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Teloric
2007-03-05, 11:48 AM
Hey all,

We're playing Eberron, with core books only. I'm looking at making an Archer character of some kind, maybe a longbowman, or a mounted archer. What can you suggest? Would a fighter be the best approach? Or would I be better off with a ranger or paladin? How about a cleric archer. Think low levels, about 1 to 4 or so...

Any tips you can offer would be helpful. I'm not a big fan of elves, if it matters...

Olethros
2007-03-05, 12:11 PM
My money is on a fighter, personally a human as long as your stats rolled aren’t so abysmal that you NEED a boost. The feet brick a fighter gets from those lvls are going to really help access the archery tree. All ranger would give you is use of one of those.

Of course I am baised for fighters.

paigeoliver
2007-03-05, 12:13 PM
Halfling archers are pretty darned good. Your first 6 levels should include 4 levels of fighter and 2 levels of ranger. The exact order doesn't matter. Be sure and get a riding dog. Halfling archers have lower strength than medium size archers so weapon specialization is pretty much required. That is why they have to take 4 fighter levels.

Dips of either swashbuckler or barbarian (or both) can really help halfling archers out when they are forced into melee.

Another archer trick. If you have a positive charisma then add in two to four levels of marshall. Take the ranged attack aura at 2nd level (basically offsetting your BAB loss). This allows you to gain some more abilities to help the party out.

Swordguy
2007-03-05, 12:16 PM
At 1-4, go for the human fighter. You'll pick up the feat tree for archery in its entirety really quick (BAB allowing). The ranger's skill points are nice, but he can't keep up over this short a period.

Sir Giacomo
2007-03-05, 01:11 PM
Incidently, I started a thread here discussing general fighter/caster balance:

http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=36333

You can easily ignore the balance discussion stuff; there is a (human) fighter build in there which goes the archer route. It's core only, but a good first guide.
A similarly strong option (if you wish to play a religious character with full divine spellcasting power) is a cleric geared to archer play with the spells divine power (gets fighter BAB, STR 18, bonus hit points) and divine favor (gets up to +6 greatly stackable luck bonus to attack and damage rolls).

Hope that helped.

- Giacomo

Bryn
2007-03-05, 01:18 PM
Be sure and get a riding dog dinosaur.

Well, it is Eberron.

To contribute to the thread, fighter gets you lots of feats. If you want to be slightly cheesy, and psionics are included among core, then a two-level dip in Psychic Warrior gets you two more, as well as a few psionic powers - it will harm your BaB though. Otherwise, what everyone else said.

axraelshelm
2007-03-05, 01:39 PM
hmm i suggest i elven wizard archer classic. cast you spells on your arrows and let fly maybe go into arcane acher later?

Bears With Lasers
2007-03-05, 01:40 PM
hmm i suggest i elven wizard archer classic. cast you spells on your arrows and let fly maybe go into arcane acher later?

Why would you do that and lose your spells when you miss, when you can just *cast* the spells?

Person_Man
2007-03-05, 01:43 PM
Core only archers are pretty weak. But if that's where you're going, I suggest a Halfling Ranger riding his animal companion.

axraelshelm
2007-03-05, 01:46 PM
Why would you do that and lose your spells when you miss, when you can just *cast* the spells?

Well some spells deal with making your arrows better or into different types of arrow heads and it doesn't stop the roleplayer saying that a fireball is shot out of the bow.

Bears With Lasers
2007-03-05, 01:50 PM
Well some spells deal with making your arrows better or into different types of arrow heads and it doesn't stop the roleplayer saying that a fireball is shot out of the bow.

Not many Sor/Wiz spells do that; they're generally ranger spells.
What does roleplaying have to do with anything we're talking about? I'm sure he can roleplay fine either way.

axraelshelm
2007-03-05, 01:56 PM
just saying theres more than one way to play an archer type and the archer wizard is not unheard of.
I mean if your going to be away from combat might aswell add a bit more punch to you arrows.

Matthew
2007-03-05, 01:57 PM
Lots of options. A Human Fighter is the easiest solution at Low Levels, but Ranger or Paladin might work as well. A Fighter might even have enough Feats to waste one on Exotic Weapon Proficiency (Great Bow)... still, at high levels you might wish you had gone with Cleric...

Bears With Lasers
2007-03-05, 02:00 PM
just saying theres more than one way to play an archer type and the archer wizard is not unheard of.
It's not unheard of; there's even a prestige class for it, the Arcane Archer.
It's just a complete waste of your wizard's standard actions.


I mean if your going to be away from combat might aswell add a bit more punch to you arrows.
Or, you know, just cast spells and not worry about missing your shot and losing the spell. That sounds like it'd be a lot more effective than plinking away with your 1/2 BAB and mediocre DEX.

axraelshelm
2007-03-05, 02:10 PM
then up the dex, true strike, flaming bolts, greater magic weapon and a host of stealth spells to get into postion it can be alot of fun.
And go pure wizard make different types magical arrows for differnet ocassion like firing a arrow of summoning behine enermy lines? Alot of things you can do.

Fax Celestis
2007-03-05, 02:13 PM
Psychic warrior archers are actually very decent, as are battle sorceror archers (particularly with smiting spell).

But apparently you're core-only. Go with a ranger.

Bears With Lasers
2007-03-05, 02:19 PM
then up the dex, true strike, flaming bolts, greater magic weapon and a host of stealth spells to get into postion it can be alot of fun.
And go pure wizard make different types magical arrows for differnet ocassion like firing a arrow of summoning behine enermy lines? Alot of things you can do.

Up the Dex at expense of your INT or CON. Brilliant.
True Strike. You'll hit with one shot, every two rounds. Great.
Flaming bolts. That'll sure help when you're missing.
GMW saves you money on a bow, it doesn't make it more accurate than it could otherwise be.
You can already just cast the summoning spell behind enemy lines.

Sorry, wizard archers make no sense. If you want a spellcasting archer, try a cleric.

axraelshelm
2007-03-05, 02:31 PM
wait a minute what about a weapon when you run or of spells? and you can use cats grace to up ur dex no need to waste a ability point. There are so many spells that can help nevermind mind developing them and a long bow does 100feet! and a summon spell range is 25feet plus 5per 2 levels? how you that out.

Darrin
2007-03-05, 02:37 PM
At 1-4, go for the human fighter. You'll pick up the feat tree for archery in its entirety really quick (BAB allowing). The ranger's skill points are nice, but he can't keep up over this short a period.

Ranger 2/Fighter 2 gets all the ranged feats a Fighter 4 gets, in addition to Track, 20 additional skill points, and Favored Enemy.

krunchyfrogg
2007-03-05, 02:38 PM
I've always been a fan of Elven Cleric archers. They get the longbow feat free, and you just get one of those exceptional bows (the ones that add STR damage), and with Bull's Strength you're great! Plus, you're not just some boring archer who can't do anything other than shoot arrows. Clerics can do so much more!

If not, I suggest a halfling ranger.

Swordguy
2007-03-05, 02:53 PM
Ranger 2/Fighter 2 gets all the ranged feats a Fighter 4 gets, in addition to Track, 20 additional skill points, and Favored Enemy.

I was thinking he couldn't multiclass for some reason... :smalleek:

Person_Man
2007-03-05, 02:58 PM
I'm with Bears on the archer debate.

Clerics get almost every buff spell that Wizards get, and plenty of useful buff spells Wizards don't get. Clerics get full armor. Clerics get more hit points. Clerics have spontaneous healing and Turn Undead. Clerics get the Zen Archery feat to replace their Dex bonus with their Wis bonus for ranged attacks, with no comparable X to Y feat for Int.

Wizards have a superior spell list in many circumstances (depending on what books you have access to and what you want to do with them). But that advantage is negated by the fact that Wizard/Archers will have fewer caster levels then strait Clerics. So the Fighter 4/Wizard 5/Arcane Archer X will have Invisibility, but the Cleric 10 has Righteous Might, Divine Might, Greater Magic Weapon, and other high level spells.

Teloric
2007-03-05, 03:05 PM
Wow, thanks for all the replies! Halflings in Eberron are definitely interesting with their dinosaur mounts and all. Also, Clerics with the Church of the Silver Flame are allowed to take the Longbow...

axraelshelm
2007-03-05, 03:21 PM
I wasn't even thinking of fighter considering wizards have 4 craft/meta magic feats you can use your other feats to make your self a more decent bowman.

Ikkitosen
2007-03-05, 03:22 PM
R2/F2 would be my suggestion for the first 4 levels, assuming psionics are not allowed. If they are then F2/PWar2 would be great.

Sir Giacomo
2007-03-05, 09:42 PM
Revised Fighter archer build up. Same link as above (5th page of thread). Enjoy...:smallsmile:

- Giacomo

The_Werebear
2007-03-05, 10:15 PM
Personally, I would say go Fighter/Rogue.

If you're doing archery, you will need something to get your damage a bit higher.