Cleric of Io

[Dominuce2112]

I am really knew to any divine class, and the spellbook. I have heard clerics can do everything, and want to make one.

The only problem is I dont know enough about clerics to figure out this PCs mechanics during combat. Id prefer not to be melee but more battlefield control, disenchanting, subduing.

Io hates to see dragons struggle, especially among themselves. There is A LOT of draconic civil fighting in my campaign due to tiamat being a bitch and an NPC with some dragon orbs. I want to make a cleric that will have a decent time settling the fights, and stripping the power of those that hold the orbs.

Any thoughts on class, race, templates, domains, feats, spells..anything that could mechanically do what I want to do thematically would be appreciated.

I was thinking dragonborn lesser aasimar or dragonwrought kobold...

[bekeleven]

Look into the singer of concordance prestige class. I dipped it as a Shugenja of Io. Full divine casting and a number of fight-ending or defensive powers.

The bad: Bad fort save, bad BAB, D6 HD. At least it has Will+Ref, though. And it grants a bonus domain!

[WhamBamSam]

Look into the singer of concordance prestige class. I dipped it as a Shugenja of Io. Full divine casting and a number of fight-ending or defensive powers.

The bad: Bad fort save, bad BAB, D6 HD. At least it has Will+Ref, though. And it grants a bonus domain!Dragons (such as Dragonwrought Kobolds) automatically qualify per a poorly thought out line on page 8 of Races of the Dragon, so you can get in at 2nd level if your DM is cheese tolerant.

[eggynack]

Look into the singer of concordance prestige class. I dipped it as a Shugenja of Io. Full divine casting and a number of fight-ending or defensive powers.

The bad: Bad fort save, bad BAB, D6 HD. At least it has Will+Ref, though. And it grants a bonus domain!
Ooh, that class is nifty. Seems like it might make a reasonable two level dip on a druid, as a sort of cheaper and less level efficient version of the contemplative. Free domains are always fun, and these are solid ones too.

[bekeleven]

Ooh, that class is nifty. Seems like it might make a reasonable two level dip on a druid, as a sort of cheaper and less level efficient version of the contemplative. Free domains are always fun, and these are solid ones too.

Yeah, you need all the tricks you can get with a shugenja, like the Dracolyte. Dracolyte was actually a great find because it grants a special domain type that automagically adds to spells known. Only problem is needing 2 100% useless feats. Also, didn't need 3rd level spells, so you can dip it at 5. Pretty useless unless you're a spontaneous divine caster, and those are a rare breed.

Singer of Concordance, meanwhile, has an fun capstone. At-will transport to a demiplane that's only reachable by other members of the class or people spamming divinations. The fact that people by that level can spam divinations is what makes it not an excellent capstone.

Most of the other abilities are planar gimmicks that allow saves, so it's overall kind of iffy. The main advantage to Singer of Concordance is the low barrier of entry.

[eggynack]

Dracolyte was actually a great find because it grants a special domain type that automagically adds to spells known.
Yeah, that ability is always cool, though I prefer getting it through holt warden. Much easier entry. Dracolyte does seem better than talontar blightlord though, as the actual domain is better, and I have the latter on my fancy list, so it might be worth adding that one as well. Tis a good day for the expansion of my list of druid PrC's.


Most of the other abilities are planar gimmicks that allow saves, so it's overall kind of iffy. The main advantage to Singer of Concordance is the low barrier of entry.
Pretty much, on both counts, though aspect of peace actually seems pretty sweet, so it all adds up to a reasonable dip.

[bekeleven]

Yeah, that ability is always cool, though I prefer getting it through holt warden. Much easier entry.

Holt Warden is literally the opposite of a good prestige for a shugenja (even ignoring that you need to get entangle onto your class list to take it).


If you prepare your spells in advance and do not have the spontaneous casting ability (as the cleric and druid spellcasting feature, see PH 32 and 35), you can now spontaneously trade prepared divine spells for spells of an equal or lower level from the Plant domain. If you do have a spontaneous casting ability, you can exchange that one for the ability to cast spontaneously from the Plant domain.
You literally lose your entire spell list.

[eggynack]

Holt Warden is literally the opposite of a good prestige for a shugenja (even ignoring that you need to get entangle onto your class list to take it).


You literally lose your entire spell list.
The entangle thing is annoying, but I think you're mistaken on the losing the list point. The text says that you can trade away your casting for spontaneous casting from the domain, rather than that you must. Meanwhile, the final and relevant part of plant affinity, which is what grants the bonus spells, exists regardless of your decision on the issue of spontaneous casting. Thus, the only real downside to holt warden is that you probably have to do something silly like pick up extra spell for entangle, and that still leaves you ahead of dracolyte in terms of silly feat tax. There might be a better way to do it too, but I gots nothing on that count.

[bekeleven]

Eh, the final text is ambiguous to me how it works with spontaneous casting. It clearly wasn't written with favored soul or shugenja in mind (or... divine bard? or the even more obscure spontaneous divine casters, like the shamans?).

It just says "If you don't have domains, you get domains as a cleric." The only problem is that anything in 3.5 that grants access to normal (not prestige) domains does so through the mechanic that they don't automatically add to your spells known. So I consider Holt Warden a gamble with your DM's ruling.

So basically, either you can only cast plant domain spells, or you don't gain the ability to cast new stuff at all. Any even if you do gain bonus spells due to a favorable DM ruling, at the time you take Holt Warden (level 7), you already have all 3 spells that the class grants you, even though you're probably not planning on using plant growth ever. At level 10 you begin to dig yourself out of the spells known hole, but that's hardly ideal.

My character (http://www.myth-weavers.com/sheetview.php?sheetid=991178) dipped seeker of the misty isle and spent half his starting gold on a domain staff of travel, which was a lovely investment.

[eggynack]

It just says "If you don't have domains, you get domains as a cleric." The only problem is that anything in 3.5 that grants access to normal (not prestige) domains does so through the mechanic that they don't automatically add to your spells known. So I consider Holt Warden a gamble with your DM's ruling.

The prestige domain thing is irrelevant. If the class just said that you get domains as a cleric, then you would indeed default to a mediocre pile of spells known. However, what the class actually says is, "You now gain bonus spells from the Plant domain," which means that you get bonus spells.


Any even if you do gain bonus spells due to a favorable DM ruling, at the time you take Holt Warden (level 7), you already have all 3 spells that the class grants you, even though you're probably not planning on using plant growth ever. At level 10 you begin to dig yourself out of the spells known hole, but that's hardly ideal.
Yeah, the class isn't particularly good for spells known. I don't think there's anything stopping you from spontaneously casting out of those slots, though I don't know if that necessarily works for a shugenja. It's quite possible that fancy prestige classes translate from shugenja to druid better than they translate from druid to shugenja.

[bekeleven]

Nothing translates well to shugenja, which is why playing one curbs my ability to break campaigns over my knee. It's a perfectly playable class that is tier 3 in nearly every op-level, but character building is really squeezing blood from a stone with that spell list. And they can't even use all of their spells known (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showsinglepost.php?p=17960009&postcount=1274).

Also, I think you're right. I missed the word "bonus" there.

[Dominuce2112]

This got side tracked but I will look into that class, singer of concordance. Looks really defensive but that's kind of the style I'm looking for. Io would be pleased lol

Any thoughts on variants or spells to look it?

[Dominuce2112]

Dragons (such as Dragonwrought Kobolds) automatically qualify per a poorly thought out line on page 8 of Races of the Dragon, so you can get in at 2nd level if your DM is cheese tolerant.

I don't see that line. That's the pages about the dragonborn template. What are you referring to?

[Shining Wrath]

You probably want access to the protection domain somehow. Io doesn't grant that one.

[Werephilosopher]

I don't see that line. That's the pages about the dragonborn template. What are you referring to?

The writer probably meant that creatures with the Dragon type qualify for prereqs as if they had the Dragonblood subtype, but do to bad wording creatures with the Dragon type automatically qualify for anything that has the Dragonblood subtype as a prereq.

[WhamBamSam]

I don't see that line. That's the pages about the dragonborn template. What are you referring to?It's actually page 4. It's on a sidebar about the dragonblood subtype at the bottom of the page. I posted without checking. Here's what it says.


Dragons automatically qualify for any classes, prestige classes, racial substitution levels, feats, powers or spells that require the dragonblood subtype.

[Dominuce2112]

It's actually page 4. It's on a sidebar about the dragonblood subtype at the bottom of the page. I posted without checking. Here's what it says.

oh wow... thanks. thats huge.

[bekeleven]

Warning: Using that as written may lead to GM punches.