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Anlashok
2014-08-05, 06:42 PM
Been looking at Ultimate Psionics recently and became curious what other people think of the classes. i.e. How would you tier the classes? Are there any you think are particularly bad or well designed?

For me, I see the Dread having a lot of issues. There isn't a whole lot of synergy between its casting side and its melee side, it isn't very strong at its niche and basically the entire class is propped up by a super over the top level 14 feature.

Psyren
2014-08-05, 07:43 PM
Dread is weak and I find Tactician a bit bland, but I love the rest. Vitalist gives psionics (and everyone, really) a very effective dedicated healing class. DSP also fixed the Soulknife and Wilder.

The true value I feel lies in the prestige classes, which are fun and varied. The Metamind fix is probably my favorite there, but there is something for everyone.

hoborobot
2014-08-05, 08:13 PM
in my game that im currently playing (cryptic, inquisitor, fighter/rogue, and a pony) the cryptictic managed to almost single handeledly kill clerics (2) and wizards (5) because we managed to rouse the whole dungeon. crazy branding pattern, like iajitsu strike except long distance and enemy doesnt have to be flat footed.

Fax Celestis
2014-08-05, 10:12 PM
They're all very good. The dread is pretty okay in a med-op game, but like the spell thief you can't play it like you think you should.

Muggins
2014-08-06, 12:37 AM
I actually quite like the Dread, especially at low- and mid-levels.

Pick up either Improved Unarmed Strike, Bludgeoner (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/feats/combat-feats/bludgeoner-combat) or Blade of Mercy (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/traits/religion-traits/blade-of-mercy-goddess-of-dawn), letting you deal nonlethal damage at no penalty.
Pick up Enforcer (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/feats/combat-feats/enforcer-combat) to perform an intimidate check every time you deal nonlethal damage. Success makes the target shakened, applying a -2 to their attack rolls, saving throws, skill checks and ability checks.
If you went for Improved Unarmed Strike, pick up Broken Dreams Style (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/psionics-unleashed/feats/broken-dreams-style-psionic-style) to add your devastating touch damage. Also pick up Shattered Dream Strike (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/psionics-unleashed/feats/shattered-dream-strike-psionic) for a second free intimidate check per attack, plus Nightmare Veil (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/psionics-unleashed/feats/nightmare-veil-psionic) to give yourself concealment("concealed") and to make your opponents flat-footed (assuming the attacker/target is shaken).
Get the Sickening (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/magic-items/magic-weapons/magic-weapon-special-abilities/cruel) weapon enhancement to sicken any creature you make shaken. This applies another -2 to their attack rolls, weapon damage, saving throws, skill checks and ability checks.
For terrors, pick up the ones like Terrified Escape, Haunting Steps, Consuming Nightmare, Mind Drain and Nightmare Form. It's a shame that you just don't get that many uses each day; consider buffing your Charisma and/or picking up the Extra Terrors (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/psionics-unleashed/feats/extra-terrors) feat.
If you went the Improved Unarmed Strike route, the Mind Rend terror might be viable for some pseudo-sneak attack (up to 6d8 base at level 19, or 6d10 by spending a power point). Given that some of the other terrors are rather lackluster (I'm looking at you, Chase Terror) you might be better off.
Maybe even pick up Weapon Focus (weapon of choice) and Dazzling Display (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/feats/combat-feats/dazzling-display-combat) for a good way to initiate combat with an advantage.
Naturally, if you end up pumping your Charisma, picking up Eldritch Heritage (Orc) or (Abyssal) will give you an equivalent bonus to Strength.

Anlashok
2014-08-06, 09:47 PM
I actually quite like the Dread, especially at low- and mid-levels.
I like the Dread, it's really cool, I just don't see it though in terms of power.

As a debuffer the class doesn't have a ton of raw power. It's not bad at it, but a -2 here or a slow there just don't compare to completely shutting down a target like say, a witch.
As a damage dealer it doesn't have the raw feat or power support to pump out big numbers.
As a gish its spell list conflicts with its other class features: A traditional gish buffs up and goes to town, a magus style gish wants to weave spells into their combat routine. The Dread doesn't really do either because its spell list is very active but he doesn't have any way to do both at once... except.

His level 14 class feature is stupid strong. You go from being a kind of mediocre melee to suddenly breaking action economy in half (as long as you can keep fear effects rolling). From a non-power standpoint I think it's actually kind of a bad thing, since so much of the class' strength is concentrated here the rest of the class doesn't feel as impressive.

As a non-power related thing I'm sort of peeved at how 90% of making a Dread work is going Broken Dreams.

Devastating touch is another one of those class features that seems kind of cool but doesn't have enough in-class support to make it really work (sort of like a Cryptic's channel disruption which doesn't do much for you unless you have the right archetype or feats).

As for other classes. I really like the way the Wilder turned out. It feels much better than the PF version but the ubiquity of student's surge disappoints me.

Alex12
2014-08-06, 10:23 PM
In the campaign I'm in (the same one hoborobot's in) the guy playing the Cryptic is a heavy optimizer, even though he denies it. In almost every game I've played with him, he's been the most powerful character in the party, despite the fact that I'm quite sure he's never read a handbook in his life. So that's not really a good comparison.
However, all three of the psionic classes that I've seriously looked at (Aegis, Cryptic, and Psion) look really cool.