[3.5] The Psycarnadin: Smite all day

[Irk]

One of the most well-known tricks from Magic of Incarnum is the Psycarnum Infusion on Midnight Metamagic, Azure Talent, or any other similar Incarnum feat. The trick was discovered by DisposableHero_ on the Wizards site, and is detailed here (http://brilliantgameologists.com/boards/index.php?PHPSESSID=6kdm43oiegvpubg22aav80upu6&topic=6349.0). The format of this is a little bit inspired by Tempest_Stormwind's group (big fan of there stuff), but I've been thinking about putting this out here for a while now.

I want to examine the interaction between Psycarnum Infusion and Sapphire Smite. The trouble with the smite ability is that it is only available a certain number of times per day, so it is not really all that usable. Sapphire Smite allows us to boost the damage [marginally], but more importantly, grants us an extra smite attack per point of essentia invested. Couple that with Improved Essentia Capacity, Psycarnum Infusion, and Psionic Mediation, and the Paladin's smite suddenly becomes pretty pretty viable as a regular combat tool. However, if we toss in Awesome Smite and Improved, Trip, we're suddenly making two smite attack per turn on top of a trip. Putting it all together:

Assuming 28 point buy go 10/10/16/18/14/8

Azurin Paladin 6/Psychic Warrior 3
Flaws: Shaky, City Slicker

Trip-Smite technique is already online, and you can begin maxing out CON and WIS for concentration and attack bonus. You have +1 damage and an extra smite attack, so it's more of a finishing move, but is fairly decent.

Well, Smite recharge is now here, though it takes a full-round action to do so. Concentration should be 5+3+2 (tool) for +10, so You're only making it 50% of the time, but I never really understood how people expected to get Psionic Focus online so early anyway, so this should be fine.
As our first power, I'm going to go with Expansion for the bonus on trip attacks

You are now fairly WIS-SAD, getting it to saves and Damage. Not much else to report.

Well, we can now activate the Smite-Recharge in combat. It is also worth noting that since the bonus on smite damage is untyped, every time we activate a Psyphire Smite (I'll work on the name Saphcarnum? Psysmite?), the damage on a smite increases by 1. So first smite is +1, second is +2, so on.
I suppose I would suggest Force Screen for the shield bonus, but really anything would be fine.
Not much to report, Concentration up to +16 with a +5 item, so that's more reliable. Weapon should be aiming towards collision or Manifester, I think. Oh, and YAY, Divine Health.
Smite recharge is doubly effective now! Maybe grab Offensive Precognition for Power Attack, but again, not much to report, though the main combo piece is VERY close.
If you were a Mystic Fire Knight, now would provide you with a Bonus Spell and Improved Spellcasting, instead of turn undead, which isn't that great unless you go for Divine Soultouch.
Another Smite attack, not that we care.
Aw yeah. Now, every turn is a Smite, Trip with Expansion (Augmented), then another smite before recharging as a move action with a +20, so no chance of failure. Damage increases every turn, and since the only piece of equipment thus far has been a 2500 GP skill item, you've got plenty of cash. Let' see where this goes.

Level 9 saves of +11/+6/+10, BaB of +8, average HP of 73, and some pretty strong Trip-Smite synergy. Maybe a +1 Collision Scythe would be appropriate, on a smite dealing 2d4+12 before Power Attack + Offensive Precognition. Also grab a +4 STR item, if possible, that'll add 3 damage and increase to-hit. Alternatively, you could try to sneak in intuitive attack to increase SADness. Every turn you can do a Smite-Trip-Smite combo, recharge then move and do it again the next turn, and recharge on the turn after, thanks to getting 2 smites/recharge. I think it's a pretty solid Paladin based around a combination I've never really seen. A ring of Sapphire Nightmare blade would really top of the build, considering the Possibility for a power attack of -10, dealing 2d4+1d6+32 * 2 as well as a trip. That way we have a Psycarnum Sapphire Sapphire Infusion Nightmare Smite Blade attack. Take it Five-Shadow Creeping Ice Enervating Strike!

It's not that best one could do in 9 levels, but I think it falls within acceptable PO, and still has access to standard Paladin ACFs like Mystic Fire Knight for better spellcasting, which could really help out. The core mechanic is the rechargable smite machine with Psionic Meditation + Psycarnum Infusion + Sapphire Smite, Sapphire Nightmare Blade + Awesome Smite + Power Attack being a sort of add-on.

As Fax points out, there are numerous ways to broaden your smiting opportunities, such as Elemental Smite for elemental damage against anyone, Knight of the Raven for undead, Topaz Guardian for aberrations, and Vigilante for anyone who commits a crime. Think about that last one. A Cleric with the destruction Domain could be another option.
Keld brings up Smite Infidel for those not in your religion, the smiting enhancement in MIC for even MORE smiting uses, and the Charging Smite ACF from the PHB II, which could make this into a decent ubercharger with Rhino's Rush.
Kuul also suggests Shadowbane Inquisitor's Smite, which lets you smite anyone that you determine to be corrupt, so that's also pretty great.

Thoughts?

[Vaz]

You need Int 13 to pick up Combat Expertise, and Improved Trip.

[Fax Celestis]

I'm thinking you should pick up some alternative forms of smite for liberal applications to the upsides of various kinds of enemies.

Elemental Smite from Magic of Eberron would give you an elemental kick that doesn't care about your target's alignment.

Knight of the Raven would give you Smite Undead.

Topaz Guardian is made for paladins and would give you Smite Aberration.

My favorite, Vigilante has Smite the Guilty, which means if you see someone commit a crime you can smite them. You know what's generally criminal? Assault and battery, highway robbery, and terrorism, things that BBEGs and their minions are fairly wont to do. And hey, look, with an acorn of far travel, you can do it anywhere.

[Irk]

You need Int 13 to pick up Combat Expertise, and Improved Trip.
I really, really hate myself. I do this always when showcasing builds but never in actual play. Thanks.

I'm thinking you should pick up some alternative forms of smite for liberal applications to the upsides of various kinds of enemies.
Good idea, the absic idea is the smite recharge, but this is true if it s to be an effective tactic.


Elemental Smite from Magic of Eberron would give you an elemental kick that doesn't care about your target's alignment.
True, I don't fight many elementals, but as a DM I am partial to them.

Knight of the Raven would give you Smite Undead.
Pretty good, I think most monsters in the MM are undead, so that's a plus.

Topaz Guardian is made for paladins and would give you Smite Aberration.
Yes, and also another one of my favorites as a DM.

My favorite, Vigilante has Smite the Guilty, which means if you see someone commit a crime you can smite them. You know what's generally criminal? Assault and battery, highway robbery, and terrorism, things that BBEGs and their minions are fairly wont to do. And hey, look, with an acorn of far travel, you can do it anywhere.
This one is actually quite good!

I know that there is a general smite ability somewhere other than the Destruction domain, though...
Destruction Domain could work pretty well, though. Awesome Smite + Improved Trip comes online later, but you have cleric spells to make up for it.

[Fax Celestis]

Nono. Elemental Smite works on anyone, it just adds elemental damage.

[Irk]

Nono. Elemental Smite works on anyone, it just adds elemental damage.
Aha, it's that trademark Irkidiocy.

You do need an elemental graft, though, and I don't think it's as strong, but at least it works against everyone.

[MilesTiden]

Wait, would Sapphire Smite apply to all available smites, or just one specific type? The wording's kinda weird.

[Irk]

Wait, would Sapphire Smite apply to all available smites, or just one specific type? The wording's kinda weird.
It can apply to any type, but only one at a time.

[malonkey1]

Wait, would Sapphire Smite apply to all available smites, or just one specific type? The wording's kinda weird.

As I understand, it applies to all. To be honest, regardless of RAI, in 3.5, Smite isn't that great without serious pumping, so having two different weaker smites that each get a bonus use isn't exactly potent.

[Troacctid]

I'm pretty sure the extra smites don't stack, for the same reason Eagle's Splendor can't give you more than two extra turnings per day.

[Keld Denar]

I forget the class, but you can get Smite Infidel, which is basically everyone but people in your religion, which you probably won't be smiting anyway.

There is a smiting enhancement in the MIC that gives you an extra smite per day, and don't forget the Charging Smite ACF in PHBII that gives you extra damage on a charge AND doesn't consume your attempt if you miss.

[Kuulvheysoon]

Shadowbane Inquisitor gets a general Smite ability that's usable on anyone you deem corrupt.
Unlike with a paladin's smite evil ability, an inquisitor relies only on his own judgment when determining what creatures to use this ability against. How an inquisitor uses this ability exemplifies his outlook on the world. The more suspicious and uncompromising an inquisitor is, the more likely he is to feel that a creature should be struck down.

[Irk]

I forget the class, but you can get Smite Infidel, which is basically everyone but people in your religion, which you probably won't be smiting anyway.

There is a smiting enhancement in the MIC that gives you an extra smite per day, and don't forget the Charging Smite ACF in PHBII that gives you extra damage on a charge AND doesn't consume your attempt if you miss.


Shadowbane Inquisitor gets a general Smite ability that's usable on anyone you deem corrupt.
Added, thanks for finding these!

[Fax Celestis]

I'm pretty sure the extra smites don't stack, for the same reason Eagle's Splendor can't give you more than two extra turnings per day.

That's not how the feat works.

[Chronos]

I once put together a build which used Sapphire Smite with ten different kinds of smiting. It didn't recharge, but still got five or more of each sort of smite per day. Pile them all onto a single attack, and you've got one heck of an alpha strike.

Admittedly, it was a gestalt build, so you probably couldn't fit quite that much on a normal character. You could probably still get enough to make it work, though.

I think my favorite thing about the character was that it actually made use of both Samurai and Soulborn.

[Troacctid]

That's not how the feat works.

That's how I'm reading it. When Psycarnum Infusion wears off, you no longer have the additional smites per day from the feat, leaving you with (e.g.) 2/1 smites used today. Psycarnum Infusion to fill it up again and you're at 2/2 smites used today, still maxed out. Is there some reason it wouldn't work this way?

[Fax Celestis]

That's how I'm reading it. When Psycarnum Infusion wears off, you no longer have the additional smites per day from the feat, leaving you with (e.g.) 2/1 smites used today. Psycarnum Infusion to fill it up again and you're at 2/2 smites used today, still maxed out.

Right, except you're increasing your essentia capacity each time you activate it, which ends up with a linearly increasing smite pool.

[Troacctid]

Right, except you're increasing your essentia capacity each time you activate it, which ends up with a linearly increasing smite pool.

Psycarnum Infusion doesn't increase the feat's essentia capacity, it only fills it to its current maximum. Then it goes down to zero again when it wears off.

[Vaz]

There's no rules for it going into negatives, like there are with hitpoints.

[Irk]

I once put together a build which used Sapphire Smite with ten different kinds of smiting. It didn't recharge, but still got five or more of each sort of smite per day. Pile them all onto a single attack, and you've got one heck of an alpha strike.

Admittedly, it was a gestalt build, so you probably couldn't fit quite that much on a normal character. You could probably still get enough to make it work, though.

I think my favorite thing about the character was that it actually made use of both Samurai and Soulborn.

Actually, this give me a really good idea for another build. If I credit you with the original idea, would you mind if I worked on a build to post here a little later? There are several builds I'd like to post in the next few weeks, something that sort of replicates the damage output of Ruby Nightmare Blade, but with Smite Attacks, an all-core build called the Shadow-Bard (inspired by the idea of creating a functional all-core build that doesn't directly fall under the caster role like the horizon tripper), and some sort of build that can go into a "Siege-Tank" mode where by not moving it receives improved firepower.

Anyway, I would be grateful if you'd let me adapt your idea!

EDIT: I was looking at it and I managed to get it up to 210 damage with Smite and regular Power Attack, is that worth showcasing a 20th level build around or should I try to pump it higher? For clarification, it's a single full-round action swing.
2nd EDIT: With Improved Trip + Awesome Smite, I got it up to 288.
3rd EDIT: +1 Collision Weapon brings it up to 300. With a single full-round action Smiteswing, I got it to deal exactly 300 damage + weapon dice, so it's a reliable damage output, and done at full BaB, Power Attack uses the bonuses from smite. Next 1-2 rounds are recharge, though. Actually, in 1 round of recharging, you can make an attack at 280, two rounds grants the full 300. The problem is that 20 of the damage comes from Elemental Smite, which is not the most reliable due to immunities at higher levels.

[Chronos]

Sure, go ahead, do you want a list of the sources of smite I used?

[Irk]

Sure, go ahead, do you want a list of the sources of smite I used?
Yeah, that'd be great! Thanks!

[Chronos]

OK, here's a mock table (since I haven't figured out the new table code yet):

Source | +Atk | Damage bonus | Valid against
Killoren | Cha | HD | Aberrations, Constructs, Humanoids, Oozes, Outsiders, Undead
Half-celestial | - | HD | Evil
Destruction domain | 4 | Cleric level | Any
Initiate of Bahamut | Cha | Cleric level | Evil
Ordained Champion | Cha | Turning level |Any
Samurai | Cha | Cha | Any
Shadowbane Inquisitor | Cha | Class level |"Corrupt" (effectively any)
Soulborn | Cha | Class level |Opposition (chaos or evil)
Tattooed Monk | 4 | Class level |Any
Crusader | Cha | Class level |Any
I specifically avoided doubling up on anything that worked exactly the same way, on assumption that those would work from the same pool: Thus the lack of paladin (it'd be the same pool as Initiate of Bahamut, and cleric levels worked better than paladin levels). You might want to skip the crusader and half-celestial, because they cost a lot of levels, but the rest are pretty dippable.

[T.G. Oskar]

I recall an example somewhere that deals with how temporary enhancements to uses didn't allow for this kind of recharge. Don't take me at face value, but it had to deal with Paladin class features: either Lay on Hands or Turn Undead. Something about the Lay on Hands pool not recharging when enhanced temporarily or uses of Turn Undead not regenerating if you had a temporary increase like when using Eagle's Splendor, or when a magic item was destroyed or removed (I'm a bit more certain of that last one, since it also overlaps with Charisma damage/drain). It'd be good to check this out.

I'd definitely recommend, if the trick works, to follow up with Fist of Raziel. It would imply delaying one feat (most likely Imp. Essentia Capacity), but the boosts to Smite are pretty strong: 2d6 holy damage that becomes 2d8 against fiends and evil outsiders, automatic crit confirmation (which, if you happen to hunt for crits, it's formidable as it further boosts your smite effectiveness) and eventually a mild AoE damage effect. Combine that with regenerating smites (that deal additional damage) and you can spend your entire turn dealing damage to multiple evil creatures just by smiting the strongest one with Chain Smite. Plus the Holy Doritos Strike (TM).

I have a "Optimization Showcase"-style build that doesn't rely on regenerating smites, but on having as many smites as possible during the day and how to improve smites to make them actually useful. It actually uses Sapphire Smite as one of its early feats for extra smites (and most importantly, smite damage) coupled with Charging Smite to improve damage (and ignore the mount), Awesome Smite, Strength of Conviction and a few others, and using a 2-handed weapon for maximum effectiveness.

[Irk]

OK, here's a mock table (since I haven't figured out the new table code yet):
...
I specifically avoided doubling up on anything that worked exactly the same way, on assumption that those would work from the same pool: Thus the lack of paladin (it'd be the same pool as Initiate of Bahamut, and cleric levels worked better than paladin levels).
Awesome, thanks! I did not realize that Paladin and Cleric might stack, so that's 10 damage lost. Hopefully I can just recuperate it with something from your list though!