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jqavins
2014-07-24, 04:11 PM
Before I make up and post all the details, is there a base class out there that has no casting, no great fighting ability, average BAB, saves, and feat progression, and a sick boatload of skill points?

Zaydos
2014-07-24, 04:24 PM
Before I make up and post all the details, is there a base class out there that has no casting, no great fighting ability, average BAB, saves, and feat progression, and a sick boatload of skill points?

If you're talking about official classes the closest is Feat Rogue which misses out on average feat progression.

If you're looking for homebrew... tall tale (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?326799-Tall-Tale-%283-5-Base-Class-Contest-Winner-PEACH%29) and Scholar (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?196365-Scholar-%283-X-NPC-class-abilities-needed%29) are my attempts. Tall Tale can have great fighting ability or not depending upon how you build it. Scholar was an Int based skill class made to be the old knowledgeable guy and aimed at roughly Fighter balance point, but one might help you.

jqavins
2014-07-24, 07:55 PM
If you're talking about official classes the closest is Feat Rogue which misses out on average feat progression.

If you're looking for homebrew... tall tale (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?326799-Tall-Tale-%283-5-Base-Class-Contest-Winner-PEACH%29) and Scholar (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?196365-Scholar-%283-X-NPC-class-abilities-needed%29) are my attempts.
Scholar comes closer to what I have in mind, but isn't really it at all. I guess I'll write mine up and post it.

Keledrath
2014-07-24, 09:25 PM
Honestly, this sounds like factotum, but bad.

The Grue
2014-07-24, 09:31 PM
Honestly, this sounds like factotum, but bad.

More or less what I was thinking. Factotum has average BAB, saves, and a sick boatload of skill points in addition to casting and great fighting abilities. The only thing it lacks is a feat progression - actually it's kind of feat starved, if you're taking all the Int to X feats and multiple copies of Font of Inspiration.

But I could be wrong - I mean I haven't even seen the class yet. As a player with a weakness for skill monkey classes, I look forward to reading it.

Zaydos
2014-07-24, 10:07 PM
Ooh thought of an (semi) official base class you might should look at the Master from the War of the Lance book for the Dragonlance Campaign setting, it's a mundane skill based class. I remember not liking it (and forgot it existed) but you might see something you like.

jqavins
2014-07-25, 05:27 AM
More or less what I was thinking. Factotum has average BAB, saves, and a sick boatload of skill points in addition to casting and great fighting abilities. The only thing it lacks is a feat progression - actually it's kind of feat starved, if you're taking all the Int to X feats and multiple copies of Font of Inspiration.

But I could be wrong - I mean I haven't even seen the class yet. As a player with a weakness for skill monkey classes, I look forward to reading it.
What I'm looking for (or aiming to brew) is not just a skill monkey but a skill monster. It's more likely to see action as an NPC class; I think it could be playable, but I suspect not many would want to play it. But I'd want to give it a try.

Daws2727
2014-07-25, 07:59 PM
I homebrewed a skillish class, which is on the board right now, called the Hunter, but it's for 4e so I don't know if it would work for you. Still check it out though.
http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?363404-New-Class-The-Hunter

The Grue
2014-07-25, 08:07 PM
What I'm looking for (or aiming to brew) is not just a skill monkey but a skill monster. It's more likely to see action as an NPC class; I think it could be playable, but I suspect not many would want to play it. But I'd want to give it a try.

Can't comment further until you post the class so let me reiterate that I look forward to you doing so, that I may then read it.

Noctis Vigil
2014-07-25, 10:18 PM
A skill monster? The Handyman can do that! (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?219124-The-Handyman-Master-of-All-Skills-%283-5-base-class-PEACH%29) I like the idea of a skill monkey, but it needs to be better at skills than anything else, hence my attempt here.

[/shameless plug]

Epsilon Rose
2014-07-25, 10:28 PM
I feel I should point out that, in 3.5 and PF, skills tend to be rather limited in their capabilities and and difficult in their use. I'd be worried that a class that just focussed on having a large number of skills and large bonuses to those skills would lack for meaningful things to do, particularly in combat. One of their only really viable skills would be diplomacy, which rapidly breaks if you pump it. Out side of that the other interaction skills tend to have unfortunate action costs.

bekeleven
2014-07-26, 02:37 AM
I feel I should point out that, in 3.5 and PF, skills tend to be rather limited in their capabilities and and difficult in their use. I'd be worried that a class that just focussed on having a large number of skills and large bonuses to those skills would lack for meaningful things to do, particularly in combat. One of their only really viable skills would be diplomacy, which rapidly breaks if you pump it. Out side of that the other interaction skills tend to have unfortunate action costs.

A class with no class features except "You have Level+3 skill ranks in every skill" is probably low-mid tier 4. Mundane classes capable of keeping up with casters, invokers and initiators tend to look like my Professional (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=332829). Which, for the record, has 8+Int skill points and a feat progression.

jqavins
2014-07-26, 08:39 AM
A class with no class features except "You have Level+3 skill ranks in every skill" is probably low-mid tier 4. Mundane classes capable of keeping up with casters, invokers and initiators tend to look like my Professional (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=332829). Which, for the record, has 8+Int skill points and a feat progression.
My JOAT, which I finished last night on y other computer before the battery died, so I'll post it once I get some charge, has 10+1.5*int mod per level, and the ranks cap doubled. And I ended up with more fetures that I expected, all geared to enhancing skills.

It's an experiment. It's most likely best for NPCs or GMPCs, but personally I'd give it a shot. It'll be up soon.

Epsilon Rose
2014-07-26, 09:12 AM
A class with no class features except "You have Level+3 skill ranks in every skill" is probably low-mid tier 4. Mundane classes capable of keeping up with casters, invokers and initiators tend to look like my Professional (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=332829). Which, for the record, has 8+Int skill points and a feat progression.

Type class has a lot of features beyond just skill points and skill boosters. If you took out umd and diplomacy, I'm not so sure a class that only maxes every skill would hit t4, rather than t5. Even with those skills, I'm not sure if they make it out of t5.

jqavins
2014-07-26, 11:27 AM
A skill monster? The Handyman can do that! (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?219124-The-Handyman-Master-of-All-Skills-%283-5-base-class-PEACH%29) I like the idea of a skill monkey, but it needs to be better at skills than anything else, hence my attempt here.

[/shameless plug]
I'd already written "Yeah, I can do that" as the character class quote for mine. Heheh. I also made the same mistake about automatic relieving failures, which I had at 5th level. I'm stealing Greater Synergy to replace it.

My Jack of All Trades is noe posted here (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?363834-Jack-of-All-Trades-(JOAT)&p=17831702#post17831702).