Question about Planescape: Torment and Vampire: The Masquerade

[Starwulf]

So, for the first time in like...over a year, me and my wife have a few extra dollars in the bank account that's unaccounted for, and I've been given permission to buy a game. Right now I'm considering the following: Divine Divinity, Temple of Elemental Evil, Planescape Torment, or Vampire: The Masquerade.

My question for Planescape is I've seen two different variations being sold on Ebay: One is Planescape: Torment, and the other is Planescape Torment/Soulbringer Combo, and I'm wondering, wth is Soulbringer?

My question for Vampire: The Masquerade is similar. I've seen two different VtMs, one VtM: Redemption and the other VtM: Bloodlines. What's the difference, and for both(VtM and Planescape) which do I want to buy?

[Gamerlord]

No idea about Soulbringer (Seems to have meh reviews from what I can find), but assuming the V:tM game you want is the Deus Ex-esque game most people rave about, you want Bloodlines. Never played Redemption, but opinion on it appears to be much more mixed.

Is a physical copy important to you? Because you can grab Planescape for $10 on GoG.

[Winter_Wolf]

I know you've got bandwidth considerations, Starwulf, but if you're considering both Planescape and ToEE, it's really in your interests to get that box over to your friend with bandwidth and download a GoG D&D bundle when it becomes available. Depending on how harsh your bandwidth issue is, you can just buy the package when it's on sale and it sits waiting for you in your personal account virtual shelf and will be there even after you download any or all of the things you bought.

But regarding the PS:T vs PS:T/Soulbringer dilemma, I can't help you because while I vaguely recall something about that from long ago, I can't remember enough about it to do more than speculate and I'd probably be doing you a disservice if I guessed.

[Narkis]

Soulbringer was a mediocre RPG published, but not created, by the same company as Planescape. It was later bundled with the much better game in an effort to leech some undeserved sales.

VtM Redemption is older than Bloodlines and made by a different company. It was a fun game with a good but completely linear story and gameplay somewhat close to the Infinity engine games. It was a decent idea, decently executed, while Bloodlines was awesome in theory but lacking in execution. The only thing they share is the setting.


And whatever you do, do not buy Temple of Elemental Evil. It was a bad game that should not be in the same sentence as the rest.

edit: unless you get the D&D bundle as Winter Wolf said. Even with a couple terrible games in it, it's still a good value for money.

[Starwulf]

Soulbringer was a mediocre RPG published, but not created, by the same company as Planescape. It was later bundled with the much better game in an effort to leech some undeserved sales.

VtM Redemption is older than Bloodlines and made by a different company. It was a fun game with a good but completely linear story and gameplay somewhat close to the Infinity engine games. It was a decent idea, decently executed, while Bloodlines was awesome in theory but lacking in execution. The only thing they share is the setting.


And whatever you do, do not buy Temple of Elemental Evil. It was a bad game that should not be in the same sentence as the rest.

edit: unless you get the D&D bundle as Winter Wolf said. Even with a couple terrible games in it, it's still a good value for money.

Hmm, that's the first time I've ever heard of a really negative opinion of ToEE, though I will admit that anyone who does recommend ToEE also insists that you download the "Circle of 8" fan patch or whatever that was made for it that fixes the multitude of bugs and glitches that apparently abound in it. I'd have no issue downloading said patch, I'm going to guess it's not THAT large(certainly no more then half a gig or so?), and I'm a huge fan of D&D style games.

Thanks for the heads-up on the Planescape:Torment/Soulbringer combo bit, I was wondering if it was like an expansion pack or something for Torment and if I should snag it at the same time as Torment itself. Since it's not, that makes my choice easier in that regards.

Still not sure which game I'm going to end up getting, I could probably get two of them if I'm really patient(I've seen multiple copies of Divine Divinity up for 5-7 bucks on Ebay, so if I got it at $5, I could probably convince my wife to let me spend another 5-10 on Planescape: Torment which I've seen going for that price on a few auctions. VtM: Bloodlines sadly will be the only one I get, a lot harder to find it cheaply for some reason.

As far as getting a bundle goes, I just don't see it happening, the only friend I could leech off moved a solid 30 miles away, and he works a night shift job on top of that, so would be really hard to link up with him. Still, something I'll keep in mind.

Edit: After looking at it, I think VtM: Bloodlines is out. Cheapest copy I can find is like $30 bucks, and I'm more looking just to spend $15-$20(hence why I'm looking at older games ^^). On the other hand, after reading a bit about it, Redemption sounds like it would be fun as well, and is right in the price range I'm looking at it, so it's in the running in Bloodlines place. Would just have to wonder if it would play on Win7.

[Gwyn chan 'r Gwyll]

Note: Redemption and Bloodlines do NOT share a setting! Well, in the sense that they're set in the same game-world, but one's medieval, the other is modern. Bloodlines has a reputation of being an awesome RPG, but you NEEEEED to get the unofficial patch mod. It's one of those games where it flopped on release (it actually did alright but it was released at the same time and on the same engine as Half-Life...) but has been kept alive by modders. I would pick it up over Redemption 100%. Haven't played the other games though.

[Cespenar]

Definitely get Bloodlines. Redemption is an action game and a poor one, even if its storyline isn't half bad.

[Togath]

If you're open to using something like Steam, you can get Bloodlines for 20$
I've admittedly not played it, but it does seem interesting from what I've heard.
I'll also through in a recommendation for Shadowrun Returns(15$). It's a different style of gameplay(overhead camera, with turn based tabletop-rpg-esc combat), but has a good focus on story, as well as support for player made missions/quests/levels/what-ever-you-want-to-call-them.

[Winthur]

And whatever you do, do not buy Temple of Elemental Evil. It was a bad game that should not be in the same sentence as the rest.
ToEE is a pretty good D&D simulation though - emphasis on "simulation", really.

[Starwulf]

If you're open to using something like Steam, you can get Bloodlines for 20$
I've admittedly not played it, but it does seem interesting from what I've heard.
I'll also through in a recommendation for Shadowrun Returns(15$). It's a different style of gameplay(overhead camera, with turn based tabletop-rpg-esc combat), but has a good focus on story, as well as support for player made missions/quests/levels/what-ever-you-want-to-call-them.

Well, I neither like Steam, nor could I download anything, due to my limited data cap(5gb), so that won't be possible. I wouldn't mind GoG, but again, Data cap ><

[Brother Oni]

Note: Redemption and Bloodlines do NOT share a setting! Well, in the sense that they're set in the same game-world, but one's medieval, the other is modern.

Er, you have played VtM:Redemption, right?

@Starwulf:
While I would recommend Bloodlines over Redemption, it badly needs a number of patches due to the release version being half arsed (they're at least a gig in size, so I think it's a no-go for you). Redemption may have issues running on Win7 due to its age, but I'm sure there's workarounds for it (and probably not too big a download either).

If you're after a tactical game then I'll second Togath's recommendation of Shadowrun Returns, plus the large number of fan made missions aren't too big either.

[Driderman]

Pretty much the only one of the initially mentioned games that isboth good and doesn't require multiple, sizable updates is Planescape: Torment.
Vampire: Redemption is okay, if you like your Diablo rip-off blocky and hammy (really hammy!), I've certainly had plenty of fun with it but it's not really a good game as such. Vampire: Bloodlines is pretty good, but only if you install gigabytes worth of fan-patching (as already mentioned).
Temple of Elemental Evil is bad, but is supposedly good with the Circle of 8 fan-patch but again, that requires downloading stuff which is apparently a no-go.
Soulbringer I never even heard about before.

Also, how can you have a limit of 5gb download? I managed to download for 2 terabytes one month and all I got was a "if this keeps happening we'd like to increase the price of your subscription" letter...

[Ebon_Drake]

Er, you have played VtM:Redemption, right?

I'm guessing not past the half-way point.

Redemption works fine for me on Win7. I had some trouble installing it (I ended up just straight copying the files over from my old PC), but once I'd actually managed to get it onto my PC I didn't have any issues.

[Brother Oni]

Vampire: Redemption is okay, if you like your Diablo rip-off blocky and hammy (really hammy!), I've certainly had plenty of fun with it but it's not really a good game as such.

Redemption has been outdone by newer games (it came out in 2000), so it doesn't seem as good these days. I only recommend Bloodlines as it has a much more modern game and story design over the old school linear plot and progression of Redemption.

I guess it's depends on what you want - being told a story and playing a fixed role versus an interactive story with your own blank slate character. There are good and bad points to both styles: the former can be amazing with good story and characterisation, while the latter can fall flat as while you have more freedom, it's not as memorable. For example, I'm playing through ME3 at the moment and I can't remember a single memorable bit of dialogue with my Shepard from the start of the game whereas 14 years on, I can remember the character of Sir Christof Romuald, Sword Brother.

[Terraoblivion]

Of those options I'd recommend Planescape: Torment if writing is important to you. Vampire: The Masquerade: Bloodlines is honestly kinda overrated. It's pretty good, but the second half is a huge letdown due to becoming a linear hack and slash game and the writing itself starts sagging by the time you go to Chinatown. The endings themselves are all pretty bad, except for one joke that I think is shared between them. Torment on the other hand is as good as people say in the writing department.

If you're more looking for gameplay...Then I wouldn't recommend either of them. Gameplay is decent and functional in both, but hardly the main selling point.

[Mx.Silver]

As to recommendations: Torment is always going to be best choice. Soulbringer is thoroughly unremarkable and can be skipped.
Out of the vampire games, Bloodlines is superior but requires a fair sized fan patch. I would advise only installing the patch that fixes things for earlier playthroughs, rather than the one that stuffs in a bunch of custom content as well.



Temple of Elemental Evil is bad, but is supposedly good with the Circle of 8 fan-patch

It's 'good' with the patch as in the game actually runs with some measurable degree of stability and without the constant risk of corrupting its own save files. In regards to whether it's good in the 'well designed, enjoyable game' sense, the answer is still no.

[Starwulf]

Also, how can you have a limit of 5gb download? I managed to download for 2 terabytes one month and all I got was a "if this keeps happening we'd like to increase the price of your subscription" letter...

I live on top of a mountain in Western Maryland, so my choices are just three: Satellite, which is crap for gaming online and I do a bit of that(Diablo 3, Path of Exile, Guild Wars 2 once I get back to it), 26.4k Dial-up which is what I got off of just 2 years ago, and what I currently have: AT&T 4g LTE Mobile Hot-Spot device, and it's a 5gb data cap, the moment of which I go over 5(5.01) I'm charged $10 more, and that continues to happen every gb of data I go(so at 6.01 It's another $10, 7.01 etc etc etc).

So, I've heard lots of opinions on 3 of the 4 games, but I don't think ANYONE has commented on Divine Divinity? I've heard good things about it, but wouldn't mind a few more informed opinions ^^

[danzibr]

I don't have... much to add. I've played Planescape: Torment and Soulbringer.

The former is totally friggin' awesome. The latter... I enjoyed quite a bit. I really did like Soulbringer. I started it several times but never finished it due to the difficulty increasing and me not liking how they handled the magic system. Come to think of it, maybe I should say I like several of the ideas in Soulbringer rather than Soulbringer itself.

[factotum]

My opinion on Divine Divinity: it's a good action RPG, with some nice touches of humour (the two skeletons spontaneously collapsing because they suddenly realised there was nothing holding them together, for instance). However, you put it in a list with Planescape: Torment, and PS:T is always going to win that match. How could it not? Even now, nearly 15 years after its release, it's one of the best stories ever put into a game, in the best D&D setting ever created, in one of the most graphically impressive game engines of its era. There's no question in my mind: get Planescape, and if you have a bit of spare money left over, add Divine Divinity to your basket as well.

[lord_khaine]

I would like to second the recomendation for Torment, do whatever you need to get your hands upon it.