Possible abuses for my Mithral "fix"

[heavyfuel]

So I've been meaning to implement a Mithral/Darkwood fix.


Weapons made out of Mithral/Darkwood can be considered one category lighter (2H -> 1H -> Light -> automatically finessable [even without the feat])
Shields are also considered one category smaller (Tower -> Extreme -> Heavy -> Light -> No shield [Buckler -> No shield as well]. ASF still a thing though)
Armors are as they are, but Light Armor isn't considered armor (so a Monk can wear it with no penalty. ASF still a thing though)


Can you guys foresee any issues with this fix?

[molten_dragon]

So I've been meaning to implement a Mithral/Darkwood fix.


Weapons made out of Mithral/Darkwood can be considered one category lighter (2H -> 1H -> Light -> automatically finessable [even without the feat])
Shields are also considered one category smaller (Tower -> Extreme -> Heavy -> Light -> No shield [Buckler -> No shield as well]. ASF still a thing though)
Armors are as they are, but Light Armor isn't considered armor (so a Monk can wear it with no penalty. ASF still a thing though)


Can you guys foresee any issues with this fix?

I don't see any serious issues with it. Most of the things it will enable could be done anyway.

[Phelix-Mu]

I like the use of mithral weapons to reduce weapon size. Seems like interesting stuff could be done with that.

A big problem with stuff that makes everyone better (like armour that isn't armour) is that it can also help spellcasters. Not that spellcasters have to wait long before their normal schtick totally outclasses anything they can do with magic armour, but armour is supposed to be a feature of classes with proficiency (albeit a very lackluster one). This fix allows money to pretty much erase that feature entirely.

Not to mention that it only really helps monks, who can already wear bracers of armour or enchant robes with ASAs (both of which will become superior choices to mithral eventually).

[Promises Kept]

Depending on how you rule the interaction between them, the Halfweight Armor Enchantment (from Underdark) might be open to abuse with this. It's a +3 Enhancement Equivalent that halves the weight of any armor and makes it count as light armor. If you apply these effects in the most favorable order, you can make any heavy armor count as no armor at all for ~26000 gp extra. That's potentially a problem with AC Creep for wis-based characters, who can grab +10 AC on top of a Monk's Belt.

[DarkSonic1337]

A big problem with stuff that makes everyone better (like armour that isn't armour) is that it can also help spellcasters. Not that spellcasters have to wait long before their normal schtick totally outclasses anything they can do with magic armour, but armour is supposed to be a feature of classes with proficiency (albeit a very lackluster one). This fix allows money to pretty much erase that feature entirely.


Uh...you can already use money to erase that feature. Simply buy armor that has 0% arcane spell failure and a 0 armor check penalty (mithral bucklers and +1 twilight mithral chainshirts for instance).

[Phelix-Mu]

Uh...you can already use money to erase that feature. Simply buy armor that has 0% arcane spell failure and a 0 armor check penalty (mithral bucklers and +1 twilight mithral chainshirts for instance).

Though that doesn't seem to help monks much, which is a benefit of the stated fix. But, yeah, it always bothered me that 3e rather seriously mitigated the way in which arcane spell failure worked. In 2e, it seemed a much more serious prohibition.

[heavyfuel]

Depending on how you rule the interaction between them, the Halfweight Armor Enchantment (from Underdark) might be open to abuse with this. It's a +3 Enhancement Equivalent that halves the weight of any armor and makes it count as light armor. If you apply these effects in the most favorable order, you can make any heavy armor count as no armor at all for ~26000 gp extra. That's potentially a problem with AC Creep for wis-based characters, who can grab +10 AC on top of a Monk's Belt.

That's exactly the kind of thing I was looking for. Thanks man!

Any other abuses?

[Zanos]

Depending on how you rule the interaction between them, the Halfweight Armor Enchantment (from Underdark) might be open to abuse with this. It's a +3 Enhancement Equivalent that halves the weight of any armor and makes it count as light armor. If you apply these effects in the most favorable order, you can make any heavy armor count as no armor at all for ~26000 gp extra. That's potentially a problem with AC Creep for wis-based characters, who can grab +10 AC on top of a Monk's Belt.
You can always buy bracers of armor, which also have the benefits of no ACP or ASF.

[Promises Kept]

You can always buy bracers of armor, which also have the benefits of no ACP or ASF.

True, true. This is both cheaper and more effective, however. Halfweight +4 Mithral Mechanus Gear costs ~60000 gp for +14 AC, whereas +8 Bracers of Armor cost 64000 gp for only +8 AC.

[QuickLyRaiNbow]

So I've been meaning to implement a Mithral/Darkwood fix.


Weapons made out of Mithral/Darkwood can be considered one category lighter (2H -> 1H -> Light -> automatically finessable [even without the feat])
Shields are also considered one category smaller (Tower -> Extreme -> Heavy -> Light -> No shield [Buckler -> No shield as well]. ASF still a thing though)
Armors are as they are, but Light Armor isn't considered armor (so a Monk can wear it with no penalty. ASF still a thing though)


Can you guys foresee any issues with this fix?

I'd say just roll in the bonuses from Feycraft and call it a day.

[heavyfuel]

I'd say just roll in the bonuses from Feycraft and call it a day.

The auto finessable property was definitely based off of feycraft weapons, although I did remove the damage penalty. As for armors and shields, it seems weird giving out a Concentration binus for having a mithral armor.

[jiriku]

The big thing that I see is that darkwood items are ridiculously cheap, and the various splatbooks considerably widen the field of armors that could be made from darkwood. You may find that the monk can afford a darkwood breastplate or somesuch as early as 2nd level.

[heavyfuel]

The big thing that I see is that darkwood items are ridiculously cheap, and the various splatbooks considerably widen the field of armors that could be made from darkwood. You may find that the monk can afford a darkwood breastplate or somesuch as early as 2nd level.

True dat! I might double darmwood price to make it seem more fair. Thanks

[Zombimode]

Can you guys foresee any issues with this fix?

The only issue I have with those that it makes Mithral/Darkwood the best. There is almost no reason to ever use anything else. This is a personal preference but I have a distaste for such variance reducing "fixes".

[heavyfuel]

The only issue I have with those that it makes Mithral/Darkwood the best. There is almost no reason to ever use anything else. This is a personal preference but I have a distaste for such variance reducing "fixes".

I don't think it does. Adamantine weapons still breaks DR/Adamantine and can be used for sundering (which doesn't reduce the WBL), I've also house rulled that shields also give DR that attacks with armor.

There's also the one material from storm wrack that allows you to apply AC to Deflection AC, as well as things like kaorti resin that give any weapon a critical of x4.

It honestly makes Mithral on par with them