Gratz you leveled! Suddenly you can...

[Rickshaw]

Relatively new to DMing, I was reading through the old rules about multiclassing, (not that I would ever impose them on anyone, I was just curious,) and it occurred to me that it makes very little sense for characters to simply SUDDENLY be able to do stuff that they've never practiced before. So what I was thinking is this ~ would it be too powerful to rule that 2 times a week you can use an action as though you were a level higher? Everything from saves, to class abilities, to BaB and higher level spells? Just something to represent Practice?

Too broken and open to abuse?

[Blackhawk748]

I think that that may be really abusable, generally i tend to use things as intended so im not the right guy to ask about this. However if you want a more realistic version of leveling up you could use the Training System (or its called something like that) i think its in DMG 2. Basically when they level up they dont actually go up a level until ther go see a trainer and train for a few days.

[Alefiend]

The justification for PCs suddenly gaining these abilities is that it isn't sudden at all. They've been practicing, studying, and working out in their off-screen time. Gaining a level is the moment that everything they've been working on finally gels.

Be glad this isn't some of the older versions of D&D, where the DM was well within his rights (and the rules) to make you spend time and money to train once you had enough XP for the new level. And some classes (monk, druid) had to duel a higher-level NPC of their class in order to gain some higher levels.

[Rickshaw]

That really feels like punishing the players for leveling though, to go have to pay someone and go way out of their way just to get something they should already have... And it smacks of WoW=P

Also it still feels stilted. "Oh I leveled. I have to go practice for half a day. Now I can cast 7 new spells, or suddenly have damage reduction!"

I get realism isn't rated real high in FANTASY RPGs, but it still feels odd.

[ngilop]

YES to both.

that prob one of the craziest ideas ive ever seen

WHAT is supposed to be happening in fluff in regards to multiclassing is the character in question is supposed to already BE practicing with a sword to get better at fighting, or chatting with the party wizard to learn the base foundations of magic. its not suppose to be how you are thinking it that they wake up and say ' ok im a level barbarian level 1 rogue now'

just change how you are wrongly imagining the multi classing to be and it is not so 'this then suddenly that' and then come up with rediculosu rules allowing peeps to be X level(s) higher for no reason at all.

[Flickerdart]

Also it still feels stilted. "Oh I leveled. I have to go practice for half a day. Now I can cast 7 new spells, or suddenly have damage reduction!"
Think back to grade school. You come into class and see the terrifying words "quadratic functions" written on the board. You don't know what this is, and neither does any other student. 45 minutes from that point, you know how to do quadratic functions. Similarly, a cleric who has proven himself and advanced his standing in the eye of his deity can be entrusted to new mysteries of his faith, and quickly turn them against the god's enemies.

An alternative (or concurrent - things don't have to work the same for every class or even every representative of that class) way of explaining it could be that the character (in this example, a wizard) didn't just learn two new spells. They've been practicing and refining them during regular spell prep - or have been practicing with weaker versions of the spell - and they finally feel like they've mastered the concept enough for a field trial. I can tell you that very frequently, the span between a heap of trash and a functional prototype can be measured in minutes.

[Kraken]

I agree that this is stuff that should just be assumed to have been going on all along. Much like bathing, equipment cleaning, spell prep for wizards (and other start of day stuff for all classes), and lots of other stuff, it's just too boring to bother with. At most, these things deserve one occasional line, such as 'I do such and such things for the rest of the evening before bed, or 'while we wait, I do this.' Anything more than that is a waste of precious table time.

[atemu1234]

I agree that this is stuff that should just be assumed to have been going on all along. Much like bathing, equipment cleaning, spell prep for wizards (and other start of day stuff for all classes), and lots of other stuff, it's just too boring to bother with. At most, these things deserve one occasional line, such as 'I do such and such things for the rest of the evening before bed, or 'while we wait, I do this.' Anything more than that is a waste of precious table time.

I once had a group that wanted to try LARPing. Unfortunately, for the reasons above, they decided they prefer just doing D&D.

[Khedrac]

To be honest, if you really want to do this sort of thing then you need a new RPG (or possibly an old one).

Skill-based systems (like RuneQuest) have skills advance as you use them - you need to find a trainer to start new ones, or improve ones you are not using.
RoleMaster had you assign your next level's skill points (rather more important that in D&D - weapon were skills) when you leveled up - (so at character generation you assigned level 2's points too) to reflect that you were then going to be practicing these areas during your down time this level.

The latter sounds like a good idea - and could be done with D&D skill points, but it fails really badly in many campaigns. Consider you are adventuring on a ship. You have just got enough xp to level up so you plan to learn to swim and gain better ship-handling skills so you allocate points to those skills for your next level. (Remember at this point you don't get the skills, you just start practicing.) Then you find out that that fight climaxed the at-sea portion of the adventure - you are now off to a desert. You are now practicing your ship-handling and swimming in a desert - how exactly does that work?

My preference is for the skill-based systems if you want to go down this route, but I really don't think it is worth worrying about. The very nature of D&D - feats, spells etc. work against this.

[Malroth]

Or just simply ask the players what they're training for next level, they haven't gotten it down yet but it will help you imagine the off screen training montogue of them repeatedly failing these tasks repeatedly untill they get it right.

[Andezzar]

I once had a group that wanted to try LARPing. Unfortunately, for the reasons above, they decided they prefer just doing D&D.Yes, bathing is such a chore IRL, who would want to do it as a hobby. SCNR

[Extra Anchovies]

Or just simply ask the players what they're training for next level, they haven't gotten it down yet but it will help you imagine the off screen training montogue of them repeatedly failing these tasks repeatedly untill they get it right.

Exactly. Maybe require that the players figure out what their next level is by the time they're halfway to leveling (e.g. they have to know what class they'll take at 5th level by the time they have 9000 xp), and if they don't know just require them to take their next level in one of the classes they've already taken (with some exceptions, e.g. switching from one martial class to another, but not switching from a caster to a martial character).

[atemu1234]

Yes, bathing is such a chore IRL, who would want to do it as a hobby. SCNR

When it's without a shower, using sand instead of soap, it can.

[Sir Garanok]

Well the higher level spell would make spellcasters even more imbalanced.

It sounds like a nice reward for good rp though.

[backwaterj]

Exactly. Maybe require that the players figure out what their next level is by the time they're halfway to leveling (e.g. they have to know what class they'll take at 5th level by the time they have 9000 xp), and if they don't know just require them to take their next level in one of the classes they've already taken (with some exceptions, e.g. switching from one martial class to another, but not switching from a caster to a martial character).

This . . . is actually brilliant. Elegant, simple, rewards players for thinking ahead, doesn't punish those who don't.

[Daishain]

How's this?

A: encourage them to role-play practicing new abilities in downtime. It can be as subtle or as detailed as they wish.

B: When they hit a certain point in progression, (you and the players decide when it would be appropriate for the campaign, something along the lines of 75% of xp needed to level up might work), you basically say that their skills have grown to the point that they feel like they can try some new tricks out. They then get access to a limited version of the next level's features. (IE: a wizard gains a single of the new spell slots, but the spell loaded into it has a 25% chance of fizzling.)

Alternatively, if running a lower power game, you could do something similar in reverse. Character hits a new level, gets their HP, their BAB, and their saves, but nothing else. The skills, spells, powers, maneuvers, class abilities, etc. all trickle in gradually.

[Slipperychicken]

Also it still feels stilted. "Oh I leveled. I have to go practice for half a day. Now I can cast 7 new spells, or suddenly have damage reduction!"

You can require that they find higher-level mentors (they will probably need to roleplay a little and/or pay these mentors a lot for their time) and do 8+ hours per day of intense training with them for a month so before gaining the new level (sparring/exercises for a fighter, intense study and magic-practice for a wizard). They also need to explain how they're improving their skills (i.e. Knowledge skills = study at a library or learn from wisemen. Survival = train at outdoorsmanship, and so on). Until they do that training, any XP they gain is wasted. That way, there's no question of where that level came from, and the PCs are forced to gain connections to the world in the form of their trainers, mentors, and time spent in locations.