Running Savage Tides Campaign - Books to Ban

[7H3LaughingMan]

I am just making a quick post so I can get some ideas on which books I shouldn't allow or maybe anything specifically I shouldn't allow. I have DMed before and not new to it, however there are several books I am not familiar with in regards to D&D 3.5. Any suggestions would be greatly helpful!

[Twilightwyrm]

No specific books come to mind. The adventure path is based upon exploration and investigation, with fairly standard treasure allotments and no specific handicaps on the players, so unless you are overly generous with the information divination yield, there is nothing someone could do to the campaign with any other book I can think of, that is worse than what they can do with core. A few subsystems might seem a bit anachronistic, for lack of a better term, given the fairly mundane, Greyhawk setting, but they can be easily incorporated.

So the question is: Do you have a selection of books you normally ban? Do you have new players? If the answer is no to both, then it should be no here. If yes to the first, keeping said books banned will generally not unduly handicap the players. Feel free to restrict (not ban, but restrict) the use of books and subsystems you are unfamiliar with. If yes to the second, I would restrict (not ban) access to any and/or all of Psionics, Incarnum and ToB, just because learning these additional subsystems on top of the mass that is normal D&D can be rather intimidating.

Note: When I say "restrict", I mean that material from any of these books if subject to DM scrutiny prior to being used, and any new subsystem to be used must be explained, to the Dm's satisfaction, prior to it being employed.

[Malroth]

In general the most useful ban list is "any spells or classes from the PHB" nothing else in the game is nearly as problematic either on the overpowered side or the underpowered side

[Hazrond]

In general the most useful ban list is "any spells or classes from the PHB" nothing else in the game is nearly as problematic either on the overpowered side or the underpowered side

Hey now, the wizards and sorcerers are weak enough as it is with those d4 hit dice, do they REALLY need to be abused more? :smallwink:

[Graypairofsocks]

Yes, they do.

[Zilter]

I have been a player in Savage Tides, and the main thing I found annoying was that we went at least half a dozen levels without the opportunity to buy stuff. We might have done something wrong there, but we were severely undergeared for while.

As for books, our group have always said no to Tome of Battle, Tome of Magic and the whole shebang of psionics. Some agree with that, some don't. We like it that way.

[Sian]

I have been a player in Savage Tides, and the main thing I found annoying was that we went at least half a dozen levels without the opportunity to buy stuff. We might have done something wrong there, but we were severely undergeared for while.

As for books, our group have always said no to Tome of Battle, Tome of Magic and the whole shebang of psionics. Some agree with that, some don't. We like it that way.

Pulling a day out of the adventuring calendar to send the wizard on a shopping trip, teleporting from Farshore to Sasserine and back? (seem to remember that it would need 2 teleports each way untill you can do more than 1100-1300 miles). beyond a few spots (getting to Farshore, and later on getting ready for the attack on Farshore and even then it should be possible with the rest of the party doing non-adventuring preperation), it lets the players take their time to wander off.

[Zombimode]

I am just making a quick post so I can get some ideas on which books I shouldn't allow or maybe anything specifically I shouldn't allow. I have DMed before and not new to it, however there are several books I am not familiar with in regards to D&D 3.5. Any suggestions would be greatly helpful!

Don't ban any books. Seriously.

Just tell your players (it should be expected, by some players need to be told) "make reasonable characters, no TO stuff".


In general the most useful ban list is "any spells or classes from the PHB" nothing else in the game is nearly as problematic either on the overpowered side or the underpowered side

To the contrary. This is the worst ban possible. Most of the stuff in the PHB is baseline and/or iconic. Banning the PHB makes character creation awkward, it arbitrarily removes spells that are expected to be there because they are iconic to the fantasy genre.
The workload of the DM would likewise explode, since now the simple builds and options arent there anymore.

[Sian]

More on topic ... Ban what you don't know enough about to feel comfortable using ... Personally i have banned Magic of Incarnum for the longest times since i never got around looking into it (although i probably would if a player requested it), and the same with some of the more obsurce books such as Tome of Magic, and certain regional setting splatbooks which doesn't fit

[Starchild7309]

I am currently running this campaign and it feels as though its made for your standard fighter, wizard, rogue, cleric party. There is a long stretch where buying and re supplying is impossible. Having a non standard group class wise, somethings that should have been hard were so easy and some simple stuff was overly difficult for them. I wouldn't ban anything, but if you have optimizers you are going to have to buff up much of the opponents.

[draken50]

I have a lot of restrictions, mostly based on the materials I own and/or am familiar with.

I have a pretty outright ban on psionics, not because I think they're overpowered, or anything like that. Simply because I do not have the psionics book, and little interest in exploring them. As such if I have a player that wants to play a psion. I will allow it, provided, they give a me a hard copy of the book.

That being said, if there's a base class in a book I don't own a hard-copy of, I tend to be fine with it being run unless it has a ruleset I am completely unfamiliar with. Most feats and the like I allow, but few of my players are that big into optimization.

So really, only ban stuff that's going to take too much of your time to learn/understand/balance. Most restrictions on my end are just to make sure I've gotten a look at what they're doing beforehand. If you're not sure that a feat or the like is overpowered. Allow it, and if it is a problem, then ask the player to change it. If the player is pissy about it, well.. you're the DM. there's many options at your disposal.

[The Insanity]

Don't ban any books. Seriously.

Just tell your players (it should be expected, by some players need to be told) "make reasonable characters, no TO stuff".
This is the right answer.

[Pokonic]

This is the right answer.

Pretty much. Let's face it, there's subpar material in every sourcebook and splat. If a player is dedicated to cheesing their way through the campaign, than that's a issue that should by a conversation, not a banning of whatever book said cheese is coming from.

[Giddonihah]

Ban the Pun Pun book, its desert themed anyways, ban setting books not in your setting, most of them seem to only be used when breaking the game, exception being if you have a Warforged character for some weird reason. Ban any use of Anthropomorphic Baleen Whales from Savage species and other Anthros on the basis of being too powerful and too silly (alternatively get every player to play one). Either ban Psionics or make some decisions on how they work with magic, your choice.

Ban any spell that would wreck the campaign if it was used (Ice Assassin, sometimes teleport) and/or are too annoying for you to deal with (polymorph, summon spells)

[The Insanity]

Ban jerks from your table.

[Hazrond]

Ban the Pun Pun book, its desert themed anyways, Hey man, i LIKE sandstorm it gives you the wonderful Searing Spell metamagic for pyromancers

ban setting books not in your setting, most of them seem to only be used when breaking the game, exception being if you have a Warforged character for some weird reason. Meh, its a mixed bag here sometimes not banning the setting books gives stuff that fits perfectly, but other times it CAN cause problems atleast from my experience

Ban any use of Anthropomorphic Baleen Whales from Savage species and other Anthros on the basis of being too powerful and too silly (alternatively get every player to play one). Hey now, the Anthros may be a bit silly sometimes but you shouldnt say the ENTIRE template is banned, there are ways to make just about anything fun
Either ban Psionics or make some decisions on how they work with magic, your choice. standard fare here moving along

Ban any spell that would wreck the campaign if it was used (Ice Assassin, sometimes teleport) and/or are too annoying for you to deal with (polymorph, summon spells) in order to the presented spells, No, NO, Yes, No
Polymorph is the only one of those that could cause ANY real trouble because any DM in their right mind would just say "No your ice assassin spell fails" or "You ice assassin spell DOES copy X deity, but the magic was not powerful enough to copy their actual divinity"

[Hazrond]

ban jerks from your table.

ding ding ding we have a winner folks!

[mr_odd]

As for books, our group have always said no to Tome of Battle, Tome of Magic and the whole shebang of psionics. Some agree with that, some don't.

In the group I run, everything is basically acceptable. Players just need to ask my permission first. The only book I really don't want them using is anything to do with psionics.