brian c
2007-03-06, 08:35 PM
So, this is a belated connection to a post I made in the general RPG forum a few days ago. My idea is to combine the base melee classes (fighter, barbarian, monk, ranger, paladin) with the Tome of Battle classes in order to (crunch/mechanics/gameplay reason) make melee builds viable at higher levels, and (fluff/flavor/roleplay reason) because it doesn't make sense to have "martial maneuvers" not belong to the basic martial classes.
Here's what I want to do: get rid of the ToB classes, and instead make those subclasses of Core melee classes. When you create a character of that type, you can chose an appropriate "martial subclass", sort of similar to how a ranger can be TWF or ranged.
The choices are limited to make sense (and the ToB classes are nerfed, I'll explain later)
Fighter: any (Crusader, Warblade, Swordsage)
Monk: Crusader or Swordsage
Barbarian: Swordsage or Warblade
Paladin: must be Crusader
Ranger: Swordsage or Warblade
of the 5 base classes, 3 can choose Warblade, 3 can choose Crusader, 4 can choose Swordsage (which I think is the most versatile class).
Furthermore, the ToB classes are nerfed and the following changes are made:
Crusader: remove steely resolve, counterstrike
Swordsage: remove AC bonus, sense magic, evasion/improved evasion
Warblade: remove uncanny dodge/improved uncanny dodge, bonus feats?
Class abilities that overlap, I think I removed.
So this would be sorta like gestalt the way it works; each class would keep their core HD, skill points per level, base attack and saves, but they would add the abilities and class skills of their martial subclass. More importantly, they would add stances and maneuvers of their subclass per ToB.
So, what does anyone think? I think that from what I have now, the Crusader is left with too little, and the Warblade is too smart (Int-based), especially for a Barbarian. Also, I don't know if it might be overpowered for a fighter(warblade) to get so many bonus feats. Maybe if a fighter selects that he doesn't get them but any other class would, or just get rid of them all-together. I took out the Crusader abilities because I don't really like them; should they stay in for balance? Also not sure that the classes should add class skills from their subclass, maybe let them pick a few to be new class skills?
Here's what I want to do: get rid of the ToB classes, and instead make those subclasses of Core melee classes. When you create a character of that type, you can chose an appropriate "martial subclass", sort of similar to how a ranger can be TWF or ranged.
The choices are limited to make sense (and the ToB classes are nerfed, I'll explain later)
Fighter: any (Crusader, Warblade, Swordsage)
Monk: Crusader or Swordsage
Barbarian: Swordsage or Warblade
Paladin: must be Crusader
Ranger: Swordsage or Warblade
of the 5 base classes, 3 can choose Warblade, 3 can choose Crusader, 4 can choose Swordsage (which I think is the most versatile class).
Furthermore, the ToB classes are nerfed and the following changes are made:
Crusader: remove steely resolve, counterstrike
Swordsage: remove AC bonus, sense magic, evasion/improved evasion
Warblade: remove uncanny dodge/improved uncanny dodge, bonus feats?
Class abilities that overlap, I think I removed.
So this would be sorta like gestalt the way it works; each class would keep their core HD, skill points per level, base attack and saves, but they would add the abilities and class skills of their martial subclass. More importantly, they would add stances and maneuvers of their subclass per ToB.
So, what does anyone think? I think that from what I have now, the Crusader is left with too little, and the Warblade is too smart (Int-based), especially for a Barbarian. Also, I don't know if it might be overpowered for a fighter(warblade) to get so many bonus feats. Maybe if a fighter selects that he doesn't get them but any other class would, or just get rid of them all-together. I took out the Crusader abilities because I don't really like them; should they stay in for balance? Also not sure that the classes should add class skills from their subclass, maybe let them pick a few to be new class skills?