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View Full Version : DM Help Oops- inadvertently Tucker's Kobolding my players-



TeChameleon
2014-09-01, 03:31 PM
So, newbie DM here, starting up a Shadowrun 4E game with my regular gaming group. Unfortunately, I recently discovered from our D&D DM that the vast majority of plans more complicated and/or subtle than 'find bad guy, bludgeon bad guy until badness stops' came from me. So there went my original plan for a complex game of politics, intrigue and subterfuge.

However, that's neither here nor there. The problem I'm anticipating is that, while my players are hardly stupid, they tend to be fairly linear thinkers (for those of you familiar with the breed, they're almost all engineers, so 'intelligent linear thinker' is pretty much par for the course). I'm... not.

At all.

So I guess what I'm looking for is ways that I can transparently alter a combat encounter if I discover partway through that something I had thought was blindingly obvious and pathetically easy to circumvent turns out to be a hideous deathtrap that is going to cause a frustrating TPK because it came completely out of left field from the players' PoV.

The obvious ones, of course, are fudging die rolls and not bringing planned-but-unrevealed elements into play if problems are arising, but are there others?

(Oh, and for reference regarding my typical mode of thinking for this kind of thing... some of my first thoughts upon trying Shadowrun involved two lightly modded flying microdrones and a monowhip, aka 'the invisible guillotine', the uses and abuses of high-velocity gecko grip-modded gear- aka 'security force as impromptu wall decorations', and fun with DMSO gel rounds- aka 'too many to list')

AMFV
2014-09-01, 05:14 PM
So, newbie DM here, starting up a Shadowrun 4E game with my regular gaming group. Unfortunately, I recently discovered from our D&D DM that the vast majority of plans more complicated and/or subtle than 'find bad guy, bludgeon bad guy until badness stops' came from me. So there went my original plan for a complex game of politics, intrigue and subterfuge.

However, that's neither here nor there. The problem I'm anticipating is that, while my players are hardly stupid, they tend to be fairly linear thinkers (for those of you familiar with the breed, they're almost all engineers, so 'intelligent linear thinker' is pretty much par for the course). I'm... not.

At all.

Best thing I can think of is the rule of three. Which means that you plan at least three solutions to any problem you present. Odds are that one of them will be the one your player's seize on, so you'll be pretty prepared for anything on their part.

Ettina
2014-09-01, 07:24 PM
You could throw in some NPC help - either actual NPC allies, NPC neutral characters (attack both sides indiscriminately) who the players can readily avoid, or something else they can use to their advantage pretty easily.

Also, pay attention to the enemies' Int scores. One of my DMs has outright stated he makes characters with low enough Int use bad combat strategies, such as provoking attacks of opportunity. One fight was made much easier because the 6 Int ranged opponents didn't realize using ranged attacks in melee provoked an attack of opportunity.

draken50
2014-09-03, 04:20 PM
Build complexity slowly.

Make sure that the tactics you're using make sense for the situation.

Security forces blended in with walls is a neat idea... but why? Most security forces in real life tend to be present as a deterrent. Cameras are employed not only because they tend to be cheaper than hiring someone to stand there and watch, but also because they do so more reliably.

It's important to consider not only the intelligence level of the NPCS, but overall feasibility.

You're mono-filament guillotine is a fun idea, but what person who is acting as a guard had the time/inclination to create it/put it into use? If the players are going to be walking into tricks and traps and the like, they should probably have some measure of forewarning. It may not always need to be the most accurate.

Additionally, what kind of game do you want to run? An ever escalating rampage of dirty tricks and clever ideas can start off seeming fun, but once as a Gm you're saying. "Nope, you don't have the skills/resources to make that," or the enemies are now prepared for the tactic you just came up with no-one has seen before, it can get frustrating really fast.

If you're trying to get the players to be more creative, show stuff in game, but try to keep it less lethal, or have an NPC ally providing the kind of crazy stuff you want to see in game. Again, you can use crazy clever stuff, but have it make sense, and give the players a chance to be ready for it.

My other thought is that those sort of clever mcguyverish things could also come from rival runners rather than just being stuff the corps are using. My knowledge of shadowrun is a bit limited, but from my admittedly limited experience with cyberpunk a properly pissed off corp may just try to track you down and blow up the entire city block you reside in.

Reiver Party
2014-09-07, 05:39 AM
So I guess what I'm looking for is ways that I can transparently alter a combat encounter if I discover partway through that something I had thought was blindingly obvious and pathetically easy to circumvent turns out to be a hideous deathtrap that is going to cause a frustrating TPK because it came completely out of left field from the players' PoV.

The obvious ones, of course, are fudging die rolls and not bringing planned-but-unrevealed elements into play if problems are arising, but are there others?

Basically no.

There's a couple of things that'll work once but don't hold up to scrutiny:

A second runner team attacks the facility, distracting security and giving the players a chance to run away or finish the job.
Security mysteriously withdraws; an executive wants the runners to steal the McGuffin so she can trace who they're stealing it for. At the handover, the executive's forces attack the meet.
The Johnson calls the runners and tells them to withdraw; this was a feint to draw out security and force them to tip their hand as to what they had in reserve.