Kimimaro build?

[PraxisVetli]

So.
I got a guy who wants to be a 'Bone Mage.'
Basically, growing bone weapons, shooting bone spikes, some natural armour, casting unneccesary, but probably gonna come with the build, and he's ok with that.
Now, the most immediate (and really only) thought that comes to my mind, is Dragon Compendium's Osteomancer.
But as one of it's Iron Chef contestants, I gotta say, that class blows.
So I come to you Playground, how do I build Kimimaro?


sidenote, all 3.0/3.5 is on the table, Dragon Magazine is frowned upon, but possibly negotiable.

[Forrestfire]

Changeling Warshaper 1 + Abjurant Champion with Spell Thematics, maybe?

[Fax Celestis]

I'd go with a reflavored incarnate or totemist, myself.

[PraxisVetli]

I'd go with a reflavored incarnate or totemist, myself.

I'm torn between 'heck yeah, that sound perfect' and 'ugh, now I gotta go learn incarnum'

[Aliek]

The corrupt spell Lahm's Finger Darts from BoVD coupled with binding Naberius should help, too!

[Fax Celestis]

I'm torn between 'heck yeah, that sound perfect' and 'ugh, now I gotta go learn incarnum'

I'd say that it's not complicated, but I'd be a liar.

There should be a guide or a how-to around somewhere.

[PraxisVetli]

I'd say that it's not complicated, but I'd be a liar.

There should be a guide or a how-to around somewhere.

I'm sure.
I'm not against learning it, I just never really got around to it.
But if there isn't a Totemist Handbook out there somewhere, I'll eat my shoe!

[Averis Vol]

Sounds like bone knight is something he'd be interested in. You grow bone armor, get a skeletal mount. Pretty cool class overall. It can be entered with paladin or cleric, so suit to taste.

[PraxisVetli]

Sounds like bone knight is something he'd be interested in. You grow bone armor, get a skeletal mount. Pretty cool class overall. It can be entered with paladin or cleric, so suit to taste.

Can that synergize at all?

[Averis Vol]

Can that synergize at all?

Well, as always, the cleric will be stronger (Shocker, I know), but it gives a little bit of minionmancy to the paladin, as well as some undead immunities and a special set of weapon and armor. It also advances spell casting (9/10) and some evil clericish abilities while still maintaining a good alignment. So yea, I think it's a pretty synergistic class with either paladin or cleric.

EDIT: here's a link. bone knight (http://dndtools.eu/classes/bone-knight/)

[PraxisVetli]

Well, as always, the cleric will be stronger (Shocker, I know), but it gives a little bit of minionmancy to the paladin, as well as some undead immunities and a special set of weapon and armor. It also advances spell casting (9/10) and some evil clericish abilities while still maintaining a good alignment. So yea, I think it's a pretty synergistic class with either paladin or cleric.

EDIT: here's a link. bone knight (http://dndtools.eu/classes/bone-knight/)

Lol.
I totally meant synergize with Totemist.
My mistake, should've been specific.

[Averis Vol]

Lol.
I totally meant synergize with Totemist.
My mistake, should've been specific.

Oooooooooooooooooh. Sorry bud, I don't know jack about incarnum :smallfrown:

[Shoat]

No official class lets you do anything remotely similar (while bone knight sounds nice at first, it's fighting style and use of bones differs a lot thematically, why the hell would a Kimimaro-inspired character wear heavy armor, ride around on a mount or cast cleric spells?).
There's no way to do it without homebrew that won't feel awkward and unauthentic.


Since Kimimaro is a pure physical fighter reliant on dodging&parrying (he himself describes his fighting style as a dance), I think you could take the Spines of Fury (http://www.dandwiki.com/wiki/Tome_of_Fiends_%283.5e_Sourcebook%29/Spheres_and_Feats#Spines_of_Fury_.5BFiend.5D) feat from the Tome of Fiends or a modification of it with either a homebrew-fixed monk that specializes in use of this natural weapon, or find another unarmored melee class with many AC-bonuses.

[PraxisVetli]

Oooooooooooooooooh. Sorry bud, I don't know jack about incarnum :smallfrown:
Lol, no worries. It's like trying to learn a new game everytime I open that book. At least Psionics was similiar. Never fully got my head around Tome of Magic either. Binder always seemed like it was pure gibber.

No official class lets you do anything remotely similar (while bone knight sounds nice at first, it's fighting style and use of bones differs a lot thematically, why the hell would a Kimimaro-inspired character wear heavy armor, ride around on a mount or cast cleric spells?).
There's no way to do it without homebrew that won't feel awkward and unauthentic.


Since Kimimaro is a pure physical fighter reliant on dodging&parrying (he himself describes his fighting style as a dance), I think you could take the Spines of Fury (http://www.dandwiki.com/wiki/Tome_of_Fiends_%283.5e_Sourcebook%29/Spheres_and_Feats#Spines_of_Fury_.5BFiend.5D) feat from the Tome of Fiends or a modification of it with either a homebrew-fixed monk that specializes in use of this natural weapon, or find another unarmored melee class with many AC-bonuses.

I dunno man.. Totemist (from what little I know) seemed pretty good. Maybe with Warblade/Swordsage, whichever meshes better.

[Nousos]

To echo whats already been said, Totemist is the closest thing in the system that I can think of. That or maybe there's some combination of vestiges that would work.

You could just refluff a few of the soulmelds. The ones that grant natural attacks look like bone weapons instead of spectral chackra claws and such, manticore belt totem bind works perfect for launching bones, and a few different ones could be refluffed as a sort of bone armor.

If you have a DM willing to work with you, mantle of flame could deal piercing damage instead of flame damage whenever you are attacked in melee. This would be perfect for such a build.

Totem Rager is a prestige class in the book that grants lots of extra damage and continues most of totemists abilities, and since Kimimaru was a bit of a berserker, this could work well.

Edit- Bone knight always looked to me like a good way to do a necromancer style Clericzilla, but its pretty much just a different sort of whatever casting class you used to enter it.

[Flickerdart]

I'm torn between 'heck yeah, that sound perfect' and 'ugh, now I gotta go learn incarnum'
Incarnum is reasonably simple. There are basically three things you need to know.

Soulmeld: Sort of like class features that are also magic items. You can choose any from your list at level 1, up to the number you're allowed by the class. They have a basic benefit you can usually use at will.
Essentia: You get a handful of these points. You can invest them into soulmelds whenever you want to make them better. Think of it like augmenting a psionic power or upgrading a magic sword, except you can revoke the points and put them somewhere else with a swift action. Soulmelds have an essentia invested cap determined by your HD (1 point until level 6, 2 points until level 12, 3 points until level 18, 4 points thereafter).
Chakras: You gradually gain these as you level up in a meldshaping class. Solumelds can be bound to these chakras, at which point they gain extra abilities (as described in the soulmeld).

That's basically it!

In order to be bone-shooty-guy, your first stop should be two levels of Totemist.

Totemist level 1: You don't get that much here. Two soulmelds, no chakras, one point of essentia. Take an [Incarnum] feat for another point of essentia if you want to have more (and you always want to have more). Shape Ankheg Breastplate and put one of your essentia into it for +5 armor AC. Your other soulmeld can be Wormtail Belt; invest your other point of essentia for +3 natural AC. There's your bone armor - all the fighters are jealous!

Totemist level 2: Now we're talking! You unlock your Totem chakra here. Bind Manticore Belt instead of Wormtail Belt. You get +1 essentia capacity to any soulmeld bound to the Totem chakra, so put in two points of essentia here (if you didn't take the feat last level, it's cool - you get a second point this level). Now, as a standard action, you shoot 2 bone spikes up to 150 feet for 1d6+1/2STR damage.

At level 6 (regardless of whether or not you keep taking Totemist levels) your essentia cap goes up, so see if you can't pick up that [Incarnum] feat now for another point of essentia if you haven't been taking more Totemist levels. That way you get three spikes.

[PraxisVetli]

To echo whats already been said, Totemist is the closest thing in the system that I can think of. That or maybe there's some combination of vestiges that would work.

You could just refluff a few of the soulmelds. The ones that grant natural attacks look like bone weapons instead of spectral chackra claws and such, manticore belt totem bind works perfect for launching bones, and a few different ones could be refluffed as a sort of bone armor.

If you have a DM willing to work with you, mantle of flame could deal piercing damage instead of flame damage whenever you are attacked in melee. This would be perfect for such a build.

Totem Rager is a prestige class in the book that grants lots of extra damage and continues most of totemists abilities, and since Kimimaru was a bit of a berserker, this could work well.

Edit- Bone knight always looked to me like a good way to do a necromancer style Clericzilla, but its pretty much just a different sort of whatever casting class you used to enter it.
The DM is certainly willing to work with us, and I'll have to check out Totem Rager, thanks!

Incarnum is reasonably simple. There are basically three things you need to know.

Soulmeld: Sort of like class features that are also magic items. You can choose any from your list at level 1, up to the number you're allowed by the class. They have a basic benefit you can usually use at will.
Essentia: You get a handful of these points. You can invest them into soulmelds whenever you want to make them better. Think of it like augmenting a psionic power or upgrading a magic sword, except you can revoke the points and put them somewhere else with a swift action. Soulmelds have an essentia invested cap determined by your HD (1 point until level 6, 2 points until level 12, 3 points until level 18, 4 points thereafter).
Chakras: You gradually gain these as you level up in a meldshaping class. Solumelds can be bound to these chakras, at which point they gain extra abilities (as described in the soulmeld).

That's basically it!

In order to be bone-shooty-guy, your first stop should be two levels of Totemist.

Totemist level 1: You don't get that much here. Two soulmelds, no chakras, one point of essentia. Take an [Incarnum] feat for another point of essentia if you want to have more (and you always want to have more). Shape Ankheg Breastplate and put one of your essentia into it for +5 armor AC. Your other soulmeld can be Wormtail Belt; invest your other point of essentia for +3 natural AC. There's your bone armor - all the fighters are jealous!

Totemist level 2: Now we're talking! You unlock your Totem chakra here. Bind Manticore Belt instead of Wormtail Belt. You get +1 essentia capacity to any soulmeld bound to the Totem chakra, so put in two points of essentia here (if you didn't take the feat last level, it's cool - you get a second point this level). Now, as a standard action, you shoot 2 bone spikes up to 150 feet for 1d6+1/2STR damage.

At level 6 (regardless of whether or not you keep taking Totemist levels) your essentia cap goes up, so see if you can't pick up that [Incarnum] feat now for another point of essentia if you haven't been taking more Totemist levels. That way you get three spikes.
Cool beans!
That's about how I understood it to be, so glad to know I wasn't way off.
Can a...soulmeld?..and a magic item be in the same slot?

[Fax Celestis]

The DM is certainly willing to work with us, and I'll have to check out Totem Rager, thanks!

Cool beans!
That's about how I understood it to be, so glad to know I wasn't way off.
Can a...soulmeld?..and a magic item be in the same slot?

If you don't bind the soulmeld, yes.

There's two stages of soulmeld: shaping the meld, and binding it. You need the chakra open to bind it, and it takes the slot. There are feats to work around this.

[PraxisVetli]

If you don't bind the soulmeld, yes.

There's two stages of soulmeld: shaping the meld, and binding it. You need the chakra open to bind it, and it takes the slot. There are feats to work around this.

So they can be in the same slot, but can't use both at the same time?
Sorry, haven't gotten to read up on it yet, gonna do it tonight. Thank Tymora for today off!

[Fax Celestis]

If it's unbound, it just hovers there ephemerally.

If it's bound, you can't use the slot as it becomes physical.

[Red Fel]

If I may make a suggestion? Totemist/ PsyWar (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/psionic/classes/psychicWarrior.htm)/ Soul Manifester (http://archive.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/psm/20060217a).

Upsides: Full advancement of Totemist soulmelds and Psychic Warrior manifesting, which includes some pretty useful combat powers.

Downside: Totemist and PsyWar are 3/4 BAB classes; Soul Manifester is 1/2 BAB.

How would it play? Probably something like this: Totemist 2/ PsyWar 4/ Soul Manifester 10. That leaves you 4 levels, either Totemist or PsyWar will do.

What do you get out of it? At level 16, you have +9 BAB, and +8/+7/+8 saves; you have meldshaper level 12, 6 soulmelds shaped, 3 bound, and 9 essentia; you have manifester level 14, 59 pp/day, 14 powers known, max level 5. You have 2 bonus feats from early PsyWar, and access to your totem, crown, feet, hands, arms, brow, and shoulders chakras. Note that you can shape soulmelds to any chakra, but you can only bind to those 7. (Trust me, that's enough for your needs.)

You can also invest essentia into your powers (thanks to Psionic Investment) and can gain bonus essentia (Psionic Distillation).

If you take Improved Unarmed Strike, Superior Unarmed Strike, and Beast Strikes, your unarmed attacks will deal plenty of damage, and you can add your claw damage (psionic or soulmeld) to them. With an Amulet of Mighty Fists, you can make your natural weapons magic, adding an enhancement bonus and letting them overcome DR.

As an additional point, make him a Silverbrow Human, for two reasons. First, you have the Dragonblood Subtype, letting you qualify for Draconic soulmelds (http://archive.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/ex/20060912a&page=4), while still being Human (and thus getting that delicious bonus feat). Second, it gives him a unique lineage, which fits Kimimaro, whose lineage grants him a unique bloodline power.

[Tvtyrant]

Artificer who uses self buffs and marvelous pigments to make none magic bone items at will. It shape sand to make sand bone blades.

[.Zero]

I'm supporting HEAVY refluffing in either way. But can't decide between refluffed Abjurant Champion or refluffed Totemist. Refluffed AC seems just cool! Be a wizard and cast nothing but refluffed abjuration and transmutation spells, buff yourself through death (you could even dip incantatrix 3 for persistent buffs) and go to town. Be a melee caster, buff yourself at tje beginning of the day and let your last spell be Tenser's Transformation. This will require big refluffing work, but it's certainty beautiful.
On the other side, Totemist just fits better the Kinimaro idea, you could just refluff that girallon soulmeld and do lots of natural attack, especially if you find a way to dip Warshaper.

As for feats and class features, Kimimaro surely has Fast Movement, 40+ movement speed, Pounce and Spring Attack. His HP are not going to be impressive so everything with a maximum of d8 is fine (thus supporting the Focused Transmuter/Abjurant Champion line), i mean, he's a dancer, he will surely have impressive natural AC but low hp. I'm quite surprised no one mentioned Dervish for. the Totemist oriented build or Spelldancer/Swiftblade for the caster oriented way. All of these may be useful and flavorful if appropriately refluffed.
There are a lot of ways in wich you could build Kimimaro, just refluff what you need and you'll be fine.

[Red Fel]

... refluffing ... refluffed ... refluffed ... Refluffed ... refluffed ... refluffing ... refluff ... refluffed. ... refluff ...

"You keep using that word. I do not think it means what you think it means. (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G2y8Sx4B2Sk)"

[Fax Celestis]

As for feats and class features, Kimimaro surely has Fast Movement, 40+ movement speed, Pounce and Spring Attack. His HP are not going to be impressive so everything with a maximum of d8 is fine (thus supporting the Focused Transmuter/Abjurant Champion line), i mean, he's a dancer, he will surely have impressive natural AC but low hp. I'm quite surprised no one mentioned Dervish for. the Totemist oriented build or Spelldancer/Swiftblade for the caster oriented way. All of these may be useful and flavorful if appropriately refluffed.
There are a lot of ways in wich you could build Kimimaro, just refluff what you need and you'll be fine.

Those are basically all features of the Umbral Disciple, a MoI PrC that's actually pretty fantastic. If you're comfortable with that, you can reskin a duskling for the movement features.

I am wholeheartedly recommending Rogue 1/Totemist 5/Umbral Disciple 10. Technically you can enter as Rogue 1/Totemist 4, but Totemist 5 gives you three new open chakras.

[PraxisVetli]

If I may make a suggestion? Totemist/ PsyWar (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/psionic/classes/psychicWarrior.htm)/ Soul Manifester (http://archive.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/psm/20060217a).

Upsides: Full advancement of Totemist soulmelds and Psychic Warrior manifesting, which includes some pretty useful combat powers.

Downside: Totemist and PsyWar are 3/4 BAB classes; Soul Manifester is 1/2 BAB.

How would it play? Probably something like this: Totemist 2/ PsyWar 4/ Soul Manifester 10. That leaves you 4 levels, either Totemist or PsyWar will do.

What do you get out of it? At level 16, you have +9 BAB, and +8/+7/+8 saves; you have meldshaper level 12, 6 soulmelds shaped, 3 bound, and 9 essentia; you have manifester level 14, 59 pp/day, 14 powers known, max level 5. You have 2 bonus feats from early PsyWar, and access to your totem, crown, feet, hands, arms, brow, and shoulders chakras. Note that you can shape soulmelds to any chakra, but you can only bind to those 7. (Trust me, that's enough for your needs.)

You can also invest essentia into your powers (thanks to Psionic Investment) and can gain bonus essentia (Psionic Distillation).

If you take Improved Unarmed Strike, Superior Unarmed Strike, and Beast Strikes, your unarmed attacks will deal plenty of damage, and you can add your claw damage (psionic or soulmeld) to them. With an Amulet of Mighty Fists, you can make your natural weapons magic, adding an enhancement bonus and letting them overcome DR.

As an additional point, make him a Silverbrow Human, for two reasons. First, you have the Dragonblood Subtype, letting you qualify for Draconic soulmelds (http://archive.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/ex/20060912a&page=4), while still being Human (and thus getting that delicious bonus feat). Second, it gives him a unique lineage, which fits Kimimaro, whose lineage grants him a unique bloodline power.
You absolutely may make a suggestion! I think my only problem withis is is the. BAB. As Kimimaro, he needs to be able to hit things. does PsyWar get any powers that can up to-hit?
I've only ever played a psion once, and she was radically different, so I don't know much here either.

[Fax Celestis]

You absolutely may make a suggestion! I think my only problem withis is is the. BAB. As Kimimaeo, he needs to be able to hit things. does PsyWar get any powers that can upto-hit?
I've only ever played a psion once, and she was radically different, so I don't know much here either.

Yes. (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/psionic/powers/precognitionOffensive.htm) Several (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/psionic/powers/metaphysicalWeapon.htm). In a (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/psionic/powers/strengthofMyEnemy.htm) variety (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/psionic/powers/animalAffinity.htm) of ways (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/psionic/powers/dissolvingTouch.htm).

[Red Fel]

You absolutely may make a suggestion! I think my only problem withis is is the. BAB. As Kimimaeo, he needs to be able to hit things. does PsyWar get any powers that can upto-hit?
I've only ever played a psion once, and she was radically different, so I don't know much here either.

Easy, up-front method? Offensive Precognition (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/psionic/powers/precognitionOffensive.htm). As mentioned, you have manifester level 14, meaning you can spend up to 14 PP on a single power. Obviously, you wouldn't burn that much on this, but for 7 PP, you can manifest it as a swift action, it lasts for 14 minutes (140 rounds), and you gain +3 to hit.

As a level 1 power, it comes online immediately; costing only 1 PP, you can use it for an easy +1 to hit right out of the gate, or augment it as you like.

[PraxisVetli]

Yes. (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/psionic/powers/precognitionOffensive.htm) Several (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/psionic/powers/metaphysicalWeapon.htm). In a (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/psionic/powers/strengthofMyEnemy.htm) variety (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/psionic/powers/animalAffinity.htm) of ways (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/psionic/powers/dissolvingTouch.htm).
Wahaa, spectacular!

Easy, up-front method? Offensive Precognition (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/psionic/powers/precognitionOffensive.htm). As mentioned, you have manifester level 14, meaning you can spend up to 14 PP on a single power. Obviously, you wouldn't burn that much on this, but for 7 PP, you can manifest it as a swift action, it lasts for 14 minutes (140 rounds), and you gain +3 to hit.

As a level 1 power, it comes online immediately; costing only 1 PP, you can use it for an easy +1 to hit right out of the gate, or augment it as you like.

Righton.
So, he'll be bad at hitting things, then combat will start, and an avalanche of psionics later, he's 'combat ready!'
With only one Swift action a round, which of these is ideal?

Those are basically all features of the Umbral Disciple, a MoI PrC that's actually pretty fantastic. If you're comfortable with that, you can reskin a duskling for the movement features.

I am wholeheartedly recommending Rogue 1/Totemist 5/Umbral Disciple 10. Technically you can enter as Rogue 1/Totemist 4, but Totemist 5 gives you three new open chakras.

Just caught this, sorry.
Umbral Disciple, is that the one that grants HiPS? I think I've a player in another campaign using it, we just learned enough to make that work.

[Fax Celestis]

Just caught this, sorry.
Umbral Disciple, is that the one that grants HiPS? I think I've a player in another campaign using it, we just learned enough to make that work.

Yeah, that's the one.

[Red Fel]

Umbral Disciple is actually a pretty decent class for a ninja-style character, although admittedly not many characters in Naruto would actually qualify as "ninja" in the traditional sense. A few notes, however. Despite increasing your Essentia pool, Umbral Disciple does not grant you meldshaper level advancement or access to additional chakra binds. It does not advance Totemist in any way, save that it gives you additional Essentia, which you will presumably invest in your class abilities, or perhaps in some feats. Embrace of Shadow is great, but does not stack with any other miss chance, and is dependent upon Essentia investment. In other words, if you don't invest in the ability, it does nothing, so keep that in mind. The same invest-or-useless provision applies to Step of the Bodiless, Sight of the Eyeless, Soulchilling Strike, and Kiss of the Shadows. It's a 3/4 BAB class again. You won't find full BAB here.
Is it a fun, flavorful class? Yes. Is it a good class for a ninja-themed Incarnum user? Definitely. But the question you have to ask is whether it fits this character concept specifically. Kiss of the Shadows can certainly be refluffed to be bone spurs, and Sept Knowledge can be treated like belonging to a Ninja Village; Step of the Bodiless certainly helps with classical ninja skills, and Sneak Attack is always appropriate.

That said, the concealment aspect of Embrace of Shadow can be duplicated with the Fellmist Robe soulmeld (Incarnate list), which gives 10% concealment even with no investment, +5% per essentia (up to 50%); if you get to epic levels, you could take Open Heart Chakra and bind Blink Shirt (Totemist list) there, granting Blink, a juicy 50% miss chance. Hide in Plain Sight can be granted by the Dark Creature template, which you can get from the Collar of Umbral Metamorphosis. Soulchilling Strike is useful, but that DC is going to be low enough, and Fort saves are generally high enough, that most enemies will be able to make it.

[PraxisVetli]

Umbral Disciple is actually a pretty decent class for a ninja-style character, although admittedly not many characters in Naruto would actually qualify as "ninja" in the traditional sense. A few notes, however. Despite increasing your Essentia pool, Umbral Disciple does not grant you meldshaper level advancement or access to additional chakra binds. It does not advance Totemist in any way, save that it gives you additional Essentia, which you will presumably invest in your class abilities, or perhaps in some feats. Embrace of Shadow is great, but does not stack with any other miss chance, and is dependent upon Essentia investment. In other words, if you don't invest in the ability, it does nothing, so keep that in mind. The same invest-or-useless provision applies to Step of the Bodiless, Sight of the Eyeless, Soulchilling Strike, and Kiss of the Shadows. It's a 3/4 BAB class again. You won't find full BAB here.
Is it a fun, flavorful class? Yes. Is it a good class for a ninja-themed Incarnum user? Definitely. But the question you have to ask is whether it fits this character concept specifically. Kiss of the Shadows can certainly be refluffed to be bone spurs, and Sept Knowledge can be treated like belonging to a Ninja Village; Step of the Bodiless certainly helps with classical ninja skills, and Sneak Attack is always appropriate.

That said, the concealment aspect of Embrace of Shadow can be duplicated with the Fellmist Robe soulmeld (Incarnate list), which gives 10% concealment even with no investment, +5% per essentia (up to 50%); if you get to epic levels, you could take Open Heart Chakra and bind Blink Shirt (Totemist list) there, granting Blink, a juicy 50% miss chance. Hide in Plain Sight can be granted by the Dark Creature template, which you can get from the Collar of Umbral Metamorphosis. Soulchilling Strike is useful, but that DC is going to be low enough, and Fort saves are generally high enough, that most enemies will be able to make it.

Okay, so we'll stick with the othe PsyWar Totemist plan.

[Red Fel]

Okay, so we'll stick with the othe PsyWar Totemist plan.

I'm not trying to discourage you! Frankly, I could see this character as a ToB class, almost as-is, perhaps with a dash of incarnum for measure. I was just pointing out pros and cons.

For example, we could go with a Warblade / Bloodclaw Master, refluffing the claws as bone spurs again. Warblade 15/ BCM 5 gives us 18 BAB, not bad at all. And you have lots of ninja combat action, down to the fancy names on the maneuvers.

Or we could go with a Barbarian build, using Spirit Lion Totem Barbarian for Pounce. You could take that into Black Blood Cultist, gaining claws, fangs, and a rend, easily refluffed as bone weapons. Or you could take it into Frostrager, and claim that the ice (which excretes from your pores and becomes armor and weapons) is bone. Both are great for hand-to-hand combat; the former gives a bunch of natural weapons and grappling proficiencies, while the latter is more about unarmed strikes. (Frostrager also gives you a version of Whirling Frenzy, so you don't have to take that ACF.)

Again, these are options. You could go with Totemist/PsyWar, or mix either of those in with any of these. (Although Barbarian doesn't mix well with Psionics.) Options.

[Dusk Eclipse]

You don't really need to go psywar/totemist at all, let me present you RadicalTaoist's Psionic Kimimaro (http://brilliantgameologists.com/boards/index.php?PHPSESSID=suuad0qt48ktnfrhtkv3fjkur3&topic=6002.msg198328#msg198328)

From this thread (http://brilliantgameologists.com/boards/index.php?topic=6002)

[PraxisVetli]

You don't really need to go psywar/totemist at all, let me present you RadicalTaoist's Psionic Kimimaro (http://brilliantgameologists.com/boards/index.php?PHPSESSID=suuad0qt48ktnfrhtkv3fjkur3&topic=6002.msg198328#msg198328)

From this thread (http://brilliantgameologists.com/boards/index.php?topic=6002)
Oooh!

I'm not trying to discourage you! Frankly, I could see this character as a ToB class, almost as-is, perhaps with a dash of incarnum for measure. I was just pointing out pros and cons.

For example, we could go with a Warblade / Bloodclaw Master, refluffing the claws as bone spurs again. Warblade 15/ BCM 5 gives us 18 BAB, not bad at all. And you have lots of ninja combat action, down to the fancy names on the maneuvers.

Or we could go with a Barbarian build, using Spirit Lion Totem Barbarian for Pounce. You could take that into Black Blood Cultist, gaining claws, fangs, and a rend, easily refluffed as bone weapons. Or you could take it into Frostrager, and claim that the ice (which excretes from your pores and becomes armor and weapons) is bone. Both are great for hand-to-hand combat; the former gives a bunch of natural weapons and grappling proficiencies, while the latter is more about unarmed strikes. (Frostrager also gives you a version of Whirling Frenzy, so you don't have to take that ACF.)

Again, these are options. You could go with Totemist/PsyWar, or mix either of those in with any of these. (Although Barbarian doesn't mix well with Psionics.) Options.

Does TOB mix with Totemist?
Cuz Swordsage could work, with Tiger Claw and all that.

[Dusk Eclipse]

Eh sort of, ToB and MoI are incredibly dip-friendly systems, but having said that there isn't a dedicated theurge class for maneuvers and soulmelds (which is a shame, because an incarnate/totemist shaping powerful weapons made from the souls of past, present and future masters of the Sublime way is an awesome concept).

[PraxisVetli]

Eh sort of, ToB and MoI are incredibly dip-friendly systems, but having said that there isn't a dedicated theurge class for maneuvers and soulmelds (which is a shame, because an incarnate/totemist shaping powerful weapons made from the souls of past, present and future masters of the Sublime way is an awesome concept).
Wow. that sounds wicked.
well, I don't know how many levels in Totemist are needed, but even 3-5 levels of swordsage would work, if sprinkled.

[Red Fel]

Does TOB mix with Totemist?
Cuz Swordsage could work, with Tiger Claw and all that.

Dusk is correct that both are dip-friendly systems, and that neither theurges easily with the other. But I happen to think that Totemist mixes brilliantly with Warblade, in part because Warblade has native access to Iron Heart maneuvers and stances, as well as bonus feats. As a result, turning a Warblade with IUS into a natural attacks machine with just a few levels of Totemist is shockingly easy. Not to mention Warblade's superior BAB and maneuver refreshing mechanic.

The catch is that at this point, we're leaving Kimimaro behind and rapidly approaching Hyuuga territory. And you don't want those Hyuugas getting territorial, now do you?

[Talionis]

You are already talking about Tome of Battle... Why not Bloodstorm Blade and refluff the returning to replacing the spikes?

Bloodstorm Blade is designed to be able to attack At a distance and melee at the same time. It burns maneuvers to do some of its stuff.

Totems I could also do it with Masticore belt.

[Dusk Eclipse]

Eh... Kimimaro is a melee fighter at his core, his drilling finger bullets weren't really that important or even effective (Granted it was against Gaara's shield of sand), but devoting at least 4 levels (IIRC) just for that... I don't think it is worthwhile.

[Shinken]

I would do Kimimaro as a Warblade/Warshaper, maybe with some deformity feats.
Psychic Warror has lots of thematically appropriate powers, though.

[Dusk Eclipse]

I hadn't thought about changeling warshaper... though I guess pseudo-lycanthrope can also work in a pinch (mostly for the Dr 10/Silver, it is awesome at low levels).

This is why I love 3.5 so much, there are so many ways to go about almost anything.

[Flickerdart]

Eh... Kimimaro is a melee fighter at his core, his drilling finger bullets weren't really that important or even effective (Granted it was against Gaara's shield of sand), but devoting at least 4 levels (IIRC) just for that... I don't think it is worthwhile.
Eh, no ranged attacks in Naruto are ever effective against anyone with a name, so it's fair if OP wants to disregard that particular deficiency.

[Shinken]

Eh, no ranged attacks in Naruto are ever effective against anyone with a name, so it's fair if OP wants to disregard that particular deficiency.

What about Kagemane, Rasenshuriken, Amaterasu, Susanoo's arrow and all of Gaara's attacks? :smalltongue:

[Flickerdart]

What about Kagemane, Rasenshuriken, Amaterasu, Susanoo's arrow and all of Gaara's attacks? :smalltongue:
All of those would be modeled as spells, not ranged attacks. I'm specifically talking about "throw thing at guy" type attacks like the bone darts, needles, shuriken, and various other things.

[Shinken]

All of those would be modeled as spells, not ranged attacks. I'm specifically talking about "throw thing at guy" type attacks like the bone darts, needles, shuriken, and various other things.

Oh, yeah, shuriken are useless.

[Dusk Eclipse]

Haku was really effective with throwing needles, she* managed to take down Sasuke and almost took down Naruto, but yes in general ranged attacks are completely useless.

*Personal headcanon

[Nousos]

For added fun use psionic tattoos to act as your "cursed seal". Things like expansion, temporal acceleration, and the like. Have that mind's eye combination of tattoos is that ends up with recharging powers on them.

[Flickerdart]

Haku was really effective with throwing needles, she* managed to take down Sasuke and almost took down Naruto, but yes in general ranged attacks are completely useless.

*Personal headcanon
Haku was a powerful ninja with a super-cheap technique, and still took forever to do anything to either Naruto or Sasuke, who were beginner genin. It's truly a testament to the weakness of the throwing needle that it does jack all even if the enemy can't dodge it.

[Dusk Eclipse]

For added fun use psionic tattoos to act as your "cursed seal". Things like expansion, temporal acceleration, and the like. Have that mind's eye combination of tattoos is that ends up with recharging powers on them.

The Psionic build threads used form of doom as the general Cursed seal level 2 forms.

[PraxisVetli]

Haku was really effective with throwing needles, she* managed to take down Sasuke and almost took down Naruto, but yes in general ranged attacks are completely useless.

*Personal headcanon


All of those would be modeled as spells, not ranged attacks. I'm specifically talking about "throw thing at guy" type attacks like the bone darts, needles, shuriken, and various other things.

Does Tenten count?
Or is that a cone?

[Shinken]

Does Tenten count?
Or is that a cone?

Tenten is even more useless than her useless shuriken.

[PraxisVetli]

Tenten is even more useless than her useless shuriken.

O.O
i liked tenten...

[Silva Stormrage]

O.O
i liked tenten...

Doesn't mean she isn't useless :smalltongue:

But on topic I agree that Kimimaro really should be focused on melee. I think the psionic version linked above is a good fit ignoring the Psychic Chirurgery implants. Would using the educated wilder variant be good enough to remove that as necessary?

[Flickerdart]

Does Tenten count?
Or is that a cone?
Has Tenten ever accomplished anything?

[LordErebus12]

There is my pathfinder class, the bone horror... although it might not be EXACTLY what you want.

http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?247966-Bone-Horror-The-Nightmare-of-the-Crypt-Pathfinder-Class

[Talionis]

Are you going to emulate his ultimate where he had spikes growing out of the ground and swam through sand?

[PraxisVetli]

Are you going to emulate his ultimate where he had spikes growing out of the ground and swam through sand?

Possibly.
not sure how. Probably just a refluffed spell. One of the faerun books has a big AOE of icy spikes. Z-mans Icy Razors or somethin.

[Fax Celestis]

Possibly.
not sure how. Probably just a refluffed spell. One of the faerun books has a big AOE of icy spikes. Z-mans Icy Razors or somethin.

Ooh ooh ooh! Look up sudden stalagmite in Spell Compendium. Refluff as necessary.

Yes, it does what you think it does.

[Dusk Eclipse]

If you go the psionic route, mindquake (hyperconcious 3rd party book) deals 15d6 damage in area with no save.

[PraxisVetli]

Ooh ooh ooh! Look up sudden stalagmite in Spell Compendium. Refluff as necessary.

Yes, it does what you think it does.

Lol. That's the second biggest whammo, right there. If I cant find the field spell, the I might go the Mindquake power.

[Fax Celestis]

Lol. That's the second biggest whammo, right there. If I cant find the field spell, the I might go the Mindquake power.

Field of icy razors, maybe? Also Spell Compendium.

[PraxisVetli]

Field of icy razors, maybe? Also Spell Compendium.

See now, I knew it got renamed in that book, but not know the new or original name didn't get me far.
You'd think that with Spell Compendium being one if all of 5 books I have in hard copy, I'd know it better.
looking up....

Yeaup, that's it!

[.Zero]

"You keep using that word. I do not think it means what you think it means. (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G2y8Sx4B2Sk)"

Sorry, what's your point? Was that supposed to be humor? I used that word properly, I'm not going to create a "Refluffing Incedent" here.

[Feint's End]

I know I'm a bit late for that but I'm perfectly sure you can make exactly what you want with an aberrant aegis. It can literally do everything you asked for.

It's pathfinder though but you can find it online and maybe your dm approves.