How to make an old character young again

[Chernobyl]

Hi Folks,

Is there a way to make an old character younger? Age Resistance and Age Resistance, Greater will remove the age-related penalties to Str/Dex/Con for 24 hours, but is there a way to actually reverse-age the character (short of killing and reincarnating him)? Something besides Wish or Miracle, please.

Thanks,
Chernobyl

[atemu1234]

If your DM would approve D&D 3e stuff, there's an evil spell in BoVD that drains youth to fuel yours.

[Corlis]

First thing that comes to mind is Sun Orchid Elixir (http://www.archivesofnethys.com/MagicArtifactsDisplay.aspx?ItemName=Sun%20Orchid%2 0Elixir), though it is a minor artifact and is going to put you back at least 50,000 gp, so if miracle and wish are out of the question then so is this, probably.

[Serafina]

Sun Orchid Elixir is the only way i know off (other than Wish/Miracle/Reincarnate) - but IMO at least reversing aging should rightfully be a powerful effect, so having it a minor artifact seems quite justified. Not just because of the potential stat boosts, but also because it generally makes for better stories.

[Eldariel]

You can always inhabit a new body. I believe the Magic Jar loop works in PF too, for instance. True Mind Switch power works as well, though Psionics are strictly speaking 3rd party in PF.

[Segev]

True Mind Switch is 10,000 exp and 9th level Telepath-only power, but it will swap you into a new body of your choosing, provided they fail the save. I suggest low-level youths with physiques of the sort you crave. Very unlikely to make their will save, and give you what you want in a new body.

[atemu1234]

I suggest low-level youths with physiques of the sort you crave.

You have NO idea how easy this is to misinterpret.

[Segev]

You have NO idea how easy this is to misinterpret.

Upon having it pointed out, I can see why. Still, I'd venture to say that the sort of violation suggested in all seriousness is on the same level of vile evil as the sort the misinterpretation would imply. (Though possibly less traumatic if the victim is rescued and the process reversed, since reversal is at least an option.)

Either way, the suggested course of action is unequivocally evil.

[atemu1234]

Upon having it pointed out, I can see why. Still, I'd venture to say that the sort of violation suggested in all seriousness is on the same level of vile evil as the sort the misinterpretation would imply. (Though possibly less traumatic if the victim is rescued and the process reversed, since reversal is at least an option.)

Either way, the suggested course of action is unequivocally evil.

Of course it is.

[Crake]

I'm not sure if it still works like this in pathfinder, but in 3.5e, reincarnate gives you a young adult body, so just commit suicide before you die of old age and just get a reincarnate, and you'll be back to young adult. You may need to use some additional magic to ensure you come back in a form you desire or barring that have some class ability that lets you change shape or something.

[Yanisa]

I'm not sure if it still works like this in pathfinder, but in 3.5e, reincarnate gives you a young adult body, so just commit suicide before you die of old age and just get a reincarnate, and you'll be back to young adult. You may need to use some additional magic to ensure you come back in a form you desire or barring that have some class ability that lets you change shape or something.

Yeah Pathinder Reincarnate (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/magic/all-spells/r/reincarnate) works like that too.

The magic of the spell creates an entirely new young adult body for the soul to inhabit from the natural elements at hand.


Also, old age is no (longer) limiting factor.

The spell can bring back a creature that has died of old age



Beside that, 20 levels of alchemist can grant you eternal youth (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/classes/base-classes/alchemist/discoveries/paizo---alchemist-grand-discoveri/eternal-youth), which also makes you young again (it removes age penalties and all that.) (Natural Alchemist (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/classes/prestige-classes/other-paizo/n-r/natural-alchemist) can get it a bit earlier.)

[Serafina]

Reincarnate is one of those spells whose effect on the setting never gets examined - this is even obvious when you look at the other means of restoring youth and preventing death from old age. This is especially true with the changes made in Pathfinder.

If you have a reliable way of restoring youth/preventing death from old age, you are basically changing all power structures that depend on inheritance. Monarchies will have one ruler in perpetuity (barring revolution), rich families will have the same leader, religious orders will be headed by extremely old and likely conservative members and so on.
All the other means of eternal youth are sufficiently rare and/or require high personal power that they won't have those effects except in unique cases. But Reincarnate is only a 4th-level spell.

Sure, its mostly a Druid-spell - which restricts the availability somewhat, as many druids won't likely cast it to uphold some urban elite. But said elite would likely be willing to make extreme concessions, given that the alternative is death.
Its also a Witch-spell, so its even more accessible. And if you get it on a staff with any Cleric or Wizard spells (so that it can be recharged by those) it becomes even more accessible.
Nor is it prohibitively expensive, it just costs 1200 gold (200 for the restoration spells). And if you want your original race back, well common player races have a ~10% chance on the table, so you just go with suicide and another casting until you are back into your original race.


Now the setting conceit can be somewhat explained by cultural taboo of ending up in a non-"your race"-body even for a limited time, that the classes that have native access to it are somewhat outside civilization and the issue of being identified as you (because you'll look quite different).
The same won't be the case if you create other medium-level means of eternal youth.

[Spore]

Immortality (Ex): You discover a cure for aging, and from this point forward you take no penalty to your physical ability scores from advanced age. If you are already taking such penalties, they are removed at this time. You must be at least a 20th-level wizard to select this discovery.

Source: http://paizo.com/pathfinderRPG/prd/ultimateMagic/spellcastingClassOptions/wizard.html

Taken instead of a feat/bonus feat.

[Segev]

Actually, if you want to examine Reincarnate - particularly the PF version - in a "how it affects the world" sense, all it means is that druids and witches would not be nearly so much "outside" society anymore. They might maintain a certain "mystical" distance, but they would have strong and prominent places in every major autocratic power structure. And yes, you wouldn't have dynasties: you'd have eternal rulers.

The "how do we know you're you?" situation would have long since been handled. Some may prefer their own race (or a particular race) for aesthetic purposes. I might even expect a disproportionate number of "elves" as rulers, since they have such long lifespans that it'd save on the repeated castings.

There would be a court witch or druid in every court. The murder-mystery-usurpation types of tales would come from people conspiring with the witches and druids to have them called back instead of the real king. As long as he could convincingly pull off the personality and memories and the like, the fact that reincarnation brings you back in a new body of a randomly-determined race means that Prince John could easily claim he's King Richard after the Sheriff of Nottingham pays a witch to cast Reincarnation on the wrong soul.

Of course, that's why being the court druid/witch/whatever would be such a crucially trusted position, and having several who are not necessarily loyal to each other is a useful safeguard.

Still, the legal systems would recognize reincarnation's effects, and you would not have the stigma of "the wrong race," except possibly as evidence that you're "merely" rich enough to afford a Reincarnation casting, but not rich enough to keep trying until you get the race you wanted.

[AMFV]

Actually, if you want to examine Reincarnate - particularly the PF version - in a "how it affects the world" sense, all it means is that druids and witches would not be nearly so much "outside" society anymore. They might maintain a certain "mystical" distance, but they would have strong and prominent places in every major autocratic power structure. And yes, you wouldn't have dynasties: you'd have eternal rulers.

The "how do we know you're you?" situation would have long since been handled. Some may prefer their own race (or a particular race) for aesthetic purposes. I might even expect a disproportionate number of "elves" as rulers, since they have such long lifespans that it'd save on the repeated castings.

There would be a court witch or druid in every court. The murder-mystery-usurpation types of tales would come from people conspiring with the witches and druids to have them called back instead of the real king. As long as he could convincingly pull off the personality and memories and the like, the fact that reincarnation brings you back in a new body of a randomly-determined race means that Prince John could easily claim he's King Richard after the Sheriff of Nottingham pays a witch to cast Reincarnation on the wrong soul.

Of course, that's why being the court druid/witch/whatever would be such a crucially trusted position, and having several who are not necessarily loyal to each other is a useful safeguard.

Still, the legal systems would recognize reincarnation's effects, and you would not have the stigma of "the wrong race," except possibly as evidence that you're "merely" rich enough to afford a Reincarnation casting, but not rich enough to keep trying until you get the race you wanted.

I would suggest that this fact is exactly why Witches and Druids choose to remain outside society.

[Segev]

I would suggest that this fact is exactly why Witches and Druids choose to remain outside society.

Why, though? Okay, "they don't want their power abused," maybe. But what constitutes "abuse?" Druids HAVE the spell, so it obviously is not antithetical to their belief structure. Nothing says druids nor witches have to be the sorts to loathe material wealth and personal power and prestige, either. Sure, many might, but there's nothing that says they all must.

Why wouldn't a witch motivated by gain willingly accept a respected position in court, as the nobles' physician and advisor and as an influential member of the king's retinue? Why wouldn't an order of druids concerned with keeping civilization and nature in balance be willing - possibly eager - to have an influential place a "spiritual advisors" to the king and his nobles? That those nobles who support druidic interests would be able to remain forever young would only cement this relationship. After all, if the "forever young" nobles are eagerly supportive of druidic causes (to keep their eternal youth), why wouldn't the druids want to keep those nobles in power?

[Spore]

After all, if the "forever young" nobles are eagerly supportive of druidic causes (to keep their eternal youth), why wouldn't the druids want to keep those nobles in power?

Because unlike his own power the nobles aren't bound by neutrality. If an immortal king goes rogue and becomes LE or CE you have factually worsened the situation.

[Psyren]

Druids HAVE the spell, so it obviously is not antithetical to their belief structure.

This is troublesome logic. Lots of divine casters get spells that their gods may not want them using, or more likely, using too often. Clerics of deities with Repose for instance can still animate undead creatures. Druids or clerics of weather deities can make it rain every single day for a year, or cause a drought. Good clerics can run around Poisoning people, or summoning swarms of locusts in a farmer's field, or dropping columns of flame on a commoner's shack. A druid can flatten an entire forest with hail, acid rain, and lightning, uproot it by breaking the earth apart, or fling all the wildlife in a radius up into the air so that they come crashing down later to shatter their limbs.

Part of being given these powers is an expectation of responsible use and moderation.

As for Witches, they are akin to divine casters in many respects. The unknown forces that grant their powers are little understood and not wholly within their control.