ranged knockdown and improved trip?

[sideswipe]

if i have a bow with the aptitude enchantment and i use greater manyshot (not needed but just a tonne of attacks) and i fire them at opponents and deal more then 10 damage with each arrow, can i then use knockdown to cause trips and then improved trip to attack again?

i think not but it was a thought.

[heavyfuel]

if i have a bow with the aptitude enchantment and i use greater manyshot (not needed but just a tonne of attacks) and i fire them at opponents and deal more then 10 damage with each arrow, can i then use knockdown to cause trips and then improved trip to attack again?

i think not but it was a thought.

It doesn't work. Knock-Down requires the damage to have been dealt in melee. Even an aptitude bow damage is dealt in range

[Kazudo]

Interesting thing I never noticed. Knockback (races of stone) only requires you to score a hit while power attacking. You can power attack, then make a ranged attack. It wastes the power attack, but makes you capable of using Knockback even at range.

Now, as far as Knock-Down is concerned, yeah. Has to be melee damage.

[heavyfuel]

Interesting thing I never noticed. Knockback (races of stone) only requires you to score a hit while power attacking. You can power attack, then make a ranged attack. It wastes the power attack, but makes you capable of using Knockback even at range.

Now, as far as Knock-Down is concerned, yeah. Has to be melee damage.

This doesn't work either :smalltongue:

PA requires a melee attack roll, not a ranged one.

[Kazudo]

Ok, except Knockback doesn't specify melee attack.

You have to Power Attack, then land a hit. It doesn't say with what.

Power Attack happens SEPARATELY to melee attacks. You actually have to declare you're Power Attacking BEFORE making any attack rolls.

You call Power Attack, attack with a bow, it still triggers Knockback.

[heavyfuel]

Ok, except Knockback doesn't specify melee attack.

You have to Power Attack, then land a hit. It doesn't say with what.

Power Attack happens SEPARATELY to melee attacks. You actually have to declare you're Power Attacking BEFORE making any attack rolls.

You call Power Attack, attack with a bow, it still triggers Knockback.

Wow. You're right! Power Attack can be used with anything, though it only gives you the penalties/bonuses on melee attack/damage rolls.

Dysfunctional RAW much?

[2xMachina]

You can also use Force Bow for power attacking in range.

[Darrin]

Wow. You're right! Power Attack can be used with anything, though it only gives you the penalties/bonuses on melee attack/damage rolls.

Dysfunctional RAW much?

If the DM shoots this down, you could try adding some Bloodstorm Blade (Tome of Battle), which explicitly allows melee feats (such as Power Attack or Knock-Down) to work on thrown weapon attacks.

[sideswipe]

If the DM shoots this down, you could try adding some Bloodstorm Blade (Tome of Battle), which explicitly allows melee feats (such as Power Attack or Knock-Down) to work on thrown weapon attacks.

so if i take master thrower and i power attack from a distance after jumping at them...... im not going to actually put the connections up but it seems it might work....

someone who is a better lawyer then me does this work with bloodstorm blade?

i throw one or more thrown weapons. power attacking with them, they all deal 10 or more damage. can i then as a bloodstorm blade use knockdown and improved trip? since it states explicitly that melee feats can be used when thrown?

then. can i use leap attack, shock trooper ect to make an uber charger that then uses knockdown and improved trip. but with throwing weapons?

i already have discussed with my DM on a current character i have that since i took trhow anything and i throw greatswords with two hands that i can power attack and get double damage.....

you see what i am trying to do but i have no experience with the class or with trippers.

[Darrin]

How about...

Race: Human.
1) Barbarian 1. Feat: Power Attack. Bonus: PB Shot. Spirit Lion Totem -> Pounce. Whirling Frenzy.
2) Barbarian 2. Wolf Totem -> Improved Trip.
3) Fighter 1. Feat: Knock-Down. Bonus: Precise Shot.
4) Fighter 2. Bonus: WF Thrown.
5) Warblade 1.
6) Bloodstorm Blade 1. Feat: Leap Attack. Bonus: Throw Anything.
7) Bloodstorm Blade 2. Thunderous Throw.
8) Master Thrower 1. Bonus: Quickdraw.
9) Master Thrower 2. Feat: Improved Bull Rush.
10) Master Thrower 3.
11) Master Thrower 4.
12) Master Thrower 5. Feat: Shock Trooper.

Hmm. I'm not really feeling the love with Master Thrower. I'm not sure it adds much to the build. Palm Throw can only be used with smaller weapons, and you don't get your Str bonus on that or Weak Spot. Double Toss and Trip Shot are kind of redundant. Deadeye Shot and Two With One Blow might be useful for larger weapons + Power Attack, but I get the feeling those five levels spent on Master Thrower would probably be bette spent on something else.

[heavyfuel]

If the DM shoots this down, you could try adding some Bloodstorm Blade (Tome of Battle), which explicitly allows melee feats (such as Power Attack or Knock-Down) to work on thrown weapon attacks.

Not really. BS Blade only allows Power Attack to work... Well, PA and any feat that requires melee attack rolls (which are different from melee attacks)

[sideswipe]

How about...

Race: Human.
1) Barbarian 1. Feat: Power Attack. Bonus: PB Shot. Spirit Lion Totem -> Pounce. Whirling Frenzy.
2) Barbarian 2. Wolf Totem -> Improved Trip.
3) Fighter 1. Feat: Knock-Down. Bonus: Precise Shot.
4) Fighter 2. Bonus: WF Thrown.
5) Warblade 1.
6) Bloodstorm Blade 1. Feat: Leap Attack. Bonus: Throw Anything.
7) Bloodstorm Blade 2. Thunderous Throw.
8) Master Thrower 1. Bonus: Quickdraw.
9) Master Thrower 2. Feat: Improved Bull Rush.
10) Master Thrower 3.
11) Master Thrower 4.
12) Master Thrower 5. Feat: Shock Trooper.

Hmm. I'm not really feeling the love with Master Thrower. I'm not sure it adds much to the build. Palm Throw can only be used with smaller weapons, and you don't get your Str bonus on that or Weak Spot. Double Toss and Trip Shot are kind of redundant. Deadeye Shot and Two With One Blow might be useful for larger weapons + Power Attack, but I get the feeling those five levels spent on Master Thrower would probably be bette spent on something else.

no master thrower then. maybe just a couple more levels of fighter to get bonus feats for imp bull rush and shock trooper.maybe flaws for brutal throw so you dont need such MAD for str and dex, just a moderate dex for feats.

so would it work? power attack (DM fiat that i run and jump at the target with a thrown great sword to get all the bonuses of power attack like a super charger) and deal a tonne of damage, then a free trip attempt on them and then another attack (can i power attack on the second one if i have quickdraw for another greatsword?)

that work?