Learning New Maneuvers (ToB)

[CGDG]

I'm working ona Swordsage/Warblade and realized there is a question I have and I'm not sure about the answer. As a martial adept, some maneuvers require a certain number of same-school maneuvers to be learned. As you gain levels you are allowed to replace older maneuvers with newer ones. This leads to an issue.

If I am learn a maneuvers that requires two maneuvers of the same school to be learned, and I learn it, that's not an issue. But, if I replace one of those older maneuvers at a later level, do I sacrifice the newer maneuver as well? Am I considered as having learned the newer maneuver, so I don't need to meet the requirements to learn it anymore or do I always need to meet those requirement to keep it?

[Aegis013]

I believe you still know the required number, so you keep it. I believe that's RAW. If you're unsure though, ask your DM.

[Crake]

I believe you still know the required number, so you keep it. I believe that's RAW. If you're unsure though, ask your DM.

p44 of tome of battle specifies that the maneuvers must be other maneuvers in the same school, so a maneuver cant be used to qualify for itself.

the exact quote


Maneuvers Known: Some of the more powerful maneuvers require you to learn one or more other maneuvers in the same discipline before they can be selected.

I'm sure some people will argue against that ruling, but :smallsigh: thats the way of this forum

[Darrin]

But, if I replace one of those older maneuvers at a later level, do I sacrifice the newer maneuver as well? Am I considered as having learned the newer maneuver, so I don't need to meet the requirements to learn it anymore or do I always need to meet those requirement to keep it?

This is addressed in the Tome of Battle Q&A (http://community.wizards.com/forum/previous-editions-general/threads/1125111). More specifically:



Q: All of the new base classes from Tome of Battle offer the option of swapping out an old maneuver to gain a new maneuver at certain levels. What happens if, as a result of swapping out an old maneuver, I can no longer meet the pre-requisites for another stance or maneuver that I currently know? Suppose, for instance, that I currently only have the following 2 maneuvers/stances from the Iron Heart discipline: A) Absolute Steel, and B) Disarming Strike. Absolute Steel is a stance that has one Iron Heart maneuver as a pre-requisite. Disarming Strike currently fulfills that pre-requisite for me. Suppose I reach 4th level and decide to swap out Disarming Strike for another maneuver from a different discipline. I no longer meet the pre-requisites for the Absolute Steel stance. Am I still allowed to use the Absolute Steel stance? What if Absolute Steel were a maneuver instead of a stance; would I be allowed to use it?
A: Going with a strict interpretation of the rules, you would only need to have the appropriate number of maneuvers to meet a prerequisite when you needed to learn the maneuver, not if you wanted to use that maneuver later. So the character in question would still be able to use the Absolute Steel stance even though you have given up your only Iron Heart maneuver. So again, you only have to meet the prerequisites when you learn the maneuver or stance, not when you want to use ready or use it. I hope that clears things up.


This answer came from Customer Service, so make of that what you will. But I believe that's how most people have been playing it since 2006.