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View Full Version : Two level-based fighter abilities [Fix]



Yakk
2007-02-24, 01:15 PM
So the Fighter can be useful, if they can force the creature to fight the Fighter, and isn't made useless by a single cast of a save-or-suck spell.

These are the two weaknesses of the Fighter I'm going to patch.

First, I'm going to give the Fighter a level-based ability to ignore magic. Not completely ignore it -- the Fighter is weakened by each spell they ignore, ignoring a spell consumes move actions, and the Fighter can fail to ignore a particular spell.

Second, I'm giving the ability for a Fighter to Intercept targets and stop them from moving. So when a dragon does a flyby attack, the Fighter hits the dragon with his greatsword, knocking the beast out of the sky.

Both of these abilities are fighter-level based, so they are a reason to take fighter levels.

Ignore Magic: Fighter Level+Con Bonus for checks.
As a move-equivilent action that may be done even when incapacitated by magic, a fighter may attempt to ignore the effects of any spell or magical effect with a duration. (note spells or effects with an instant duration, such as fireball, cannot be ignored)

Make an Ignore Magic check against a DC of (10+caster level of effect+spell level of effect) (for effects without a caster level, use (15+CR)). On success, the Fighter's actions can ignore the spell effect for (str bonus) rounds.

The fighter takes a -1 penalty to all rolls for 10 rounds after ignoring magic.

This ability can include shooting an arrow through a wind wall, walking through a wall of force, seeing even though blinded, hitting a wizard through stone skin, etc. The fighter need not know the exact nature of the spell to ignore it, and once the fighter ignores one component of the spell the others are ignored freely.

Interception of Opportunity:
A Fighter can choose to consume her action to Intercept until her next turn.

While Intercepting, the Fighter can move up to half her move as an Immediate action. The Fighter can do this in the middle of some other creature's move.

While Intercepting, the Fighter can never do more than 1 AoO per target.

While Intercepting, the Fighter can oppose "combat casting" concentration checks with a (Fighter Level+Dex) roll.

If the Fighter is using a ranged weapon, she can make AoO at targets who provoke an AoO within 30' (PB) range. This does not mean she threatens that 30' range -- movement does not trigger an AoO.

If the Fighter is using a melee weapon, she gains an AoO against anyone who moves into or out of any square the Fighter threatens.

If a Fighter hits on an AoO while Intercepting, the target is must make a fortitude save against DC (10+Fighter Level+dex). On failure, the target can no longer move until their next turn. This is in addition to any other effects of being hit. If a creature is flying and cannot hover, the creature starts to fall at the point where the fighter hit it.

...

Note that one could cheese this into being somewhat broken, but I'm aiming at fixing the fighter from the core.

jlousivy
2007-02-24, 01:21 PM
as for ignoring magic... i dont think it makes any sense that a fighter can walk through a wall of force... i'd say that spells effecting the fighter, ie: slow can allow a second saving throw (if failed) and if he passes that saving throw he can act for (str bonus) rounds and then be affected by said magic, i don't know if the 'suppressed' rounds should be counted against the duration or not.

Yakk
2007-02-24, 01:56 PM
Why is walking through a wall of force or a force cage any different than shooting an arrow through a wind wall?

Note that a fighter has roughly a 50/50 chance to ignore an even-leveled casters spells. A con-monkey can get a better chance. So ignoring magic isn't easy.

And it isn't cheap -- that cumulative -1 penalty to all rolls can get punishing if a Wizard really wants to stop you in your tracks.

jlousivy
2007-02-24, 02:17 PM
I just gave the walking through a wall of force as an example. A 50/50 chance to ignore spells to me seems a little too good. However fighters shouldn't be able to ignore things such as anti-magic fields (a -1 penalty but keep magic equipment working? yes please!) Illusion spells are partially real and can be disbelieved--- other spells that physically bring stuff into existance that isn't just mental-- no logical reason someone can completely ignore it

Baron Corm
2007-02-24, 02:22 PM
the trouble is, you aren't fixing the Fighter, you're creating a new mage slaying class. resisting magic is not in the Fighter's flavor, unless it's with some sort of special technique or combat training, like the second ability.

nivek1234
2007-02-24, 02:29 PM
... and once the fighter ignores one component of the spell the others are ignored freely.

Does that mean the spell is ignored for the remaining duration of the spell?

I could see making changes to which mod is being used for flavor (i.e. dex for wind wall, str for force wall, etc.), but that would make the system rather complicated.

Draz74
2007-02-27, 12:30 AM
the trouble is, you aren't fixing the Fighter, you're creating a new mage slaying class. resisting magic is not in the Fighter's flavor, unless it's with some sort of special technique or combat training, like the second ability.

Comments like this make me laugh. Because I compare them with comments (complaints) like, "The fighter should be able to do something that no other class can do." Which isn't possible as long as part of the Fighter's perceived "flavor" is ... not doing anything that no other class can do.

I know, that's not exactly what you said ... but it seems to me that it's generally the direction that comments like this tend to lead.

Of course, that doesn't mean you're wrong; maybe the people that say "the Fighter should be able to do something no one else can do" are wrong. But they can't both be right!

Yakk
2007-03-05, 01:38 PM
I am looking at this more from the "4 core classes" -- priest, mage, theif, warrior.

The above gives the Warrior archtype something special to do. First, the Warrior archtype becomes very effective against casters.

Second, the Warrior archtype can no longer be ignored in combat, just because it doesn't do the most damage.

Note that the interception ability can be used without the anti-mage ability. Interception solves a huge amount of the mobility problem of warriors -- if you have to get close to your target to fight it, the warrior can bodyguard characters effectively.

The anti-mage ability is intended to generate the fantasy feel of the warrior forcing his way through the opponent's spells. "That's impossible" is the feeling I want to evoke.