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Clumsyninja23
2014-07-21, 01:04 PM
Warning: This story will contain spoilers from the starter box adventure. If you're DM is planning on running this for you, I'd read no farther.

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So my group decides they want to try out the 5e starter box adventure to see how it goes. My group is usually pretty goofy, but within reason (usually). I expect everything to go smoothly throughout the adventure, with good combat and overall a good experience with the system. Things did not go as planned.

We have 4 players using the pre-made characters coming with the module. The players are playing their usual classes, with the one exception being that the player that usually plays the barbarian is playing the dex "Folk Hero" fighter. The only pre-made that isn't being used is the dwarven cleric. And a little background with my group: we like playing up the 1's and 20's on the rolls. Not to the point of things like a crit fumble table, but funny little stuff that makes the group chuckle or laugh. All in good fun.

Adventure start. They're hired by the dwarven merchant as per the adventure. While escorting the goods, they come across the goblin ambush site. With the two dead horses with arrows sticking out of them, the players immediately catch onto the fact that there are probably archers in the woods as the road narrows. The goblin archers ready their arrows as the PCs approach. The PCs call that they want to do perception checks even before I get to use their passive check.

First roll of the game is the goblin's stealth check. Natural freaking 1. So that's how this is going to be.

The PCs all rolled well on their checks, so I fluffed up that one of the goblins accidentally lose their grip on the arrow, sending it flying into the tree of a nearby goblin with a loud thunk, and that goblin shrieking in surprise. One of the goblins yells at the goblin that loosed the arrow in their shrieking high pitched voices, while the party is just looking on at the spectacle. Surprise attack: Unsuccessful.

Combat starts. The wizard and rogue roll extremely well, with the goblins right behind. The wizard steps forward and casts a spell (ray of frost I think?) at the nearest goblin, which after the movement is 30 ft away. The spell barely misses the target, but the rogue has successfully hidden inside the wagon as they spotted the goblins. The rogue pops up from his hiding place and his arrows finds a home: the goblin who accidentally gave away the ambush. Seriously wounded, but not down.

At this point, the order from the back to the front is
-Both fighters
-Rogue
-Wizard
-Goblins

The wizard was expecting at least the dex based fighter to get a higher initiative than the arrows. He was wrong.

3 arrows go flying towards the wizard, as he's the closest target and casting magic and the wizard is dropped to 1 hp. The last goblin drops his bow, pulls out his sword and shield as he's running, and stabs at the wizard, scoring a hit for 5 damage.

Bam, first round of combat isn't even over, wizard is down and out.

Combat continues with the wizard bleeding out on the ground, the noble fighter (str fighter for future reference) charging forward with his axe hitting nothing, dex fighter landing a hit with his bow, and the rogue landing another hit with his bow. At one point the strength fighter throws a javelin at a goblin that's trying to hide. He is slightly out of the normal range, so he has disadvantage on the roll. He rolls 2 d20's. We decide to use the dice from the box for this. The first lands on a 20 and the table cheers. The second rolls on a 1. The table erupts in disbelief at the roll, going from amazing to terrible. The player decides that as he pulls the javelin back to throw, it slips from his hands to the ground as he makes a throwing motion with no javelin in his hands and the table laughs.

Meanwhile, Mr. Wizard is still bleeding on the ground.

With only 1 goblin left, the dex fighter who was closest to the wizard (Who at this point has failed 2 death throws and succeeded once) decides to make a medicine check on him to keep him from dying. I'm thinking "Alright, good, it's an easy check, the wizard will live, all will be fine." I was so very wrong.

The rogue decides to chase the lone goblin who started to run away, finally killing him just before he gets out of range with an arrow to the back. Back with the wizard, the dex fighter makes his medicine check. The DC is 10. Very simple to make. He rolls very low, and doesn't succeed the check. Next round, the wizard bleeds out on the ground and dies.

Welcome to 5th edition!

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NEXT TIME ON D AND D:

The group head to town to try to get their elven friend resurrected, and aren't too kind to his body. Something something horses, something something sunburn. Oh, and they do plot stuff.

BlackPhoenix928
2014-07-21, 01:14 PM
I was the wizard. I was using our big d20 that flashes. That d20 did not like me at all, I think, because the situations it decided to go big were the least neccessary.

Callin
2014-07-21, 01:24 PM
Totally opposite of my first encouter. My Goblins stealth roll was a 25. I even added one extra because of the size of the group. 2 Archers and 3 Melee like the adventure says their tactics are.

Spoilers below!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

So opening round with the Elf Rogue Archer and Dwarf Fighter inspecting the dead horses. Surprise round I shoot the Archer once knocking him to 2 hp, miss with the second arrow on the fighter and the 3 charge. 2 to the Fighter and 1 to the archer. Hitting the fighter for a good amount. Fighter uses Second Wind, Archer disengages and runs away. Wizard casts sleep and rolls high enough to down all 3 of the Goblins on one side of the road. So then the melee Goblin left runs over and steps on one of his friends waking him up and stabs the Fighter. Then eats an axe to the face. The last Archer is being a pain hiding and sniping over and over again. They kill the remaingin sleeping goblins and the ones awake while the archer is kiting another PC through the woods. The Wizard tries to set a tree on fire, then the Goblin tries to run but gets murdered quickly.

They follow the path to the Goblin Warren. Using the chimney they climb up and surprise the Bugbear Leader and down him in the Surprise Round. Mop up the Goblins after. Room 7 they just murder them. The Goblin Leader room (6) and Bridge (5) they train encounters together and I kill the Wizard and down the Dwarf Fighter. Sleep was used and took out 2 Goblins one of them the leader, but they got woken up before they could be killed. They finally finished them off and went to town.

Turned in some quests then started on the Redbrand Ruffians quest. Killed the 4 at the inn and met the "new replacement" Wizard. They rested up and went to the hideout the next day. Room 2 they decided to stand in a straight line and fight in the door way. The 3 Ruffians decided on hit and run tactics and 1 got killed but not before critting once and hitting a second time on the Dwarf Fighter, second Ruffian ALSO crit once and hit once. Dropping the Fighter to 0. 3rd one decided to go after the archer in the corner near the door. Sleep was cast and got 1 of them to sleep. The last one hid behind barrels and was a pain in the tail since his AC went up higher than they could reliably hit. So after about 5 rounds he died..

The pit trap at 3 got 1 player and then the skeletons in room 4 were a joke. And that is where we left off with the Skeletons leveling then to lvl 3. (I ran a previous adventure that gave them 100xp so this leveling time is not normal for the adventure)

Lokiare
2014-07-28, 01:43 PM
The above posts just prove how swingy 5E is. If you like that kind of thing 5E is for you. If you don't and you want a game that has more player choice that affects the game, then 5e is not for you.

Human Paragon 3
2014-07-28, 03:54 PM
The above posts just prove how swingy 5E is. If you like that kind of thing 5E is for you. If you don't and you want a game that has more player choice that affects the game, then 5e is not for you.

I think it proves the following:

1) If you are a wizard, you should not run out to the front of the party
2) Cast powerful spells at the start of encounters, don't save the big guns for the end. You might as well open heavy because you might not get another round (because combat is over or you're bleeding out).
3) If possible, have a cleric (or other healer) in your party.
4) DMs, if you think it won't be fun for your players to watch a character bleed out, don't have the enemy use dogpile tactics on the weakest party member.

4 - Cavaet: based on what I read, I would have run the encounter the exact same way, so this isn't a knock on the DM.

But seriously. Wizard. Stay near the back and cast your best spells first.

WickerNipple
2014-07-28, 04:09 PM
I think it proves the following:

1) If you are a wizard, you should not run out to the front of the party
2) Cast powerful spells at the start of encounters, don't save the big guns for the end. You might as well open heavy because you might not get another round (because combat is over or you're bleeding out).
3) If possible, have a cleric (or other healer) in your party.
4) DMs, if you think it won't be fun for your players to watch a character bleed out, don't have the enemy use dogpile tactics on the weakest party member.

4 - Cavaet: based on what I read, I would have run the encounter the exact same way, so this isn't a knock on the DM.

But seriously. Wizard. Stay near the back and cast your best spells first.

All of the above, plus:

5) Mistakes will totally kill you. This edition is definitely deadly, and I do like deadly.

- - Oh and one question, were the players not aware of each others initiative?

MadBear
2014-07-28, 04:20 PM
The above posts just prove how swingy 5E is. If you like that kind of thing 5E is for you. If you don't and you want a game that has more player choice that affects the game, then 5e is not for you.

I like a game that is deadly, and players decisions matter. Especially something as dumb as the wizard running to the front of combat ahead of the tougher players. I guess that means 5E is for me. (seriously, I have a hard time seeing any story play out where the frailest guy without armor runs in front of an entire ambush using bows, and expects it to turn out well).

btw, Lokiare, do you not like this new edition? I totally can't tell. then again, anything to get a jab at the new edition, am I right ;).

Callin
2014-07-28, 08:36 PM
My players knew every ones Init. It was just bad tactics shortly into the fight that led to what happened. Not to mention not using a light source so the Halfling and Human could see, until later into the fight.

brocadecity
2014-07-28, 08:53 PM
It's probably worth noting that goblins are a little tougher in some respects than in 3e. 2 more hit points, +2 more on their melee. One of my players whose been playing since 2e cursed them as supergoblins after 1 took a decent hit and did not fold

Clumsyninja23
2014-07-28, 11:51 PM
The above posts just prove how swingy 5E is. If you like that kind of thing 5E is for you. If you don't and you want a game that has more player choice that affects the game, then 5e is not for you.

Well, you have to remember that this was at level one. I don't think it's so much on the edition as much as everyone only having 1 hd of hit points.

And they do know each other's initiatives, I think he was just thinking the others would act before the goblins. Their initiative is usually unknown until their first action.

TrexPushups
2014-07-29, 10:38 AM
He definitely should have sought cover and waited until one of the melee ones came in spell range.

Human Paragon 3
2014-07-29, 10:44 AM
He definitely should have sought cover and waited until one of the melee ones came in spell range.

Also, the odds are very much in the favor of a bleeding out PC to survive. They have a 50% chance to pass a save, a 40% chance to fail a save, a 5% chance to fail 2 saves, and a 5% chance to instantly stabilize. In order to die, you have to fail three saves before you receive healing or a successful heal check from an ally.

If another wizard character did the exact same thing at a different table, and the DM played the encounter the exact same way, that character would most likely survive the encounter despite making the most dangerous decisions possible.

What this means is that the above wizard used poor tactics AND the DM used very aggressive and wise tactics, and then the player was unlucky.

Of course this should end up in a character death. This is the exact situation that should end in a character death!

Callin
2014-07-29, 11:00 AM
Also, the odds are very much in the favor of a bleeding out PC to survive. They have a 50% chance to pass a save, a 40% chance to fail a save, a 5% chance to fail 2 saves, and a 5% chance to instantly stabilize. In order to die, you have to fail three saves before you receive healing or a successful heal check from an ally.

If another wizard character did the exact same thing at a different table, and the DM played the encounter the exact same way, that character would most likely survive the encounter despite making the most dangerous decisions possible.

What this means is that the above wizard used poor tactics AND the DM used very aggressive and wise tactics, and then the player was unlucky.

Of course this should end up in a character death. This is the exact situation that should end in a character death!

That pretty much hit it. Once I noticed things going south I played the Goblins a bit more Over Confident. They were winning after all. The Wizard rolled very poorly on his saves by not rolling above a 5 three times in a row. Nobody decided to help him either. With two people adjacent or within 3 or so squares.