accelerated Drinker, I think I probably won't get this to be able to apply to extracts.



3) If you are afraid of running out of bombs at low levels, pick up a hybridization funnel. With crafter's fortune, you can take 10 at that level to combine acid and alchemist's fire flasks for what's basically extra bombs at that level.

4) If you're allowed to craft before the game, do so. Lots of alchemical items are useful at low levels, and you can save money crafting your own.

Ooh, I hadn't even thought about alchemical items. With Int added, at this level...definitely a potent option.



Also, if you want something other than bombs, consider a vivisectionist with feral mutagen. 3 attacks, 2d6 sneak attack, high strength.

I'm a bit reluctant to go vivisectionist from this one. I'm a temporary player in a mid-op group, so I'd rather not do something overly flashy (like buckets of melee damage) and instead focus on tricks and versatility.


A grenadier archetype alchemist can attach alchemical weapons to normal weapons. Works well with the hybridisation funnel jaydubs mentioned. You're a bit vulnerable in melee so use a reach or ranged weapon.

Ooh cool. This raises some questions:

1. Can I apply alchemical stuff to others' weapons?

2. Do I get to apply my Int bonus to damage?



The bramble brewer is a half elf racial archetype which makes your bombs into decent battlefield control, without costing damage. Compatible with the grenadier if you want to do both.

Interesting. The description makes it sound like it does cost damage, though, and it doesn't let me get Stinking Cloud.


I hate the bomb mechanic and prefer vivisectionist alchemist, but level 3 is actually a pretty magical level for bombers. If you take Smoke Bomb at level 2, you can use your feat at level 3 for Stink Bomb to be the only person in the game w/ stinking cloud (albeit smaller radius and only 1 round after they leave are they nauseated) that early. Everyone else has to wait till level 5+. That's pretty potent.

As always with a bomber, you want to be a Mindchemist, the int boost will buff save DCs (and damage dealt, which I guess is still not a horrible use of bombs at lower level). Pick a race that can get an int bonus and max it out like you were a wizard, and ideally also a race that gives more bombs per day or higher bomb damage (it applies to the splash too, which is nice) as a favored class choice. Normally, races w/ +1/6 of a discovery would be amazing, but if you're stopping at level 4, that will never hit pay dirt.

Your level 1 feat can be Splash Weapon Mastery (extra 5 ft square of splash, better accuracy), or whatever else you want. Extra traits is always solid, there's a ton of great traits and you might want more than 2.

Groovy stuff all in all. Pure damage seems like it can be covered by hybridized alchemical items at this level, so having a trick like low-level Stinking Cloud is very nice.

It looks like I can't combine Grenadier and Mindchemist, owing to the fact that they both replace Poison Use. Is Mindchemist sustainable at this level? Two ability damage whenever the mutagen wears off seems to mandate two days of downtime per use without easy access to the Restoration line.

[StreamOfTheSky]

I guess it depends if you're adventuring constantly or not. You will heal 1 per day, as long as you adventure only every other day on average it should balance out. Some lesser restoration just in case wouldn't be a bad idea. It's a level 1 paladin spell, try to get scrolls/potions/wand of one made by a paladin.

It is certainly an annoyance, not sure why they felt the need to impose that. But the +2 save DC and damage is nice and it penalizes str, a dump stat. Dex from normal mutagen certainly isn't bad either, but touch AC isn't hard to hit, and with stink bombs you care more about just landing it in the right spot than directly hitting someone.

[avr]

Ooh cool. This raises some questions:

1. Can I apply alchemical stuff to others' weapons?

2. Do I get to apply my Int bonus to damage?
1 - yes, though many DMs would get tetchy if you tried to do so while they were swinging said weapon. You could certainly infuse an arrow and drop it in their quiver & it'd work if it was fired within 1 minute, or buff them immediately before combat.

2 - the item specifically doesn't splash when used this way and Int to damage here applies specifically to splash weapons. I don't think so but I could be wrong.

[SkarnerDaBest]

This is easily my favorite class in pathfinder, because of the fun things you can do.

My recommendation for maximum fun, not necessarily numbers, is to get a tumor familiar. Make it a raven, and then just like a real raven, it can talk. Enjoy how disgusted and unnerved your fellow party members become. Then follow that up and start growing arms.

Like i said, it may not yield the best numbers, but for a character that may be short played, it will at least make a memorable experience.

[Urpriest]

1 - yes, though many DMs would get tetchy if you tried to do so while they were swinging said weapon. You could certainly infuse an arrow and drop it in their quiver & it'd work if it was fired within 1 minute, or buff them immediately before combat.


Hmm...with a couple prep rounds, this would basically make me a DFI bard...cool stuff, if I end up in a more melee/archery heavy party.

[Incorrect]

The beastmorph archtype gives you some utility; vision, scent and swim. And it doesn't really cost you much. It can even be combined with Mindchemist.

I would suggest going all out on alchemical items and the hybridization funnel. Hybridize everything!
Alchemist Fire and Liquid Ice, for the burning ice flavor.
or Burst Jar and Ghast Retch, for auto sicken and deafen (save vs worse conditions)

[13ones]

Okay, you ready to be better than everyone else at everything possible? Yes? Okay, lets go.

Start off by taking the Vivisectionist (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/classes/base-classes/alchemist/archetypes/paizo---alchemist-archetypes/vivisectionist). This drops your bombs in favor of sneak attack damage. As your first discovery at level 2 I suggest you take Feral Mutagen (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/classes/base-classes/alchemist/discoveries/paizo---alchemist-discoveries/feral-mutagen). Feral Mutagen gives you a bite attack (1D8 if Medium sized), and two claw attacks (1D6 per claw, if Medium sized). So at level 3 you have three attacks all at your highest bab and all dealing sneak attack if you managed to get within range of them in the first few rounds. So you're not only attack more often than everyone else, you're also hitting more often and harder.

Basically, as I fluff it, you drink a potion or three and turn into a large sized, invisible werewolf.

Have fun.

[Psyren]

Another cool archetype I haven't seen mentioned is Preservationist, which (along with the Planar Preservationist feat) turns you into a pokemon master. Unlike other summoning classes, your summons are a standard action, It also boosts the power of the class considerably since you can go all the way up to SMIX and SNAIX. ("I choose you!")

[stack]

Another cool archetype I haven't seen mentioned is Preservationist, which (along with the Planar Preservationist feat) turns you into a pokemon master. Unlike other summoning classes, your summons are a standard action, It also boosts the power of the class considerably since you can go all the way up to SMIX and SNAIX. ("I choose you!")

If I'm not mistaken, you can combine this with infusion to let the entire party have one huge summoning nova. Then sit back and watch the next round take two hours.:smalltongue:

[Psyren]

If I'm not mistaken, you can combine this with infusion to let the entire party have one huge summoning nova. Then sit back and watch the next round take two hours.:smalltongue:

Unfortunately that won't work since Infusion specifies that non-alchemists can "imbibe" it. The summoning extracts are not drunk, merely unstoppered, and only the alchemist can do so to cast the spell.

[Urpriest]

Another cool archetype I haven't seen mentioned is Preservationist, which (along with the Planar Preservationist feat) turns you into a pokemon master. Unlike other summoning classes, your summons are a standard action, It also boosts the power of the class considerably since you can go all the way up to SMIX and SNAIX. ("I choose you!")

Preservationist is really rad...but at this level, it only allows SNAI (and I guess SMI with Planar Preservationist?). I feel like summoning hasn't really hit its stride yet.

[Eldaran]

Unfortunately that won't work since Infusion specifies that non-alchemists can "imbibe" it. The summoning extracts are not drunk, merely unstoppered, and only the alchemist can do so to cast the spell.

The archetype specifically mentions you can use infusions "If the preservationist has the infusion discovery, another character can use the infused specimen."

[Psyren]

The archetype specifically mentions you can use infusions "If the preservationist has the infusion discovery, another character can use the infused specimen."

Ah, my mistake. In that case, pass them around indeed and be team pokemon.

[magotter]

I'm really rather surprised that no one has mentioned Potion Glutton (http://www.archivesofnethys.com/FeatDisplay.aspx?ItemName=Potion%20Glutton) yet.

Unabashedly the best Alchemist feat bar none; it even states "other potables" as part of the description. And the feat requirement is easy enough: worship urgathoa by simply believing in the pantheon she belongs to.

[Eldaran]

That feat doesn't even make sense, normally drinking a potion is a standard action not a move action.

[Urpriest]

I'm really rather surprised that no one has mentioned Potion Glutton (http://www.archivesofnethys.com/FeatDisplay.aspx?ItemName=Potion%20Glutton) yet.

Unabashedly the best Alchemist feat bar none; it even states "other potables" as part of the description. And the feat requirement is easy enough: worship urgathoa by simply believing in the pantheon she belongs to.

Hmm, the value really depends on whether extracts count as potables though. :smalltongue:


That feat doesn't even make sense, normally drinking a potion is a standard action not a move action.

But the existence of the feat changes it, of course. :smallwink::smalltongue:

[magotter]

Hmm, the value really depends on whether extracts count as potables though.

Look, this is all very RAI, since it doesn't implicitly mention extracts by name, sure. However, the following snippets are from the Alchemist's page:

"Alchemists are not only masters of creating ... magical potion-like extracts in which they can store spell effects."
"Extracts are the most varied of the three. In many ways, they behave like spells in potion form..."
"An extract is “cast” by drinking it, as if imbibing a potion..."

Now, of course, feel free to cue or queue the obligatory "potion-like doesn't imply potion" arguments. However, for as long as this class has been around, I've always had the opinion that since Extracts act as "potions, but better," that they ought to benefit from any potion-enhancing feats/traits/items/etc.

Your mileage may vary.