Prestiegous Second levels

[toapat]

My question is, what PrCs can be entered by second level, and how do you enter them

Ones that i know of:
a Commoner can straight enter Survivor at second level

any divine caster which begins with 1st level spells is able to meet the spellcasting requirements of Mystic Theurge through a lengthy feat chain (Magical training, Precocious Apprentice, Practiced Spellcaster, and Alternative Spell source)

[Werephilosopher]

A Divine Minion (http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/mb/20050209a) can concievably enter Master of Many Forms at FIRST level.

[Zombulian]

A Divine Minion (http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/mb/20050209a) can concievably enter Master of Many Forms at FIRST level.

Same with Worghests from Dragon Mag 350 as long as they have the Extra Wildshape feat.

[Segev]

My question is, what PrCs can be entered by second level, and how do you enter them

Ones that i know of:
a Commoner can straight enter Survivor at second level

any divine caster which begins with 1st level spells is able to meet the spellcasting requirements of Mystic Theurge through a lengthy feat chain (Magical training, Precocious Apprentice, Practiced Spellcaster, and Alternative Spell source)

Though it does beg the question as to which arcane caster class they'd advance, since they haven't got any yet.

[Necroticplague]

Rainbow Servant can be entered at second level using a combination of Sanctum Spell and Precocious Apprentice. Same can be said about a few other spellcasting classes with a "cast third level spells) minimum, but my memory skips on other examples right now.

[Story]

Racial Paragon classes

Anima Mage with a little cheese (Precocious Apprentice + Bind Vestige + Improved Bind Vestige). But you won't get any of the benefits of the class without a level in Binder to progress.

[gorfnab]

Thief of Life (FoE) can be entered at 2nd level if you go UA Generic Expert at level 1.

[Kennisiou]

A Divine Minion (http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/mb/20050209a) can concievably enter Master of Many Forms at FIRST level.

Technically not. MoMF requires Wildshape Class Feature. Divine Minions have wildshape, but they have it as a racial feature. Different enough that by RAW you can't do it.

[Pinkie Pyro]

I'm fairly certain you can get into war hulk at level 1.

1 HD human (no class)

2 feats:
power attack
cleave

Have wizard cast enlarge person on you (10 GP)

Either
A: Hire a bard with words of creation to use inspire greatness on you (+4 HD) and then have a cleric cast divine power on you (280 GP)
B: Hire a kensai to instill you with his BAB.

You are left with large size, cleave, and +5 BAB, at least for a couple minutes.

[Story]

Meeting the prereqs for a couple of minutes?

Ah the wonders of Ding! level ups.

[nedz]

The trouble with this is that, under many peoples reading of the rules, you lose all of the class features when the spells run out. I think this comes under the heading of TO.

[TiaC]

Racial Paragon classes

Anima Mage with a little cheese (Precocious Apprentice + Bind Vestige + Improved Bind Vestige). But you won't get any of the benefits of the class without a level in Binder to progress.

Actually, due to the class' wording, it could be argued that you do. You see, most advancment abilities have the "as if you had also gained a level in a class to which you belonged before adding the prestige class level" text. However, since Binder is the only class with soul binding, Anima Mage says "At each anima mage level, your soul binding ability improves as if you had also gained a level in the binder class." This does not require an existing ability.

[Inevitability]

Walker in the waste:

1. Be a TN human cleric with 2 flaws.
2. Choose Sand and Thirst as your domains.
3. Take the Heat Endurance feat.
4. Take the Magical Training Feat
5. Take the precocious apprentice feat, and choose the Black Sand spell.
6. Take the Alternate Source Spell feat.

You now:

Are of Nongood alignment.
Have the Heat Endurance feat.
Can cast 3 spells of the sand or thirst domain as divine spells.

[sideswipe]

I'm fairly certain you can get into war hulk at level 1.

1 HD human (no class)

2 feats:
power attack
cleave

Have wizard cast enlarge person on you (10 GP)

Either
A: Hire a bard with words of creation to use inspire greatness on you (+4 HD) and then have a cleric cast divine power on you (280 GP)
B: Hire a kensai to instill you with his BAB.

You are left with large size, cleave, and +5 BAB, at least for a couple minutes.

great, now you have 5 mins to earn 1000xp...

[Segev]

great, now you have 5 mins to earn 1000xp...

Well, you could build like this, then wait for the two spells until you have 1000+ exp. You can deliberately choose to delay leveling up until you hit enough exp to gain TWO levels. So delay until you get these spells cast and the bard's performance.

[Gavinfoxx]

I believe if you are a True Dragon, you can enter two dragon-friendly PrC's at second level, it depends on where your DM stands on Dragonwrought.

[Segev]

I believe if you are a True Dragon, you can enter two dragon-friendly PrC's at second level, it depends on where your DM stands on Dragonwrought.

Could you do it from a wyrmling? White dragon wyrmlings are, admittedly, (a dramatically overpriced) ECL 5, though, so that's not exactly early entry into any PrC.

[Necroticplague]

Technically not. MoMF requires Wildshape Class Feature. Divine Minions have wildshape, but they have it as a racial feature. Different enough that by RAW you can't do it.

It depends on how exactly you interpret the "as an 11th level druid" part of it. Some think that's merely an explanation of how it works (though really, its more like Alternate Form than Wild Shape), other think that lets it qualify.

[toapat]

Well, you could build like this, then wait for the two spells until you have 1000+ exp. You can deliberately choose to delay leveling up until you hit enough exp to gain TWO levels. So delay until you get these spells cast and the bard's performance.

Delaying leveling is from DDO, technically its against the rules of PnP to do so.

however, if the group kills a tarrasque, the level 1 should get enough XP to reach lvl 6, allowing him to take enough levels of warhulk to qualify into warhulk

[Aegis013]

You can get into Anima Mage at level 2, if Martial Study is allowed to be taken at level one.

Human Martial Wizard with 2 flaws.
Martial Study devoted spirit
Precocious Apprentice
Metamagic of choice
Bind Vestige
Improved Binding

I think this works, AFB so I can't double check until later. Martial Study can be exchanged for Apprentice (one that gives intimidate) if you can get that allowed as a fighter feat.

It's not quite perfect since it requires some DM permission though.

[Necroticplague]

A human spellcaster could qualify for Wild Mage at second level (4 levels in three skills, 2 feats with no prereqs).

[Segev]

Delaying leveling is from DDO, technically its against the rules of PnP to do so.

however, if the group kills a tarrasque, the level 1 should get enough XP to reach lvl 6, allowing him to take enough levels of warhulk to qualify into warhulk

Quite specifically not. It is very much in the rules. You're allowed to build a "buffer" of exp above what it would take to level with the specific intent that this enables you to save up exp for spells, psionic powers, and item crafting which consume exp as part of their casting. This prevents you from accidentally leveling up after the penultimate fight and thus not having enough exp to cast a Wish in the final fight, amongst other things.

[Doug Lampert]

I'm fairly certain you can get into war hulk at level 1.

1 HD human (no class)


No such thing. Humanoids never have 1 racial HD. Humanoids with 1 HD exchange their racial HD for a class level, this is not optional and there is no rule allowing one to exist, there is no such thing as a humanoid with 1 racial HD, examples of 1 HD humanoids are all warriors or members of some other class.
SRD: "Humanoids with more than 1 Hit Die are the only humanoids who make use of the features of the humanoid type."

You simply can't have 1 HD, because the type of die is one of the features you don't get.

[torrasque666]

Also, don't you have to have had a feature/ability score/other prereq for 24 hours before it counts as permanent and thus qualify?

[Grod_The_Giant]

Pretty sure you have to meet the prerequsites for a class before you can take any levels in it. Even if you can pick up all the requisite feats, class features, and casting at first level, you can't take the PrC until second.

[heavyfuel]

A human spellcaster could qualify for Wild Mage at second level (4 levels in three skills, 2 feats with no prereqs).

Wild Mage requires 8 ranks in Spellcraft. Unless there's another version besides the CArc one.

[Necroticplague]

Wild Mage requires 8 ranks in Spellcraft. Unless there's another version besides the CArc one.

CEO, you're right, I thought spell craft was four ranks like the rest.

[Gavinfoxx]

The two classes I mentioned are

Disciple of the Eye and Singer of Concordance, both RotD.

If your DM rules Dragonwrought Kobolds are True Dragons, they can take those at 2nd level. Otherwise, read here:

http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?303204-The-Truest-of-the-True-A-Handbook-to-non-Kobold-Dragons-%28WIP%29

If you want to put them on a NORMAL dragon, especially the various low ECL/RHD wyrmlings.

[Urpriest]

Also, don't you have to have had a feature/ability score/other prereq for 24 hours before it counts as permanent and thus qualify?

Not for 3.5. You just need it at the moment you level.

[KillianHawkeye]

Racial Paragon classes

Racial Paragon classes are not actually prestige classes. You could take them at 1st level if you wanted to. The only requirement is being the correct race.

[Vaz]

Rainbow Servant can be entered by 2nd level, with Full caster 1+Eldritch Corruption.

[Rubik]

Pretty sure you have to meet the prerequsites for a class before you can take any levels in it. Even if you can pick up all the requisite feats, class features, and casting at first level, you can't take the PrC until second.Depends on the class and the prereq. Classes with no prereqs but, say, race, or racial abilities, can be taken at level 1.

[Divide by Zero]

however, if the group kills a tarrasque, the level 1 should get enough XP to reach lvl 6, allowing him to take enough levels of warhulk to qualify into warhulk

I may be remembering wrong, since I'm AFB, but doesn't the War Hulk give no BAB advancement? i.e. you'll never qualify for it unless you take another class.

[KillianHawkeye]

I may be remembering wrong, since I'm AFB, but doesn't the War Hulk give no BAB advancement? i.e. you'll never qualify for it unless you take another class.

That's correct. War Hulk gives +2 Strength at EVERY level. Giving BAB on top of that would just be crazy!

[nedz]

I managed to get a character into Horizon Walker as their first character level. Now this was not ECL 1 since RHD and LA were involved. A Janni with the Educated feat if you are interested.

[Curmudgeon]

Quite specifically not. It is very much in the rules. You're allowed to build a "buffer" of exp above what it would take to level with the specific intent that this enables you to save up exp for spells, psionic powers, and item crafting which consume exp as part of their casting. This prevents you from accidentally leveling up after the penultimate fight and thus not having enough exp to cast a Wish in the final fight, amongst other things.
Nope; there's no buffering of XP allowed, and "intent" doesn't factor into the rules.
When your character’s XP total reaches at least the minimum XP needed for a new character level (see Table 3–2), he or she “goes up a level.”
There are 3 alternatives to going up a level. But the requirement in every case is that you have to do so immediately.
A character cannot spend so much XP on an item that he or she loses a level. However, upon gaining enough XP to attain a new level, he or she can immediately expend XP on creating an item rather than keeping the XP to advance a level.

You cannot spend so much XP that you lose a level, so you cannot cast the spell unless you have enough XP to spare. However, you may, on gaining enough XP to achieve a new level, immediately spend the XP on casting the spell rather than keeping it to advance a level.
Each time a character's level adjustment is eligible to be reduced, the character may pay an XP cost to take advantage of the reduction. The character must pay an amount of XP equal to (his current ECL -1) × 1,000. This amount is immediately deducted from the character's XP total. There's no way to buffer up that XP when you're above the minimum required to advance to the next level. You must immediately expend it in one of the allowed alternative ways, or go up a level.

[Segev]

Nope; there's no buffering of XP allowed, and "intent" doesn't factor into the rules.
There are 3 alternatives to going up a level. But the requirement in every case is that you have to do so immediately.
There's no way to buffer up that XP when you're above the minimum required to advance to the next level. You must immediately expend it in one of the allowed alternative ways, or go up a level.

You do realize that each of those quotes is kind-of meaningless if you interpret "immediately" as literally as possible. "Oh, I beat a monster. I now can level. Too bad I'm not at my forge, so I can't spend this on that weapon I meant to."

The thing is, the rules also specify that you actually don't level until you take some time to "reflect," as a general rule. You don't, as a general rule, level up the moment you complete an encounter.

[toapat]

I managed to get a character into Horizon Walker as their first character level. Now this was not ECL 1 since RHD and LA were involved. A Janni with the Educated feat if you are interested.

I meant ECL2 in the OP, ie, why i named both the rather silly Mystic Theurge casting trick and the commoner

[Story]

That's correct. War Hulk gives +2 Strength at EVERY level. Giving BAB on top of that would just be crazy!

Sounds like a case for Divine Power.

[Curmudgeon]

The thing is, the rules also specify that you actually don't level until you take some time to "reflect," as a general rule. You don't, as a general rule, level up the moment you complete an encounter.
I'm afraid you're mistaken. The normal rules (Player's Handbook, page 58) say:
Characters accumulate XP from one adventure to another. When a character earns enough XP, he or she attains a new character level (see Table 3–2: Experience and Level-Dependent Benefits, page 22).

Advancing a Level: When your character’s XP total reaches at least the minimum XP needed for a new character level (see Table 3–2), he or she “goes up a level.”
Perhaps you're thinking of the variant rules in Dungeon Master's Guide starting on page 197:
Research and training aren’t a part of the standard rules. They’re assumed to be going on in the background. However, you control the background and can decide how you want to handle things such as this. Keep in mind, however, that leaving them in the background is a fine choice.
...
GAINING CLASS BENEFITS
You can mandate that to gain any of the newfound class-based benefits earned by advancing a level, a character needs to perform some overall training.
...
GENERAL DOWNTIME
If you dislike the idea of all this formalized training getting in the way of the heroic, epic campaign you have going, simply require that whenever a character gains a new level she must spend one day per level (or just 1d4 days) in downtime. During this period the character is busy training, focusing, or simply resting and cannot cast spells, go on adventures, and so on.

[Segev]

If your interpretation is correct, then it is not possible to actually use the rule that you can immediately dump exp into crafting. You're never at your crafting table the moment you gain exp.

[Curmudgeon]

If your interpretation is correct, then it is not possible to actually use the rule that you can immediately dump exp into crafting. You're never at your crafting table the moment you gain exp.
That's not a game rule. You gain XP when the DM decides to grant them. The DM could hold off on granting XP until you're out of danger and back home, and some DMs work that way by default.

[Segev]

That's not a game rule. You gain XP when the DM decides to grant them. The DM could hold off on granting XP until you're out of danger and back home, and some DMs work that way by default.

Since you need DM permission to pull any of this stuff off anyway, you may as well ask your DM to hold off on the exp until you get the spells cast on you.