Players Basic Rules v0.2 and GM Basic Rules v0.1 Update

[Thomar_of_Uointer]

So this came out just now. http://dnd.wizards.com/articles/features/basicrules

Looks like they've added a bunch of the PHB spells. The GM packet has lots of monsters and a few magic items.

Thoughts? I'm happy there's a cantrip for every damage type now. Dinosaurs look fun. I guess people can't complain about druid wild shape not having high-CR beasts now.

[1337 b4k4]

Some interesting things of note:

The XP chart has been toned down for the harder encounters. (Deadly is 100XP per level 1 charcter, vs 150 in the LL article)
The math for "groups of enemies" has been adjusted to make groups count as much more dangerous much faster. (Breakpoints at 2, 3, 7, 11 and 15, assuming a party of 3-5 characters)
The adventuring day is expected to be "six to eight medium or hard encounters"

[Edge of Dreams]

Where is this GM packet with magic items? I don't see anything about that on that page or in that pdf.

[Thomar_of_Uointer]

Where is this GM packet with magic items? I don't see anything about that on that page or in that pdf.

Page 59 of the Dungeon Master's D&D Basic Rules PDF.

[Edge of Dreams]

Page 59 of the Dungeon Master's D&D Basic Rules PDF.

D'oh. I didn't see the phrase "Dungeon Master's" there. I just skimmed it and saw "V2" and "V1" and thought they were keeping the older version of the Basic Rules up for posterity.

[Yorrin]

D'oh. I didn't see the phrase "Dungeon Master's" there. I just skimmed it and saw "V2" and "V1" and thought they were keeping the older version of the Basic Rules up for posterity.

I did the exact same thing until I read this thread :smallbiggrin:

[TrexPushups]

I am so excited for the Tyrannosaurus Rex Stats! I love the hungry little guys :smallbiggrin:

[CyberThread]

0.2 it seems the big thing was the factions included for the living playthrough of dragons.

[Envyus]

0.2 it seems the big thing was the factions included for the living playthrough of dragons.

Did you miss the Dm guide on the same page.

[CyberThread]

? Factions were in the DM?

[Envyus]

? Factions were in the DM?

No just saying it's not the big thing.

[CyberThread]

garrotfox <_<

[Thomar_of_Uointer]

? Factions were in the DM?

Factions are in an appendix in the Player's Guide. Bunch of FR stuff. Harpers (bards and spies), Order of the Gauntlet (paladins and like-minded heroes), Emerald Enclave (tree-huggers), the Lords' Alliance (monster slayers), and the Zhentarim (merchants/mages guild).

[Titanium Dragon]

Monsters have a lot of hit points. Makes save or die and save or suck effects a lot more powerful, and damage a lot less powerful. Sleep is a lot worse than I thought it was, but save or die and save or suck things are even better because things have quite a few hit points. This seems like it will be extremely bad news for damage dealers, especially single target damage dealers; ogres are CR 2 and worth 450 xp each, and have 59 hit points. For a level 2 party of 4, 1 ogre is a medium encounter. For a level 5 party, ostensibly, 3 ogres would be just below a "hard" encounter, and 5 would be a "deadly" encounter.

Something feels terribly off about how many HP some bad guys have; orcs have 15 hp and are 1/2 and 100 xp, while Thugs have 32 hp and are 1/2 and worth 100 xp. That seems really wrong, seeing as the thugs actually deal rather more damage, and more reliably at that. Sure, they have slightly lower AC (11 vs 13) but having more than twice as many hp seems like that more than makes up for it. And yet mages, which are CR 6, have only 40 hit points; they are likely to have vastly higher AC, but... I dunno. It feels weird.

[Lokiare]

So we get 2 new spells and a bunch of monsters and encounter design guidelines?

[Fable Wright]

Something feels terribly off about how many HP some bad guys have; orcs have 15 hp and are 1/2 and 100 xp, while Thugs have 32 hp and are 1/2 and worth 100 xp. That seems really wrong, seeing as the thugs actually deal rather more damage, and more reliably at that. Sure, they have slightly lower AC (11 vs 13) but having more than twice as many hp seems like that more than makes up for it. And yet mages, which are CR 6, have only 40 hit points; they are likely to have vastly higher AC, but... I dunno. It feels weird.
Hit point counts tend to be inversely related to DPR and special abilities, except in the cases of Legendary monsters. Comparing the Thug to the Orc, the Thug deals more damage if it has allies for Advantage, while the Orc flat-out deals more damage at range and more damage per hit than the Thug. And remember, if the Thug does have support, its CR goes up. However, the Orc has something special: ridiculous speed. It can close 60ft and make an attack for 9-10 damage in one turn. In simpler terms, they essentially get a free round on the party, as they can close before the party's melee. Plus, in close combat, they can engage squishy party members on a moment's notice, which can be devastating when they end/prevent Concentration effects from occurring. In 4e terms, Thugs are Defenders, while Orcs are Strikers, hence the HP disparity.

The Mage, on the other hand, was designed to be squishy because his juicy spell slots both ensure survivability and deal high damage. A Greater Invisible Flying wizard avoids a lot of damage, and Shield+Mage Armor raises AC to 20 in a pinch. The Mage also deals high AoE damage between Cone of Cold, Fireball, and Ice Storm. Sure, if you can get him by surprise, he's not much of a threat, but with ten seconds' forewarning, he's terrifying.

[Fwiffo86]

HPs do appear high. I'm fine with this.

I now understand why sleep has no save throw. The HP affected are rolled out, so at base the average HP total is what? 18-22? As even if you drop it on a group, you are likely to only get a couple of them. Seems to work out just fine for me.

[Malifice]

So we get 2 new spells and a bunch of monsters and encounter design guidelines?

Yes. For free.

How is this a bad thing?

[Millennium]

Yes. For free.

How is this a bad thing?

Because it's not Balanced (tm). I'd have liked a better-rounded spell list myself, but seeing as this is only version 0.2, I'm not prepared to complain much just yet.