Ultimate Magus and Versatile Spellcaster

[Bryconium]

Hey all,
I'm in a campaign that has been going on for a while, with an beguiler/wizard/ultimate magus. I've been using the feat versatile spellcaster from the beginning of the campaign, after discussing it with my DM, and I've been using it to cast wizard spells spontaneously. For example, I've used the feat to sacrifice two third level spells from my wizard spells prepared to cast a fourth level spell on the fly. One of the other players doesn't think this works, and says that the feat only gives me a slot that i can prepare a higher level spell in. But many of the posts i read online prior to building this character stated that my way of using this feat was valid. However, none of the posts really say why it works this way, so we are kinda stuck at an impasse. I was hoping that one of the experts could verify that this feat works the way I am saying, with evidence from the books, or show why it works the way he is saying, again with evidence. Thank you all.

[Zanos]

You can use two spell slots of the same level to cast a spell you know that is one level higher.
The text of the feat seems pretty clear to me. The only way to say it doesn't work with Wizard spells is if you don't consider the spells a Wizard has in their spellbook to be their spells known. The feat is pretty clearly only intended for spontaneous casters though, and your DM my rule that this is abuse of the feat.

[Bryconium]

The text of the feat seems pretty clear to me. The only way to say it doesn't work with Wizard spells is if you don't consider the spells a Wizard has in their spellbook to be their spells known. The feat is pretty clearly only intended for spontaneous casters though, and your DM my rule that this is abuse of the feat.

Thank you for the response. I thought it was clear myself, though to be clear my friend thinks that since its wizard casting, it only gives me a spell slot to then prepare a spell. Also, during character creation, I ran this by my DM and he said it was OK.

[Talya]

Keep in mind with ultimate magus, you're already blurring the lines between spontaneous and prepared caster. This shouldn't seem out of place to other players.

(Also, remember the beguiler side of your character knows their entire spell list, so can use versatile spellcaster to cast higher level spells than they normally could, as well.)

[HunterOfJello]

The intention of the feat was for you to use 2 spontaneous slots of level X to cast 1 spontaneous slot of level X+1. However, the wording of the spell doesn't support the intention of the creators. If you are going to use the feat RAI (Read as Intended), then that is how things would work out. Beguiler spells could only be used to cast Beguiler spells.

If you are going to use the feat RAW (Read as Written) then you would be able to sacrifice 2 spontaneous slots of level X to cast any "spell known" of level X+1. A wizard's spells known are defined in the glossary of the Player's Handbook as all of the spells in his spellbook.


I don't know where you friend is getting the idea that you would gain a slot for your wizard that you would be able to prepare a spell in. That doesn't make sense at all.

[Bryconium]

First off, thanks for all the responses.


The intention of the feat was for you to use 2 spontaneous slots of level X to cast 1 spontaneous slot of level X+1. However, the wording of the spell doesn't support the intention of the creators. If you are going to use the feat RAI (Read as Intended), then that is how things would work out. Beguiler spells could only be used to cast Beguiler spells.

If you are going to use the feat RAW (Read as Written) then you would be able to sacrifice 2 spontaneous slots of level X to cast any "spell known" of level X+1. A wizard's spells known are defined in the glossary of the Player's Handbook as all of the spells in his spellbook.


I don't know where you friend is getting the idea that you would gain a slot for your wizard that you would be able to prepare a spell in. That doesn't make sense at all.

He says that since the feat doesn't specify how the spell is cast and since i'm burning wizard slots, the new spell defaults to acting like a wizard spell, and needs to be prepared. Also, shouldn't i be able to sacrifice any spell slots, not just the spontaneous ones?

[Doc_Maynot]

RAW, yes. And the feat is very clear. Use two spell slots to cast, not prepare, a spell you know.
But yes, I agree it was most likely intended to be spontaneous slots only and withing the bounds of the same class.

[fishyfishyfishy]

On top of the evidence the other posters have presented you have the ultimate argument already: "I already asked the DM when I was making the character and this is the decision they made. You may disagree with it but it was not your decision to make."

[Droningbass]

I think that this is a fascinating interpretation of the feat, and a very creative use of the Ultimate Magus prestige class! I feel that, while the written intent seems to be for spontaneous spellcasters only, the Ultimate Magus prestige class already utilizes a number of similar features (like Augment Casting and Expanded Spell Knowledge, to a lesser extent) that further blur the line between spontaneous and prepared spellcasters. You certainly meet the requirements, and the feat doesn't seem to specify that you can't use it for more than one spellcasting class.

Some people might say that this feat grants you an unfair advantage, but I believe that the trade of two spells for the price of one slightly more powerful spell is pretty balanced. This is not all that much more powerful than the Alacritous Cogitation feat from the Complete Mage, which allows you to cast any spell in your spellbook at the cost of one spell slot and a full-round action. And, since Ultimate Magus already have the ability to transfer spell power between the two classes, I feel like you might even be able to justify giving up your spontaneous spell levels to power your prepared spells.

Regarding the "prepare an extra spell vs. cast an extra spell" debate: the feat straightforward in saying that you "can cast" another spell. If it was designed for preparation, then it might specify that you must choose which spell slots you would sacrifice for the day (since spontaneous spellcasters must concentrate or focus for 15 minutes each day after their rest to regain their spellcasting powers) in order to gain the new, higher level, spell slots.

At any rate, I think that this is an exciting and valid discovery in the rules, and that you're using this to build a very cool and powerful spellcaster. Well done, and good luck with this character!