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Cidius
2014-08-17, 10:52 AM
I created a Iron Chef class, but i dont know if its overpowered or underpowered, what wrong with it. Could someone please review it and tell me of any problems it might have, thank you.

Iron Chef


HD = D8

Requirements:
+8 Craft (Cooking)
+6 Knowledge (Culinary)
+8 Profession (Cook)
+2 Survival

Weapon Prof:
None

Armor Prof:
Light Armor Only
Wok*1
Pot Lid*1

1- The wok can be used as a weapon, shield or piece of armor depending on its use. If hand in a hand it can be swung like a weapon, or used as a shield. It can also be attached to the body by straps or rope making it a piece of armor. The wok adds a +1 or +2 to all armor checks depending on its size.

2- The pot lid can be held by its lid as a shield in combat, giving the player a +1 or +2 to armor checks depending on its size.

Class Skills:
Appraise
Balance
Climb
Concentration
Craft (Cooking)
Craft (Brewing)
Diplomacy
Gather Information
Handel Animal
Knowledge (Culinary)
Listen
Profession (Cook)
Search
Slight of Hand
Spot
Survival
Swim
Tumble



Level
Base Atk Bonus
Fort Save
Ref Save
Will Save
Special


1
+0
+2
+2
+0
Novice Ambrosia, Aggressive Cook, Culinary Kung-Fu


2
+1
+3
+3
+0
Detect Poison


3
+2
+3
+3
+1
Preservatives, Only the Best


4
+3
+4
+4
+1
Improved Ambrosia, Endure Energy (Heat)


5
+3
+4
+4
+1
Oven Hands


6
+4
+5
+5
+2
Cooking Master


7
+5
+5
+5
+2
Greater Ambrosia, Keep it Fresh


8
+6/+1
+6
+6
+3
Poison Resistance


9
+6/+1
+6
+6
+3
Resist Energy (Fire)


10
+7/+2
+7
+7
+3
Master Ambrosia, Master Chef, Oven Breath




Ambrosia: Starting at first, forth, seventh, and tenth level the Iron Chef may imbue his food with spell like effects. Provided he has purchased the ingredients, and spent adequate time cooking the meal, with a Craft (Cooking) check (DC 5, 10, 15, and 20 respectively). For all intents and purposes, treat each single serving as a potion of the same spell except that the meal is an alchemical creation, and is not really magical in nature. Each meal uses up a greater amount of GP then the average potion because each meal uses up GP instead of XP to create or rather buy the ingredients. Each Meal has a noted cost next to it which indicates the cost of the extra or extravagant ingredients used in its creation. The Iron Cook may make as many servings of a meal as there are ingredients to create it plus the time it takes to cook. Depending on the DM, the player may either infuse the spell like effect into his food on creation with the ingredients being of no consequence other then cost and weight, or for a deeper role-play experience may be made to buy specific ingredients. A list for all spells in each level of Iron Chef are found detailed below.

Aggressive Cook: At first level a Iron Chef may force feed his foes with his food by either a touch or throw attack, provided the enemy is facing the player, the mouth is unobstructed, and open. This may also be done to friends, and ignores any Will or defense check. Foes with food in their mouth must make a Will save (DC 10 + Half character level + Wisdom modifier) against your characters (Base Attack Bonus + Craft (Cooking) skill + Iron Chef Level) to spit it out, otherwise they are to drawn in by the great taste and eat it.

Culinary Kung-Fu: An Iron Chef is instantly proficient with any and all improvised kitchen implements, suffering no -4 penalty when using them. Additionally, when dual-wielding kitchen implements, the Adventure Chef may perform a Flurry of Blows as a Monk of the same level. This ability may stack with a monk starter class, and all cookware may be considered special monk weapons when cross classing. See pages 40 of the players handbook and 159 in the Complete Warrior for more information.

Detect Poison: At second level an Iron Chef can use his accumulated knowledge of what is and isn’t to be eaten both in the wild and in the kitchen to detect poisons. You can determine whether a creature, object, or area has been poisoned or is poisonous. You can determine the exact type of poison with a DC 20 Wisdom check. A character with the Craft (alchemy) skill may try a DC 20 Craft (alchemy) check if the Wisdom check fails, or may try the Craft (alchemy) check prior to the Wisdom check.

Endure Energy (Heat): Thanks to your many hours spent over a fire, hot stove, in the kitchen, you have become more resistant to the effects of heat. As if protected by “Endure Elements” the Iron Chef suffers no harm or damage from being in a hot environment. He can exist comfortably in heats up to 140 degrees Fahrenheit without having to make Fortitude saves (as described in the Dungeon Masters Guide). The players equipment is likewise protected.

Preservatives: Using your expert knowledge of food, an Iron Chef can mimic the effects of an “Unguent of Timelessness” on any article of mundane food via various salt-packing and smoking methods, as well as sealed containers.

“Unguent of Timelessness: When applied to any matter that was once alive this ointment allows that substance to resist the passage of time. Each year of actual time affects the substance as if only a day had passed. The coated object gains a +1 resistance bonus on all saving throws. The unguent never wears off, although it can be magically removed (by dispelling the effect, for instance).”

Oven Hands: Once per turn as a move action an Iron Chef may perform a touch attack, 1D4 burn damage per character level on a single enemy. Alternatively this ability can be used to keep a hot meal hot when serving, or warm a cold meal.

Cooking Master: The Iron Chef adds his Iron Chef class level as a competence bonus to Craft (Cooking), Knowledge (Culinary), and Profession (Cook) checks.

Keep it Fresh: At seventh level the Iron Chef learns how to mimic the effect of “Permanent Emanation” using ice. However, this emanation may only be cast on the inside of a box or room of a maximum of 1700 cube feet (a typical room). Destroying part of the box or a wall of the room destroys the effect.

“Permanent Emanation: Designate any one of your spells whose area is an emanation from you, such as detect magic. This spell effect is permanent (though you can dismiss or restart it as a free action). Effects that would normally dispel you spell instead suppress it for 2d4 rounds.”

Poison Resistance: The Time you have spent tasting horrible, undercooked, overcooked, and all round inedible foods have made an impact on your body. You receive a +4 bonus to all Fortitude saves against poison.

Resist Energy (Fire): At ninth level the Iron Cook gains damage reduction towards the element of fire, reducing damage from any fire based attack or trap by 10 for each level in Iron Cook he is.

Master Chef: At tenth level the Iron Chef begins to get employment offers from everyone from tavern owners to barons. So long as he has access to the tools of his trade, a holistic chef multiplies the gold piece payment earned with a Profession (chef) check by 1d4 + class level.

Oven Breath: At tenth level the Iron Chef gains a breath weapon that deals 1D6 points of fire damage per character level in a cone that's stretches for fifteen feet in front of him. A Reflex save (DC 10 + half character level + Reflex modifier) for half damage is permitted. Using Oven Breath is a standard action, and may only be done once every 2 rounds.


Note that for stuff like cure light wounds it will always remain a 1D8+1 with no addition due to Iron Cook level.

(Spell Level x Caster Level which is 3 above the spell level x 25) + 1/25 of the base price in XP (or base price in XP x 5gp rounded down)

(1 x 4 x 25gp) = 100gp divided by 1/25 x 5 = 120gp
(2 x 5 x 25gp) = 250gp divided by 1/25 x 5 = 300gp
(3 x 6 x 25gp) = 450gp divided by 1/25 x 5 = 540gp
(4 x 7 x 25gp) = 700gp divided by 1/25 x 5 = 840gp
(5 x 8 x 25gp) = 1000gp divided by 1/25 x 5 = 1200gp

Novice Ambrosia List
Cure Light Wounds = 120gp
Inflict Light Wounds = 120gp
Delay Poison = 300gp
Charm Animal = 120gp
Sleep = 120gp
Barkskin = 300gp
Lesser Resistance (+1 on saves) = 120gp
Bear’s Lesser Endurance (+2 Con) = 300gp
Bull’s Lesser Strength (+2 Str) = 300gp
Cat’s Lesser Grace (+2 Dex) = 300gp
Eagle’s Lesser Splendor (+2 Cha) = 300gp
Fox’s Lesser Cunning (+2 Int) = 300gp
Owl’s Lesser Wisdom (+2 Wis) = 300gp

Improved Ambrosia List
Cure Moderate Wounds = 300gp
Inflict Moderate Wounds = 300gp
Poison = 540gp
Charm Person = 300gp
Lesser Restoration = 300gp
Moderate Resistance (+2 on saves) = 300gp
Bear’s Moderate Endurance (+4 Con) = 540gp
Bull’s Moderate Strength (+4 Str) = 540gp
Cat’s Moderate Grace (+4 Dex) = 540gp
Eagle’s Moderate Splendor (+4 Cha) = 540gp
Fox’s Moderate Cunning (+4 Int) = 540gp
Owl’s Moderate Wisdom (+4 Wis) = 540gp

Greater Ambrosia List
Cure Serious Wounds = 540gp
Inflict Serious Wounds = 540gp
Neutralize Poison = 840gp
Charm Monster = 540gp
Restoration = 840gp
Deep Slumber = 540gp
Improved Resistance (+3 on saves) = 540gp
Bear’s Improved Endurance (+6 Con) = 840gp
Bull’s Improved Strength (+6 Str) = 840gp
Cat’s Improved Grace (+6 Dex) = 840gp
Eagle’s Improved Splendor (+6 Cha) = 840gp
Fox’s Improved Cunning (+6 Int) = 840gp
Owl’s Improved Wisdom (+6 Wis) = 840gp

Master Ambrosia List
Cure Critical Wounds = 840gp
Inflict Critical Wounds = 840gp
Greater Restoration = 1200gp
Greater Resistance (+4 on saves) = 840gp
Bear’s Greater Endurance (+8 Con) = 1200gp
Bull’s Greater Strength (+8 Str) = 1200gp
Cat’s Greater Grace (+8 Dex) = 1200gp
Eagle’s Greater Splendor (+8 Cha) = 1200gp
Fox’s Greater Cunning (+8 Int) = 1200gp
Owl’s Greater Wisdom (+8 Wis) = 1200gp

Stiq
2014-08-17, 05:22 PM
I'd like to preface this post by saying that I'm about to get into some /very/ in depth criticism. If I seem hostile or overly critical, it's only because I feel you deserve my complete honesty. I enjoyed reading it and I'd actually really like to see any future iterations of the class you do.

As for business, first and foremost: this class has a LOT of moving parts. With that kind of power, probably the best thing to do is to give it to a person who enjoys character optimization and tell them to try and break it. That and general playtesting will give you some good feedback.

One thing to note in particular: any class that can achieve that many spellcasting-type abilities would be a force to be reckoned with, to be sure. The Ambrosias are nothing to sneeze at, and it's worth keeping in mind that at the level you receive a new "tier" of ambrosias, the strongest effect among them is available. That may be an admirable power all on its own. Regarding the rest of its class features:


This class has few proficiencies, which makes sense for a prestige class, and has a lot of class skills, which don't really make sense for a prestige class.

The HD and the BAB seem fine, for what you're going for here.

You forgot to mention how many skill points it gets per level.

Class Skills:
Appraise
Balance
Climb
Concentration
Craft (Cooking)
Craft (Brewing)
Diplomacy
Gather Information
Handel Animal
Knowledge (Culinary)
Listen
Profession (Cook)
Search
Slight of Hand
Spot
Survival
Swim
Tumble

The italicized skills seem to be just kind of out of place to me. I feel like trying to make the Iron Chef an athlete on top of a craftsman and a savvy business-owner (if those social skills are any indication) is a bit too much.

The underlined skills are a different problem: both in class skills and in prerequisites, I think maybe you should consider rolling all of your cooking skills into one; having that many different skills for one profession seems odd unless you're running a really unorthodox game where people have tons of extra skill points to burn. I recommend Profession (Chef) as your signature skill here, personally.

Aggressive Cook: Ordinarily, I can see the use of this potentially for poisoning enemies but in most situations this is a novelty. In practice, however...


Foes with food in their mouth must make a Will save (DC 10 + Half character level + Wisdom modifier) against your characters (Base Attack Bonus + Craft (Cooking) skill + Iron Chef Level) to spit it out, otherwise they are to drawn in by the great taste and eat it.


1. You don't tell another character what their will save is. That's not what difficulty class (DC) means.

2. so let's assume a fifth level fighter/first level iron chef is using this ability (level 5 is the earliest you could have a skill at rank 8 in 3.5 rules).

Base attack bonus (5) plus craft (cooking) (8) plus your iron chef level (1) is a total of 14.

For an end-game effect, let's try a monk 10/iron chef 10. BAB +14, craft (cooking) probably 23, and iron chef level 10.

That's a DC 47 will save.

That's... hilariously high.

How about something like how Intimidate works? You make a ranged attack, first, and then roll Craft (Cooking), or maybe Profession (Chef), or whatever skill roll you're looking into against a DC of 10 + their Hit Dice + their Wisdom modifier?

To be frank, that's even assuming an ability this convoluted is really worth keeping.

Culinary Kung Fu: making the Iron Chef an accomplished warrior on top of the Ambrosias and other weird things just really seems like overkill... not that Flurry of Blows in 3.5 is actually very good, mind you.


Detect Poison: neat. I'm cool with that.

Preservatives: not particularly useful, but amusing.

Only The Best: as far as I can tell, this ability isn't actually described in your post.

Endure Energy (Heat): Somewhat awkwardly named, but again, it works in the context of this class' own wacky logic.

Oven Hands: Okay, it's important we talk about what "character level" means.

What you're proposing is the ability to deal xd4 points of damage, where X is the total number of levels the character has from /any/ class. This means that this ability is still powerful even if the character ceases to be an Iron Chef, for whatever reason.

It's also a move action, which is... strange. I don't see anything immediately exploitable about it, except that a spellcaster with levels in Iron Chef could cast a spell, take a five foot step, AND attack, all in one round, which is... situationally useful. I'm sure someone can break that better than I can.

Also it's a touch attack. Touch attacks are /good./

Recommendation: make it a standard action (can't use on every attack in a full attack), make it NOT a touch attack, and nerf the damage to only scale off of their iron chef level.

Either that, or nerf the damage, leave it as a touch attack, and make it usable a limited number of times per day, like maybe equal to their Wisdom bonus or something.

Cooking Master: On skills that actually come up often, this would be broken, but as it stands this is mostly just quirky.

Oh, except it synergizes with Aggressive Cook, meaning my earlier estimate of /47/ actually increases to /57/ because the Iron Chef is, in effect, adding his prestige class level /twice/. Oops.

Even with the fix I proposed earlier, this still means that the Iron Chef can get 23 ranks on their craft check, plus ten, plus the ability modifier, etc. etc.

Recommendation: make it a smaller bonus, like maybe +1 at level 4, +2 at level 7, and +3 at level 10. Or just ditch it. Or ditch Aggressive Cook. Or multiple of those. Or something, I don't know.

Keep It Fresh: I fail to see how turning an approximately 12 by 12 by 12 room (Yes, I calculated, and just so you know, a cubic foot is 1 x 1 x 1, meaning what you SAID would be a room that is 1700 on each side, which I suspect is not what you meant) into a refrigerator would allow spells emanating from a spellcaster to stay active indefinitely... or how that is at all practical, if the caster has to stay in the refrigerator. I get the feeling you were thinking of a different spell when you wrote this.

Poison Resistance: seems a teensy bit overkill, given he's already resistant to heat... and can detect poison... but okay. Works for me.

Resist Energy (Fire): Teeeechnically the term is "energy resistance" when it applies to fire, sonic, cold, electricity, or acid, whereas damage reduction is a resistance to all physical harm, but that's more of a nitpick.

90 fire resistance (and 100 next level) is pretty preposterous. May as well be immune to all heat forever at that point.

Recommendation: make it a flat 15 or 20. That way he resists a good amount of fire damage and laughs at ordinary fire but can't go swimming in the earth's core like it's a leisurely stroll.

Master Chef: a x11 to x14 gold multiplier seems a bit excessive to me, but a static x5 multiplier seems adequate. That's just a gut feeling to me, though. Worth mentioning that your buffs to their crafting/profession checks would enhance this even further than it already is, in practice.

Oven Breath: I could talk about this but I think I'd largely be repeating myself from the Oven Hands section so I'll keep this brief:

Scale damage off of Iron Chef level only, minimum recharge time 1d4 rounds (or make it a limited number of times per day, like maybe 3 + wis bonus), have a ball.

In conclusion:

Had fun reading over this class. It's extremely silly, but that's not necessarily a bad thing if that's what you and your group are going for.

It was rife with some balance problems, and even having corrected some of the more glaring problems, it's in need of some playtesting. In particular, Ambrosia might be the tipping point on whether or not the class is balanced. There's too many possible applications for me to say whether or not they're balanced, but they seem alright at a glance.

If I seemed overly critical, I would like to reassure you that I enjoyed reading this and it has some neat concepts.

C-. Revisions needed. Points for creativity. Probably want to have a rules lawyer look over the wordings and Ambrosias and get back to you. Maybe trying to be too many different things at once (a potion-making brawler with fire powers and a bunch of class skills and a stable gold income, among other things). Has potential.