Gestalt: What class to learn Every spell?

[Hobbo Jim]

I might be joining a Gestalt campaign, and was thinking I wanted to play a character who's goal is to learn every possible spell & power available. This includes Divine, Arcane, and Psionic (let me know if I missed something?). Anyways, I was thinking that I would go with an Archivist/Spell to Power Erudite. I'm still not sure on an exact build, however... I was thinking maybe I'd include some Cerebremancer, but that means I need to multiclass one of them. Ideas & Thoughts?

If you actually have a written up build that would be useful as well, like what feast & stuff I should take :-)

[With a box]

if I remember currectly, a build call omnicaster can get that

[aleucard]

Well, if just having access is enough, then Artificer//Anything would also do the trick as long as you can convince your DM to allow the Art to do Psionic items, but asking him for a Magic Artificer//Psionics Artificer would probably be more likely to work.

For your specific request though... Well, let's just say that you should probably expect to both blow an overwhelming portion of your WBL on learning those spells, and to have to cart around a decent sized novel as your character sheet. Sweet shivering f@#$, that's a lot of spells. :smalleek: Loremaster (http://dndtools.eu/classes/loremaster/) or an equivalent seems like a perfect fit for this sort of thing, though I am forced to remind you of the problems with having both sides of a Gestalt being active. Sure, there's an entire library of Spells that would suit either or sometimes both and Psionics isn't a slouch here either, but still.

As another note, you should keep in mind that with a build like this, you are a VERY squishy person. Look for PrC's with full casting/psionics advancement that would give you better HP, BAB, and maybe Armor Proficiency Negation for your arcane spells. Crap like Runesmith if you're a Dwarf or (if you got a DM willing to play ball) a similarly Earthy race would help a great deal.

[Hobbo Jim]

I'm not actually entirely sure of what the learning potential of the Erudite is, but I've heard that they can get Divine spells too via Dragon 349? If they can get divine and also their learning potential is good then I could quite easily use my second class to keep myself alive, while the first lets me learn everything. Anyone have any idea about this?

[aleucard]

I'm not actually entirely sure of what the learning potential of the Erudite is, but I've heard that they can get Divine spells too via Dragon 349? If they can get divine and also their learning potential is good then I could quite easily use my second class to keep myself alive, while the first lets me learn everything. Anyone have any idea about this?

1, getting a DM to accept an online resource for StP is hard enough without having to get him to also accept Dragon Magazine material. 2, a lot of Divine Caster options are already pretty beefy, so if you take those you have that base covered. The only problem is that there's a few things that Druids get that Clerics don't and vice-versa.

Really, though, what the Hell sort of campaign are you IN where your DM is willing to let you unleash this monstrosity on the game?

[Hobbo Jim]

TBH I'm not entirely sure, however I'm usually pretty good at not completely destroying the campaign with monstrous amounts of power because after creaeting a potentially broken character, I'll probably favor the more amusing venture rather than the power play. Regardless, don't worry too much about what content is used :P I can only guess at what others will come up with. Also, I would Ideally like to have druid spells and cleric spells open, which is why I was taking a look at archivist.

Also, if you can find that omnicaster bit that would be Awesome! My quick google fu seemed to fail me upon looking it up; only thing I found was a homebrew base class.

[Coidzor]

Spell To Power Erudite//Shadowcaster, I suppose. Gets you all Powers and Spells known on the one side and, uh, Shadowcasting on top of that. Unless you wanted to go for a Master of the 9 build by counting ToB stuff as spells.

[Vaz]

Psion 20//X


Step 1; Archivist learns all Divine Spells from Scrolls.
Step 2; Wyrm Wizard learns all Divine Spells as Arcane.
Step 3; Epic level Spell to Power Erudite learns all Arcane Spells as Psionic Powers.
Step 4; Psion picks up the Dark Chaos Shuffle through Expanded Knowledge
Step 5; Psion uses the Dark Chaos Shuffle with the Alertness feat gained from his Psicrystal to receive all 8th level and lower spells.
Step 4; Epic Spell to Power Erudite Psychic Chirurgery's any 9th level spells into the Psion's mind.

[Socksy]

Sounds like you might be after Elan --> Beholder Mage shenanigans, if you're allowed to break the game that badly.

[Rebel7284]

StP Erudite//Archivist meets your needs. Not the best for gestalt due to both "sides" needing actions, but it works.

[weckar]

Archivist may not be the best idea for learning all spells, as the spells that will actually be available to learn (outside your spell list) is entirely up to the DM, as you will have to copy them from existing sources in the campaign world.

[Immabozo]

I'm not actually entirely sure of what the learning potential of the Erudite is, but I've heard that they can get Divine spells too via Dragon 349? If they can get divine and also their learning potential is good then I could quite easily use my second class to keep myself alive, while the first lets me learn everything. Anyone have any idea about this?

StP Erudite can learn every spell, ever. There's your character idea right there. The other side should be druid 5/Master of Many Forms 7/Nature's warrior 5/War Shaper 3. You will be able to wildshape into a strong form, with lots of defenses, you will get good natural AC and have flight, burrowing, fast movement and lots of cool options open to you. You will also get immunity to crits. and, at level 20, you should get the special qualities. Regen, fast healing, SR, etc. And you can get some cool, very uncommon abilities from Nature's Warrior.

[Thrice Dead Cat]

StP Erudite//Archivist meets your needs. Not the best for gestalt due to both "sides" needing actions, but it works.

To be fair, psionics are especially good at generating actions with linked power, hustle, schism, and whatever that first level power is that gives you a standard action. You just need to bypass the whole "spend your focus to apply linked power" nonsense.

[Hobbo Jim]

I exactly intend on succeeding my characters goal, it's just going to be his goal. So it's perfectly acceptable for me to leave what spells I get mostly up to the DM.

Immabozo how do you get divine as Spell to Erudite? I've heard mentions of it but to me it was never clear as to how it was done

I will also have to look into this Beholder Mage...

[Giddonihah]

Ten levels of Chameleon combined with one of the ways to get 9th level spells on them (Though kinda a little cheesy) gives every single Arcane and Divine spell from any spell list.

[Kennisiou]

Spell to power erudite can learn any spell/psionic power. Psi artificer can make psionic items that can manifest any psionic power, and since because of StP Erudite any spell can be a psionic power, they can make items that manifest any spell. You don't even need to go gestalt to get every spell list.

StP Erudite//Factotum or Psi Artificer//Factotum is definitely not a bad gestalt set up.

[Vaz]

Sounds like you might be after Elan --> Beholder Mage shenanigans, if you're allowed to break the game that badly.

Why bother? You're already more powerful, with a PP recharge mechanic and all the psionic time wimey funzies you can ever wish for, so Beholder Mage is a bit of a waste. Might as well search for some unique mechanics that magic can't duplicate (Shadow Pounce, Bloodstorm Blade etc) and use that.

[Rubik]

The StP erudite alone can learn every spell and power in the game, with a little fiddling. You have the psion list, of course, as well as the wiz/sorc list. You also have the cleric's list through dragons or rainbow servant and the druid's list through a friendly dragon with an Eberron dragon archetype (Child of Eberron). A single level each in prestige bard/paladin/ranger gives access to each of those lists (use the Magic Mantle and Southern Magician to qualify for them).

Anything else can be learned via a few different ways, including Expanded Knowledge (spell learned as power via erudite or power from another list) and crafting a power stone then Psychic Reformation to a different Expanded Knowledge. This will craft a power stone of an erudite version of whatever power or spell you want, which you can then learn from. Or you could nab the power or spell from another psionic character who has already done this, whether through normal power acquisition or Psychic Chirurgery.

Alternatively, a full manifesting class (such as psion or society mind) with a three level dip in illithid savant could nab you the StP erudite's learning mechanic, so you don't have to bother with the unique powers per day. Or you could have someone manifest Psychic Chirurgery on you over and over again and skip the illithid savant levels. (Psionic Dominate them and you won't even have to pay.)

[edit] Mostly swordsage'd.

[weckar]

Or you could have someone manifest Psychic Chirurgery on you over and over again and skip the illithid savant levels. (Psionic Dominate them and you won't even have to pay.)
It truly is too bad Psychic Chirurgery cannot be used maliciously. Secretly succeeding a Will save but still going along with a dominate would never have been so sweet.

[Ramza00]

While it may not be every spell it will be all the spells you need.

Wizard 20//Archivist 20

Play an easybake wizard and add these four feats

Spell Mastery
Uncanny Forethought
Practiced Spellcaster Wizard
Practiced Spellcaster Archivist

Your ancestral relic is a caster shield. A shield that also possess a scroll with a single spell on. Each night you prayer to your ancestors on hallowed ground for arcane knowledge and you sacrifice x items and in the morning a wizard scroll is on your shield with which you can put in your spellbook. Same idea for divine scrolls for prayerbooks.

Point if you flacor your shield to be so shiny it ripplws and you can see your ancestors or your gods emblem in the shield

Uncanny forethought just allowes you to cast all your spells spontaneously for 1 fullround action a number of times equal to your int modifier.

[Jack_Simth]

I might be joining a Gestalt campaign, and was thinking I wanted to play a character who's goal is to learn every possible spell & power available. This includes Divine, Arcane, and Psionic (let me know if I missed something?). Anyways, I was thinking that I would go with an Archivist/Spell to Power Erudite. I'm still not sure on an exact build, however... I was thinking maybe I'd include some Cerebremancer, but that means I need to multiclass one of them. Ideas & Thoughts?

If you actually have a written up build that would be useful as well, like what feast & stuff I should take :-)

A straightforward Archivist//Psion(Telepath) can do it, no Spell to Power necessary - although it helps to splash a single level of Thrallherd (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/psionic/prestigeClasses/thrallherd.htm) (use Practiced Manifester to keep up your manifesting) for a series of high-level specialist Psions (and one Warlock) Thralls to abuse and then murder.

Methods:

All Arcane & Divine Spells (although they'll be divine when you're done):
Any scroll created by a divine caster is a divine scroll, which an Archivist can then scribe (no fixed list).
When multiple people collaborate on making a scroll, whether it's Arcane or Divine is based on who pays the XP cost.
So if you get, say, a Warlock Thrall, you supply the Scribe Scroll feat, Thrall supplies the spell via UMD. You pay the XP cost and... voila! A divine scroll of an arbitrary spell. You can then scribe it.

All Powers:
Take Psychic Chirurgery (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/psionic/powers/psychicChirurgery.htm) as one of your 9th level powers known.
Get a Thrall with the power you want.
Use Psychic Chirurgery (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/psionic/powers/psychicChirurgery.htm) to give the thrall Psychic Chirurgery (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/psionic/powers/psychicChirurgery.htm).
Have the thrall use Psychic Chirurgery (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/psionic/powers/psychicChirurgery.htm) to give you the power you want.
Murder thrall.

Make sure to use standard XP cost mitigation techniques, as well as standard Wealth-o-mancy, to eat up the costs. That way, you can get them all.

[Rubik]

Do note that not only does a psion using the illithid savant to eat the StP erudite's learning mechanic get to ignore the UPPD, he also pays nothing to learn powers and spells, since his erudite level is --.

[Jack_Simth]

Do note that not only does a psion using the illithid savant to eat the StP erudite's learning mechanic get to ignore the UPPD, he also pays nothing to learn powers and spells, since his erudite level is --.
A constant times Not A Number is Not A Number. So the cost to learn a power that way is Not A Number. Your XP total minus Not A Number is also Not A Number.

Your DM might smite you with that one by simple method of pointing out that you're no longer on the XP charts, and thus can't level ever again. If you don't expect the game to last more than one level, that's fine. Otherwise, well....

[Rubik]

A constant times Not A Number is Not A Number. So the cost to learn a power that way is Not A Number. Your XP total minus Not A Number is also Not A Number.

Your DM might smite you with that one by simple method of pointing out that you're no longer on the XP charts, and thus can't level ever again. If you don't expect the game to last more than one level, that's fine. Otherwise, well....Well, you do have zero levels in erudite, so X * 0 = 0.

Also, there are ways to level without gaining XP. Very fast and very efficient ways.

[Immabozo]

Immabozo how do you get divine as Spell to Erudite? I've heard mentions of it but to me it was never clear as to how it was done


The StP erudite alone can learn every spell and power in the game, with a little fiddling. You have the psion list, of course, as well as the wiz/sorc list. You also have the cleric's list through dragons or rainbow servant and the druid's list through a friendly dragon with an Eberron dragon archetype (Child of Eberron). A single level each in prestige bard/paladin/ranger gives access to each of those lists (use the Magic Mantle and Southern Magician to qualify for them).

Anything else can be learned via a few different ways, including Expanded Knowledge (spell learned as power via erudite or power from another list) and crafting a power stone then Psychic Reformation to a different Expanded Knowledge. This will craft a power stone of an erudite version of whatever power or spell you want, which you can then learn from. Or you could nab the power or spell from another psionic character who has already done this, whether through normal power acquisition or Psychic Chirurgery.

Alternatively, a full manifesting class (such as psion or society mind) with a three level dip in illithid savant could nab you the StP erudite's learning mechanic, so you don't have to bother with the unique powers per day. Or you could have someone manifest Psychic Chirurgery on you over and over again and skip the illithid savant levels. (Psionic Dominate them and you won't even have to pay.)

[edit] Mostly swordsage'd.

It has been covered. There are ways. mentioned above is a class who can learn all divine spells as arcane. Take them from one such character. Or, even take 9 (or 10, it's a solid call either way) levels of thrall herd (maybe even on the other side of your gestalt!) and get them as thralls. Once you have all the spells, the power Mind Concert with 9 of your thralls will get you +10 ML and +10 to all save DCs and a large number of bonus power points and a way to completely ignore unique power points per day, bonus HP (this is ripe for abuse with all members getting psicrystals and share pain for, effectively, hardness 8, and then get DR on top of that)