Issues regarding trap finding.

[Chester]

Hello everyone!

I just have a few questions regarding trap finding etc. Some issues have come up in the past when I was last DM, and as it's now my turn again, I want to set the record straight.

1. One one occasion the last time I ran an adventure, the party failed to search for traps in any room. Of course, there was a door handle smeared with Dragon Bile. It would have been easy enough to find had they searched. However, as soon as I mentioned the saving throw, some members of the party began to argue that the rogue (who opened the door) should have been able to easily see the poison, and therefore was entitled to a spot check before he opened the door. Eventually, I argued that in low light, it isn't necessarily easy to spot, and that the poison wasn't exactly smeared with gusto all over the place--it was strategically placed. They agreed, and the rogue failed the save. Do you think that the party members were correct regarding the free spot check?

2. Who, exactly, can actually find traps? Disable them? We've been playing that anyone can find but only the person who put actual skill points into DD can disarm them. Is this accurate? Does the same apply to magical traps / symbols / etc.?

Any help is greatly appreciated. Thank you. :smallsmile:

[Red Fel]

1. One one occasion the last time I ran an adventure, the party failed to search for traps in any room. Of course, there was a door handle smeared with Dragon Bile. It would have been easy enough to find had they searched. However, as soon as I mentioned the saving throw, some members of the party began to argue that the rogue (who opened the door) should have been able to easily see the poison, and therefore was entitled to a spot check before he opened the door. Eventually, I argued that in low light, it isn't necessarily easy to spot, and that the poison wasn't exactly smeared with gusto all over the place--it was strategically placed. They agreed, and the rogue failed the save. Do you think that the party members were correct regarding the free spot check?

Six of one, half-dozen of the other. Generally speaking, a Search (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/skills/search.htm) check is a standard action, an active choice made by the player. There are many special rules for Search (listed in the link above), but none of them describe it as a passive or automatic action. The Rogue-specific one observes:

While anyone can use Search to find a trap whose DC is 20 or lower, only a rogue can use Search to locate traps with higher DCs.The section further notes that only Rogues can detect magic traps. The section on magic traps (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/traps.htm#magicTraps) again notes that:

A successful Search check (DC 25 + spell level) made by a rogue (and only a rogue) detects a magic trap before it goes off. Other characters have no chance to find a magic trap with a Search check.Finally, the Rogue Trapfinding (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/classes/rogue.htm#trapfinding) ability observes, once again, that only Rogues can detect difficult (higher than DC 20) nonmagical traps, and that only Rogues can use Disable Device to disable a magical trap.

So, all that said, generally speaking, the Rogue doesn't automatically get to spot the trap. Nothing says his Search checks are automatic. He has to actively make the search.

Why, then, did I say "half-dozen of the other?" Because maybe the player slipped. It happens. Sometimes players forget they have a class feature or an ability. And it's up to the DM whether to say "Sorry, you forgot you could do it, so you don't get to do it," or "Well, just this once, I'll let you reroll it; but you'd better remember next time."

Short version: The players were not correct about a free spot check. But hopefully, next time, they'll know to Search more thoroughly.


2. Who, exactly, can actually find traps? Disable them? We've been playing that anyone can find but only the person who put actual skill points into DD can disarm them. Is this accurate? Does the same apply to magical traps / symbols / etc.?

As mentioned above, Search lets anybody search for nonmagical traps of DC 20 or less. More complex or magical traps are basically in the Rogue's exclusive purview, absent some exceptions cited above. Similarly, Disable Device (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/skills/disableDevice.htm) notes limits on what traps can be disabled.

Rogues (and other characters with the trapfinding class feature) can disarm magic traps. A magic trap generally has a DC of 25 + the spell level of the magic used to create it.

The spells fire trap, glyph of warding, symbol, and teleportation circle also create traps that a rogue can disarm with a successful Disable Device check. Spike growth and spike stones, however, create magic traps against which Disable Device checks do not succeed. See the individual spell descriptions for details.

Generally speaking, however, anybody can Search for traps (as long as they are nonmagical and have a DC of 20 or less), and anybody can attempt a Disable Device check to disarm them (assuming they're nonmagical).

[jedipotter]

1.No, not exactly. They are thinking that ''door handle smeared'' with poison would be like globs of something and be easy to see. But, any posion trap on a door handle would be hard to see. That is kinda the point of a trap. The posion would be clear, or the same color as the handle, or just on the unseen side of the handel or so forth.

In any case, a rogue needs to state and use Trap Finding, they don't just get a free spot check. You don't use spot for a trap, anyway....it's search.


2.It depends. Anyone can search an easy trap (DC 20 or less), but Rogues (and only rogues) can use the search skill to locate traps when the task has a Difficulty Class higher than 20. Any one with Disable Device can disable a trap. Any one can break a trap physically. And lot of magic can disable a trap. Only rogues can disarm magic traps, other then classes that can use magic vs. traps.

[Chester]

Thank you kindly, both.

I'll bookmarking this for when it comes up!:smallsmile: