Two handed guns in PF: Making sniping good?

[Snowbluff]

The title. I want to know if you guys have a way of making it good. Too many 'slingers use pistols.

[Sayt]

I've tried throwing together Slayer/Trench Fighter/Musket Master with the Stealthy Sniper Advanced talent and Hellcat stealth, but I haven't got it down yet, and I'm not sure if it's viable. (-20 to Hellcat Snipe is a hefty Penalty, and wouldn't really work against anyone but mooks, by which time you should be well beyond mooks)

[icefractal]

Double-Barreled guns are kind of cheese, but used as an alternative to dual-wielding they'd be acceptable (IMO). Where-as someone showing up with Dual Double-Barrel Pistols ... :smallfurious:

(And yes, I'm aware casters are not impressed. If the entire party was full-casters and a 2x 2x Pistol guy, that'd be fine. But it does completely trump any other non-caster build, which is problematic in many campaigns.)

[NightbringerGGZ]

Well there's the Bushwacker archetype which gets Sneak Attack damage if you want literal sniping. You're limited to a max range of 60 feat for that damage unless you pick up Sniper's Goggles. You'll still be dealing with normal sniping restrictions of 1 attack per round though, which Paizo is never going to make easier than current mechanics allow for. Frankly, I think you'd be better off with a Longbow wielding (anything with Sneak Attack Dice) simply because you could use Multishot.

So let's try something else. How about a Musket Master / Urban Barbarian mix? The idea is to fight with an Axe-Musket and go for a switch hitting build. High Dex, Decent Str and Con and dump Wisdom since you won't be using Grit for anything. You can boost either Dex or Str based on the type of fight you find yourself in, so your damage for either Ranged or Melee combat should be pretty decent. Standard feat selection for ranged builds and add in Power Attack.

I once put together a Luring Musketeer / Cad Fighter build for a low OP game, relying on some approved 3.5 material to get Dex to damage. We may be able to do something better with Trench Fighter though. Take Cavalier at level 1 so you get your free Musket, a ranged Challenge and the rest of the Cavalier package. Level 2-4 are Trench Fighter so you have Dex to Damage at level 4. This will also let you fast forward down the standard Ranged feat chain. From level 5 and on keep working on your Cavalier levels so you can add that bonus Challenge damage. At level 6, your Full BAB attacks will target touch AC at the second ranged increment and you ignore the range increment penalties. Pick up an Agile melee weapon so you can take advantage of the some of the switch-hitter mechanics in the build.

[9mm]

Musket Master already dishes the damage, the problem is the dual wield pistol users get the same tricks but double the barrels. Watch those reloads though.

[Anlashok]

But it does completely trump any other non-caster build, which is problematic in many campaigns.)
Depends on what you mean by "trump". Slightly more damage than normal in exchange for virtually zero utility isn't that great.

[Snowbluff]

Yeah that's certainly an issue.

Of course, we could use Greater Named Bullet, Foresight Wizard, and Deadeye or whatever to force a critical hit for a large multiplier...