View Full Version : Class Abilities as Feats (New system)

2007-02-28, 09:17 PM
So in my new system (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?p=2115288#post2115288) you buy class abilities with points. The problem is not all class abilities are balanced with each other, and they have different progressions.

My solution is to have all class abilities converted to feats, as all feats are balance, or at least suposed to be.

So post your suggestions as to how to convert a class ability (or series of) in a/some feats.

Here's my take on Evasion as a feat chain:

Evasion [General]
Your Reflexes allow you to evade danger better than most.
Requirements: Base Ref Save +3, Dex 13
Beneft: You take no damage on a passed a reflex save against an attack that normally allows 1/2 damage on a passed save.

Improved Evasion [General]
Your Reflexes allow you to evade danger completely
Requirements: Base Ref Save +6, Evasion, Dex 15
Beneft: As well as the benift of evasion, you take only 1/2 damage on a failed save from an attack that normally allows 1/2 damage on a passed save.

I want to eventually have every class ability from D&D and d20 modern covered, so there's plently of homebrewing ahead!

That Lanky Bugger
2007-02-28, 09:22 PM
Looks good. I like the general concept of it. You may want to make the Uncanny Dodge part of that same feat tree, perhaps springing from Evasion... Or make them both have identical requirements, but Evasion and Uncanny Dodge both require Lightning Reflexes in addition to the Base Ref Save of +3 and the Dex of 13.

Can't wait to see more!

2007-02-28, 09:30 PM
I have been toying with the same thing for a while, but I ended up tinkering with various Class Abilities to make them fit. Sneak Attack, for example, can be a hard Class Feature to turn into Feats. If I think of any suitable ones, I'll be sure to post.

2007-02-28, 09:35 PM
Sneak Attck [General]
You can really hit were it hurts
Requirements: Int 13, BAB +1
Benefit: Any time you make an attack against an opponent who is denied their dexterity bonus to AC, or who you are flanking, you deal +1d6 damage.
Special: You may take this feat multiple times. It's effects stack, but to a maximum of +1d6 per two Hit Die you have.

Please post any other "class abilities as feats" sugestions! There's quite a lot to get through, and any help is apriciated!

That Lanky Bugger
2007-02-28, 09:37 PM
Naw. Sneak Attack can just have a built-in increasing requirement(s). For example...

Sneak Attack
When striking a foe who is off guard, you deal more damage through the precision of your attack.
Requirements: Base Ref Save +2, Dex 11+
Beneft: You gain +1d6 Sneak Attack Dice
Special: You may take this feat multiple times. Each time you do, the Base Ref Save requirement and the Dexterity requirement increase by 1. You may not take this feat more than once per level.

Edit: magic8BALL, yours is better.

2007-02-28, 09:41 PM
UA already did this, but you could easily expand it with class abilities from other rulebooks:

2007-02-28, 09:59 PM

well that shows us some of the easier class abilities.

(I'm a bit worried that it presents a sorcerers familiar, and goes on to say that a wizards familiar is too complex to present...)

What about a barbarians Rage, or a soulbaldes Soulblade (of all things...), and some prereq's for the rouges special abilities that can can start getting at lvl 10 (cuz' these things are already on par with feats apparently)? What about some gear frm some PrC's?

here are some more not mensioned in the handy link above.

Camoflague [General]
You can hide even if there is nothing to hide behind
Requirements: Hide 10 ranks
Benefit: You may make hide checks even when you do not have any cover or concealment.

Hide in Plain Sight [General]
You can hide from people even as they are watching you.
Requierments: Hide 15 ranks, Camoflage
Benefit: You may make hide checks even while being observed.

Slowfall [General]
You can use a wall to slow your decent.
Requirements: Base Ref Save +3, Dex 13
Beneft: As long as you are within arms reach of a wall you can use it to slow your decent. You take damage from the fall as though it were 10 ft shorter then it actually was (minimum 0ft).
Special: You may take this feat multiple times. It's effects stack, but to a maximum reduction of 5 ft per Hit Dice you have.

2007-03-01, 02:01 PM
The problem with those solutions to Sneak Attack, as far as I can see, is that +1D6 Sneak Attack Damage isn't really worth a Feat. Of course, that depends on how easy you are goin to make it to acquire Feats.

2007-03-01, 05:43 PM
have you read the evolving feats post? i think that sneak attack is a candidate for this treatment.

2007-03-02, 07:04 AM
The problem with those solutions to Sneak Attack, as far as I can see, is that +1D6 Sneak Attack Damage isn't really worth a Feat. Of course, that depends on how easy you are goin to make it to acquire Feats.

Please read the topic about my new system (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?p=2115288#post2115288). 2 points will buy you a feat, and there are no class abilities, hence feats that emulate class abilities are needed (as so this topic was born...)

Fast Movement [General]
You move faster than normal.
Requirements: Base Reflex save +3, Dex 13+
Benefit: Choose one movement speed you have, such as base land speed, or fly speed. Increase this speed by 10 ft.
Special: You may take this feat multiple times. You may choose a different movent type or the same movent type. If you choose the same movement type the effects stack, but to a maximum bonus of +5 ft per HD.

Yes, I am aware of the progressive feats, and in D&D this would be great (toughness needs it IMO... something more like Improved Toughness) but this system anyone could get up to 5 feats a level if you really wanted too, so feat consumption isnt really a problem.

2007-03-02, 08:22 AM
I did read the thread, the point was that if all Feats are being purchased equally , then you need to make all Feats equal, which is not currently the case.

Have you read the (A)D&D [I]Player's Option: Skills & Powers book? This is all vey reminiscent of that system and the Character Point mechanism.

2007-03-02, 09:12 AM
Feats are more eual than all class abilities (Trap Sence vs Rage, wild empathy vs Sneak attack)... if not, please point out how I can make them more balanced.

No I have not read that book. Hell, I havent even seen anything older than 3rd ed. Is it OGC? On the net? I'd like a peak...

2007-03-02, 09:39 AM
Well, it's basically things like Power Attack versus Two Weapon Fighting or Weapon Focus or Greater Weapon Specialisation versus Melee Weapon Mastery. Not all Feats are created equal, some are just plain better than others. Class Features have the same problem.
So, you can either use them as is, accepting that they are not equal, but assigning each a 2 point cost, assign each Feat a separate Point cost or change the Feats themselves so that they become 'more equal.' Assigning each Feat a point cost is probably the most efficient method, but I have no clear answers. It's a problem that needs to be faced when using a point based system for D&D.

2007-03-02, 12:20 PM
Sean K. Reynolds suggests a feat point system on his home page here (http://www.seankreynolds.com/rpgfiles/misc/featpointsystem.html).

2007-03-02, 09:22 PM
His point system is just for feats. Mine is for feats, HD size, skill points, class skills saves BAB, Class abilities and spells. He's using 10 points instead of a 'feat slot', and assigning all feats a value up to 10. (And has a nice rework on toughness, +5hp for a full 10 point feat)

Here's a class feature from the d20 modern book, although it would still be handy in D&D as a feat too.

Plan [General]
You can develop a plan that helps you and your party in a dramatic stiuation.
Requirements: Int 15
Benefit: When you are aware of an upcomming situtaion (for example, you know there are bugbears beating down the door to the room your in, or you know you will try to open the safe in the mayors room), you may prepare a plan.
Preraring the plan takes 1 minute, and requires an Intelligence check. You add your HD total to this check, reflecting your experience. You cannot take 10 or 20 on this check.
If your check equals or exceeds 10, you and your allies gain a +1 circumstance bonus to all skill checks and attack rolls at the begining of the encounter (see below). For every 5 additional points your check exceeds 10, this bonus is increased by +1 (so a check of 22 grants a +3 bonus).
These bonuses apply for the first three rounds of the encounter. After that time, reduce the bonus by 1 point (to a minimum of +0) for every additional round the situation conitues, as the vagaries of circumstance begin to unravel even the best-laid plans.