Intelligent Legacy Item?

[LentilNinja]

Hi, I'm wanting a Legacy item I'm currently making to be Intelligent. Is there any issue with an item being both?

[Xaktsaroth]

Nothing's stopping you.

If you look near the back of the book, some of the abilities you can select when you're founding your own legacy is intelligent item, so pick the strength you like off the list and go from there. :D

Hope that helps.

[Forrestfire]

Sorta. You can't have a weapon or armor with more than a +2 enhancement bonus, or any other item worth more than 4,000gp. However, the weakest intelligent items fall within that limit, so it works for some.

[LentilNinja]

Sorta. You can't have a weapon or armor with more than a +2 enhancement bonus, or any other item worth more than 4,000gp. However, the weakest intelligent items fall within that limit, so it works for some.

Do Intelligent Items increase the enhancement bonus?

[Forrestfire]

Heh, technically, you can have an arbitrarily expensive intelligent weapon or armor, and it won't disqualify it as long as the enhancement bonus equivalent isn't higher than +2. So that works.

[Red Fel]

Do Intelligent Items increase the enhancement bonus?

No (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/magicItems/intelligentItems.htm).

Intelligent items, generally speaking, increase the base price, which is not particularly relevant with respect to Legacy items.

But, yes. The relevant language can be found on Weapons of Legacy p. 181, which requires that: A non-magical, non-masterwork item cannot become a Legacy item. A masterwork item can become a Legacy item, although this is rare. Most Legacy items have some magical power (i.e. +1 or +2 enhancement). An item with more than +2 enhancement cannot become a Legacy item. An item worth more than 4,000 gp cannot become a Legacy item.
The SRD (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/magicItems/intelligentItems.htm) notes that an item must be magical (i.e. at least +1 enhancement bonus) to be Intelligent, which means you're starting from an increased price already. (Base price + Masterwork + enhancement.) Further, the minimum price increase for an Intelligent item is +1,000 gp, for one with empathetic communication, 30-foot senses and only one lesser power.

By contrast, the Ability Menus in Weapons of Legacy, starting on p. 188, outline many abilities you can put onto a Legacy item, without raising its cost or enhancement bonus. Ability Menu A (Least) includes "Intelligent Legacy, Minor;" Ability Menu B (Least) includes "Intelligent Legacy;" and Ability Menu D (Lesser) includes "Intelligent Legacy (Greater)." These give you plenty of useful assets; the Minor version grants the equivalent senses, stats and communication of a +2,000 gp Intelligent item; the regular version grants the equivalent of a +6,000 gp item; and the Greater version grants the equivalent of a +12,000 gp item. Note that, unlike an ordinary Intelligent item, a Legacy Intelligent item doesn't gain abilities by being Intelligent; rather, it gains abilities by being Legacy. It does, however, gain an Ego Score.

Note also that the rules in Weapons of Legacy make many Legacy items unappealing; there are many proposed fixes that make Legacy items more fun to use. So consider that.

[LentilNinja]

But, yes. The relevant language can be found on Weapons of Legacy p. 181, which requires that: A non-magical, non-masterwork item cannot become a Legacy item. A masterwork item can become a Legacy item, although this is rare. Most Legacy items have some magical power (i.e. +1 or +2 enhancement). An item with more than +2 enhancement cannot become a Legacy item. An item worth more than 4,000 gp cannot become a Legacy item.
The SRD (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/magicItems/intelligentItems.htm) notes that an item must be magical (i.e. at least +1 enhancement bonus) to be Intelligent, which means you're starting from an increased price already. (Base price + Masterwork + enhancement.) Further, the minimum price increase for an Intelligent item is +1,000 gp, for one with empathetic communication, 30-foot senses and only one lesser power.

So if I'm wanting to make a Legacy Weapon, I can choose to have it intelligent without picking it as a Legacy ability? Does that mean the Legacy ability is only intended for the items, or is it significantly better?

[Red Fel]

So if I'm wanting to make a Legacy Weapon, I can choose to have it intelligent without picking it as a Legacy ability?

By RAW, yes. Assuming that making it an Intelligent item does not raise it above the limit on enhancements or value, you can make an Intelligent item into a Legacy item without using the Legacy abilities that perform the same thing. But one caveat.

First, look at the "Item Intelligence, Wisdom, Charisma, and Capabilities" table on the SRD (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/magicItems/intelligentItems.htm), showing abilities by cost. As you can see, at most, you can get an empathetic item with two lesser powers, 60 foot normal vision and hearing, and 13/13/10 stats. That's at most; anything more would cost 4,000+ gp, and thus exceed the threshold. Intelligent Legacy, Minor, gets you those by default (minus the Intelligent item abilities).


Does that mean the Legacy ability is only intended for the items, or is it significantly better?

It's different. On the one hand, it's cheaper, in a sense; you don't have to spend money towards it being Intelligent, which means you can use that money on enhancements (up to +2) or special materials, or even on other pieces of equipment. On the other, it takes up (at least) one of your precious Legacy Ability slots, and unlike an Intelligent item normally, doesn't come by default with Intelligent item abilities. But back to the first hand, it does get Legacy abilities, and unlike an Intelligent item normally, you won't have to wrestle with the item to get it to use its Dedicated Power (because it doesn't get one).

So, six of one, half dozen of the other. Really, the better question is this: Do you want it to be an Intelligent item because of the sapience and senses, or because of the Intelligent item powers? If the former, the Legacy ability gets you all the fun for less fuss; if the latter, the Intelligent item gains powers in addition to those from Legacy items, but you may have to wrestle with it for control.

[Ingus]

I don't know if I've got what you want to do with intelligent items, but if I did...

http://www.d20srd.org/srd/variant/magic/itemFamiliars.htm

My suggestion is to use Legacy Weapon to increase abilities and have lots of fun with Item Familiar

...from where it came all that stink of cheddar?