Anyway to Summon a Lemure (the devil) for an entire day as a level 7 wizard?

[Yogibear41]

Is there anyway to summon a Lemure for approximately 24 hours, as a level 7ish wizard, every day repeatedly without having to spend gold/xp on components? It doesn't actually need to do anything but sit there, and it needs to be a different Lemure every time. Also it would be good if I didn't piss of any super powerful devils that would want to come and kill me in the process.


For those curious why: from Fiendish Codex II, Lemures "are in constant physical agony" so they are the perfect candidate for the production of Liquid Pain.


I could do it at level 9 with a Lesser Planar Binding, but is there another way to do it by level 7, or is there a safer way to do it?

[Grod_The_Giant]

You need Lesser Planar Binding, a 5th level spell. Hmm... I'm pretty sure there are ways to cast high-level spells from low-level slots, but from what I remember they're feat intensive, and the only one I can think off-hand doesn't work with wizards.

So, ah... wait until level 9?

[Yogibear41]

Ha Grod you beat me to my edit. :smallsmile:

[atemu1234]

Ha Grod you beat me to my edit. :smallsmile:

At level seven, hire a better wizard to do it for you. Maybe it could be done. I think there are rules for hiring mages.

[Grod_The_Giant]

At level seven, hire a better wizard to do it for you. Maybe it could be done. I think there are rules for hiring mages.
450 gold/casting (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/equipment/goodsAndServices.htm#spellcastingAndServices), assuming you can find a wizard of exactly 9th level. It's not the best solution.

How many build resources can you devote to this?

[ryu]

How much cheese are you okay with and how how lenient is your table? We have ways of making this happen from level one if you're willing to be a silly man.

[Rubik]

If you've got enough metamagic reducers available, an Ocular Spell'd Persistent Spell'd Summon Monster can last all day.

[Nettlekid]

Why does it need to be a different one every time? My suggestion would be to buy a scroll of Halaster's Fetch II, a 5th level spell (you could also ask another Wizard to cast it for you, like the Planar Binding suggestion.) The Halaster's Fetch line of spells works like Summon Monster but three levels higher, and while you have control over the monster summoned for a round/level like normal, at the end of the duration the monster doesn't actually go back but instead stays where it is, here on the Material Plane. Summon (technically Call) a single Lemure with it, trap it, use it forever.

[Vaz]

Is there anyway to summon a Lemure for approximately 24 hours, as a level 7ish wizard, every day repeatedly without having to spend gold/xp on components? It doesn't actually need to do anything but sit there, and it needs to be a different Lemure every time. Also it would be good if I didn't piss of any super powerful devils that would want to come and kill me in the process.


For those curious why: from Fiendish Codex II, Lemures "are in constant physical agony" so they are the perfect candidate for the production of Liquid Pain.


I could do it at level 9 with a Lesser Planar Binding, but is there another way to do it by level 7, or is there a safer way to do it?

Just get a box of lego, turn off the lights in a room with no windows, then scatter it everywhere, lock in some commoners, et voila. Instant liquid pain.

[ryu]

Just get a box of lego, turn off the lights in a room with no windows, then scatter it everywhere, lock in some commoners, et voila. Instant liquid pain.

Get this man an entire jar of cookies. He has earned it.

[Yogibear41]

Legos? like the building blocks? (child-hood flash back of boxes of lego's and pieces strewn all over the floor) Also I'm just spit balling for some character ideas I had, the person doing the work would be my necropolitan wizard cohort from undead leadership for a Paladin of Tyranny/Bone Knight/Lich. Honestly, since he and I are both going to be evil (lawful) I sort of want to keep him under-powered so I don't have to deal with him trying to kill me later. The DM would be making him/playing him I would merely suggest the things that I want him to be able to do mostly magic item creation (drain that XP to keep his level down!) and utility, + raising some undead here and there. This is sort of a backup plan for XP as I don't want him to be drained of so much XP that he is useless(or he figured out I'm intentionally keeping his low), but I also don't want him to be so powerful I have to deal with him trying to usurp me. Keep in mind this is all theoretical atm, and I have no idea if the guy (or girl) would actually try to take me out, I'm just trying to prepare for lots of possible scenarios.

[Yogibear41]

Why does it need to be a different one every time? My suggestion would be to buy a scroll of Halaster's Fetch II, a 5th level spell (you could also ask another Wizard to cast it for you, like the Planar Binding suggestion.) The Halaster's Fetch line of spells works like Summon Monster but three levels higher, and while you have control over the monster summoned for a round/level like normal, at the end of the duration the monster doesn't actually go back but instead stays where it is, here on the Material Plane. Summon (technically Call) a single Lemure with it, trap it, use it forever.

It doesn't have to be different every time, but you can only make X liquid pain doses where X is the creatures con score, in this case a 10, so after 10 days the critter would be of no more use.

[Flickerdart]

If you're evil, why do you want a lemure? Why not just kidnap and torture random creatures?

[Rubik]

If you're evil, why do you want a lemure? Why not just kidnap and torture random creatures?Maybe he's squeamish, or he prefers to do evil unto Evil.

[Jeff the Green]

Have you considered more mundane solutions? Because you can take a nice non-sentient monstrous spider, rip off its legs, apply some rough bandages so it doesn't haemolymphorrhage out, and go with that. Plenty of other creatures could work if you feel like being evil. I'd recommend avoiding puppies, though. I know it sounds like a good idea, but their rapid heartrate means that they die far too quickly for this sort of thing.

[Yogibear41]

If you're evil, why do you want a lemure? Why not just kidnap and torture random creatures?


Because that is more CE or NE, while this fellow will be LE. Not that I am opposed to killing commoners, wanton slaughter is not exactly going to be his style. Additionally in the long run I might attempt to create an undead army that I might march across the country side, or simply settle in an area that I know has been to hostile for the other civilizations to get a decent foot hole in, and I don't want to be preemptively eradicated because at a lower level I attracted to much attention from the powers that be.

But probably an even better reason to do it is because, I don't have to go looking for said creatures. I can set up a place in my keep/stronghold/etc. that is specifically designed for the summoning and then housing of the creature. As an undead creature I can hide myself away from the world for a few hundred years or so if need be, slowly gathering components and growing my skeletal/zombie horde, without ever leaving the safety of my stronghold. Because its dangers out there for an adventurer ha ha.


Obviously almost anything can be tortured and dealt pain to extract it from, the point of the Lemure is that I don't have to waste resources or time actually torturing it, I just have to port it in and then siphon off the good stuff.

[Rubik]

And here I thought you had a phobia against commoners.

Alektorophobia, probably.

[Jeff the Green]

Obviously almost anything can be tortured and dealt pain to extract it from, the point of the Lemure is that I don't have to waste resources or time actually torturing it, I just have to port it in and then siphon off the good stuff.

This is why one outsources the work. You have to come in every day anyway to cast liquid pain, so dominate person a spider breeder and give him some zombies to do the gruntwork. Ideally you're doing something that's a torture-and-forget thing like ripping off legs or sticking them in an iron maiden (widow?) with a source of healing or giving them a disease.

Of course, my favorite solution is to open free hospitals for those who can't afford cure disease. It's a bit more work to set up, but you have the added benefit of an enormous number of people who will be angry if their government opposes your zombie-fueled plans. They might even welcome you as a liberator.

[Flickerdart]

Of course, my favorite solution is to open free hospitals for those who can't afford cure disease. It's a bit more work to set up, but you have the added benefit of an enormous number of people who will be angry if their government opposes your zombie-fueled plans. They might even welcome you as a liberator.
There's evil, and then there's just plain mean. :smallamused:

[Rubik]

There's evil, and then there's just plain mean. :smallamused:Even better invest in nipple clamps of exquisite pain in lieu of anesthetics. Then you can make both Liquid Pain and Ambrosia.

[Jeff the Green]

There's evil, and then there's just plain mean. :smallamused:

Well, you're actually providing the care* (can't have someone doing a survival rate study and exposing you), and you have all the incentive in the world to continue providing the care once you invade, so this is probably a net Good. It probably won't make up for all the times you'll be casting contagion, but you can't have everything.

*Even given the best level 1 expert healers (Heal modifier +9), they'll stay an average of 4.3 days with a DC 16 illness, so as long as you have new disease cases equal to the number of times you can cast liquid pain a day divided by 4.3 you should have plenty of patients. I recommend Cackle Fever for this, as it does more damage than blinding sickness (so longer to recover from the ability damage to the point they're sane enough to leave) and doesn't blind your future subjects.

[Karsh]

Even better invest in nipple clamps of exquisite pain in lieu of anesthetics. Then you can make both Liquid Pain and Ambrosia.

/thread

additional characters

[Eldan]

...as it does more damage than blinding sickness (so longer to recover from the ability damage to the point they're sane enough to leave) and doesn't blind your future subjects.

But if you do go with blinding sickness, you can get an eyepatch for style points. Because you'll be the one-eyed man in the land of the blind.

[atemu1234]

You could probably do it with a box, a stick, some string and peanut butter, if your DM is strict about the random encounter tables.

[Gabrosin]

If you took the Spontaneous Divination ACF at level 5, you could use your level 6 feat on Versatile Spellcaster, since you now have the "ability to spontaneously cast spells". Would let you expend two level 4 spells (I'll assume you've got a bonus for high intelligence or an extra spell for being a specialist wizard) to cast a level 5 spell you know (Lesser Planar Binding).

There are probably other ways to qualify for Versatile Spellcaster as a wizard, but Spontaneous Divination is pretty good on its own.

[Droningbass]

I think that I have a potential answer for you, from the Book of Vile Darkness. Pages 26-28 detail variant rules for ritual sacrifice, which is a perfect option for Wizard characters with a penchant or need for demon/devil summoning! However, you need to be ok with being pretty evil to make it work (I have a feeling that all of the demon summoning would tend to put your character in the not-so-good corner of the alignment chart).

Here's the basic breakdown: every time you sacrifice a sentient being (defined as "being alive and having an Intelligence score of 3 or higher) your character is entitled to make a Knowledge (Religion) check, and then receive a boon from a dark evil higher entity.

One of the boons is "evil outsider appears and serves celebrant for 1 hour per HD of the victim, serving as described in the lesser planar ally spell" with a DC 25 Knowledge (Religion) check. A greater planar ally can be gained by succeeding a DC 35 Knowledge (Religion) check (just in case you have more powerful needs at some point).

A Wizard with max ranks in Knowledge (Religion) and a decent Intelligence score has a pretty good chance of success with this tactic, even at low levels! There are also a bunch of listed bonuses depending on how you perform the sacrifice, so you can increase your chances with some basic efforts. You can also use this tactic to summon as many demons as you can find victims to sacrifice. And, seemingly, the sacrificed victim seems to qualify as the payment that an outsider will typically request when casting either of these summoning spells.

So, in closing: this fits a tight budget, its sustainable and even can be fed with random encounters, it doesn't cost your precious spell slots, the ritual puts you in great standing with evil higher-ups, it can be performed at almost any level, and it lets you put all sorts of different baddies to use for whatever your ends might be.

I hope that this helps!

[Yogibear41]

You would have to sacrifice someone with 24 hd to make the lemure hang around long enough to cast the spell on it.

I think I will be willing to just wait for the wizard to gain a few more levels and then put him to work summoning the Lemures and making the Pain the old fashioned way.

[Malroth]

Untill then there's always random Orcs bandits or goblins, I'm pretty sure you could get volunteers to do the torturing of them for you from the local village.