Arcane Disciple Question

[relytdan]

an arcane caster via Arcane Disciple has access to a 9th level domain spell; provided they have a wisdom 19 they add the chosen domain’s 9th level spell to the class list of their arcane spells..
Q1: in order to actually cast that 9th level domain spell, does the arcane caster need 9th level casting?
Q2: presuming that an arcane caster must have 9th level casting, Other than Beholder Mage is there any other PRC that grants 9th level arcane spells?

[WhamBamSam]

Sublime Chord does, though its skill prereqs prevent you gaining early access to 9ths. Nar Demonbinder can get you there with Versatile Spellcaster.

[Daishain]

A1: In every case that I know of where this issue comes up, the character has to wait until they can cast such spells normally. Take the Warmage for instance, that class technically knows six level nine spells throughout its entire career, but it still has to wait like everyone else.
A2: several. Off the top of my head: Sandshaper1 simply adds several dozen desert themed spells from L1 to L9 to spells known (it is ridiculously powerful for a one level dip onto classes that are starved for spells known), Mage of the Arcane Order7 lets you retrieve and use any L1-L9 spell off of the PHB's wizard list, and wyrm wizard at various levels will let you add any arcane or divine spell off of any list.

There are more, but I'm a little too busy to go and track them down ATM.

[relytdan]

Mage of the Arcane Order (Complete Arcane variant, p. 48)
+1 level of existing arcane spellcasting class
is not its own casting class

wyrm wizard (Dragon Magic variant, p. 55)
+1 level of existing arcane spellcasting class
is not its own casting class

Nar Demonbinder (Unapproachable East variant, p. 25)
Level 4th 5th 6th 7th 8th
does not get full 0 - 9th casting

Beholder Mage (Lords of Madness variant, p. 42)
0 1st 2nd 3rd 4th 5th 6th 7th 8th 9th
I do not want to be a beholder

so are there any PRC's that do what it does with arcane spells?

[WhamBamSam]

You need some manner of spell list expansion (like the Bloodline Feats in Dragon Compendium) and Versatile Spellcaster to get 9ths through Nar Demonbinder, but it can be done.

[Urpriest]

Mage of the Arcane Order (Complete Arcane variant, p. 48)
+1 level of existing arcane spellcasting class
is not its own casting class

wyrm wizard (Dragon Magic variant, p. 55)
+1 level of existing arcane spellcasting class
is not its own casting class

Nar Demonbinder (Unapproachable East variant, p. 25)
Level 4th 5th 6th 7th 8th
does not get full 0 - 9th casting

Beholder Mage (Lords of Madness variant, p. 42)
0 1st 2nd 3rd 4th 5th 6th 7th 8th 9th
I do not want to be a beholder

so are there any PRC's that do what it does with arcane spells?

Beholder Mage and Sublime Chord are the two PrCs that give arcane 9ths, there aren't any others.

[Psyren]

Q1: in order to actually cast that 9th level domain spell, does the arcane caster need 9th level casting?


Yes, you must be the appropriate level in an appropriate class. All the Wisdom allows you to do is prepare the spell - you still need access to those higher slots to prepare it in.

[Biffoniacus_Furiou]

Q1: The requirement of 19 Wis is identical to a Cleric needing 19 Wis to cast 9th level Cleric spells, a Wizard needing 19 Int to cast 9th level Wizard spells, a Sorcerer needing Cha 19 to cast 9th level Sorcerer spells, etc. It's a limitation, not a benefit. This alone will not enable you to cast the spell in question, it's only a limitation that may prevent you from being able to cast it. You still need a 9th level spell slot to cast it from.

Q2: As it's been said twice already, Sublime Chord from Complete Arcane is a prestige class that gives you 9th level arcane spells.

[Urpriest]

More to the point, if all you want is a 9th level domain spell and don't care which class you're using to get it, why not just use a divine spellcasting class?

[relytdan]

this is where I decided unless someone knows some other that could be better../
ECL 1/ Warmage 6/ Jade Phoenix Mage 10 ...

the goal would be to get to 9th and if the math is correct the spells with a Cha 22 would
be 6 8 8 7 7 7 6 3 with Versatile Spellcaster this should turn into 0 1 1 1 1 1 0 1 0 2 - thus getting 2 level 9 spells
which would then allow for Arcane disciple to grant its 9th level domain spell.

Presently it has a bab+13 f+9 r+5 w+8 - Ideally it would be nice to find another PRC that was full bab for 3 levels that did not require any feats and gave +1 level arcane spellcasting class each level

so any thoughts? no dungeon or dragon magazines.

[tyckspoon]

You can't 'ladder' up Versatile Spellcaster, because you don't get slots from the feat - you get the ability to burn slots to cast a spell. Subtle but important difference in wording, but Versatile Spellcaster never creates a spell slot as such (you can't, for example, use Versatile Spellcaster to power Arcane Strike with your higher-leveled spell.)

Abjurant Champion is the closest I can think of to your request on prestige classes; it's only real requirement is the Combat Casting feat. Oh, and proficiency with at least one martial weapon, but there's a few dozen ways to get that. (Being some kind of Elf or Outsider generally. Or dipping a class that has martial proficiencies. Like Crusader. Which would also save you the minimum 2 feats you were going to use to feat your way into Jade Phoenix Mage. 3 if your DM thinks Stances don't count as Maneuvers for the prereqs.)

Oh, I guess there's Ruather? Only 2/3 BAB, 3/3 spellcasting advancement, and as long as you can satisfy the RP requirement it's almost impossible to fail to qualify for it.

Are you particularly attached to Warmage as the base class? There's about a billion ways to make a gish build, and half of them are a lot more efficient about it.

[Biffoniacus_Furiou]

this is where I decided unless someone knows some other that could be better../

As it's already been mentioned, Versatile Spellcaster can only turn two slots into a spell (not another slot) of one level higher. That spell cannot be used to fuel another use of Versatile Spellcaster. Your spells per day of 6 8 8 7 7 7 6 3 would become 0 3 4 5 4 4 3 4 1 if you cast as many as possible using Versatile Spellcaster, and most of these would be cast spells, not spell slots.

You could use Versatile Spellcaster with Nar Demonbinder to spend two 8th level spell slots to cast your 9th level domain spell. You wouldn't actually get any 9th level spells known from it, so you would need to put it on a custom Runestaff from Magic Item Compendium.

Have you considered using Divine Crusader in Complete Divine? With that you can get 9th level domain spells at 16th level.

What exactly do you want this character to do, other than cast a 9th level domain spell?

[Thrice Dead Cat]

I'm sadly on mobile right now, so I can't link anything terribly well, but if I had to guess by what the OP has given us so far, he or she wants both ninth level maneuvers and spells. Unless I'm mistaken, without using versatile spellcaster, Bard 4/Initiator X into Jade Phoenix Mage 2?/Sublime Chord 1 or 2/JPM 10 scrapes by with both things hitting 9. I can't recall the precise breakdown, and it may have also used Virtisuoso levels, but that is the general idea.


Side note, unless you need Warblade for anything special I'm a much bigger fan of Crusader-based JPMs due to the actionless refresh mechanic. That being said, it may be just barely possible to use both of those classes and achieve 9th level maneuvers.

[relytdan]

simply put the whole character needs to fill the following requirements
1: Human with an ecl +1
2: no bard or any divine caster class/PRC
3: Arcane Caster that gets 9th casting
4: <bab 16> -this can be gotten via arcane disciple war domain
5: fort 10+ ref 10+ will 10+
6: must cast: Shapechange Level: Animal 9, Drd 9, Sor/Wiz 9 (can be gotten via arcane disciple animal, for non sor/wiz)

sorcerer/wizard generically are bland and was hoping to avoid the use to cast shapechange.

[dextercorvia]

Consider Wizard4/Duskblade2/Spellsword1/AbjurantChampion5/SacredExorcist(7or8 depending on your LA)

BAB is 16, and you cast as a 17th or 18th level wizard, depending on race.

[Biffoniacus_Furiou]

simply put the whole character needs to fill the following requirements
1: Human with an ecl +1
2: no bard or any divine caster class/PRC
3: Arcane Caster that gets 9th casting
4: <bab 16> -this can be gotten via arcane disciple war domain
5: fort 10+ ref 10+ will 10+
6: must cast: Shapechange Level: Animal 9, Drd 9, Sor/Wiz 9 (can be gotten via arcane disciple animal, for non sor/wiz)

sorcerer/wizard generically are bland and was hoping to avoid the use to cast shapechange.

1: Buy off the +1 LA. (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/variant/races/reducingLevelAdjustments.htm)
2-6: Human Paragon (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/variant/races/racialParagonClasses.htm#humanParagon) 1/ Martial Wizard (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/variant/classes/variantCharacterClasses.htm#wizard) 2/ Fighter 1/ Human Paragon 2/ Spellsword 1/ Abjurant Champion 5/ Incantatrix 4/ Eldritch Knight or Knight Phantom 4. Gets +16 BAB, Wizard 17 casting for 9th level spells with a caster level of 20th with Practiced Spellcaster, your base saves are 15/4/14 and you can cast (Extended) Superior Resistance every (other) day to get +6 to each of them for 21/10/20.

With Incantatrix you can use Metamagic Effect and Cooperative Metamagic to add Persistent Spells to your buffs, such as Shapechange, Divine Power, Choose Destiny, Superior Invisibility, etc. Cooperative Metamagic can be used on your own spells outside of combat because the action economy system only exists during initiative. Take Item Familiar (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/variant/magic/itemFamiliars.htm) at 3rd level and invest every skill point you get into it for the greatest return toward Spellcraft, so you can always succeed to persist your highest level spells by taking ten on the checks.

Make the item familiar a ring or similar, you can wear the above gauntlet over it so opponents will never have line of sight/effect to it and cannot target it directly or slight of hand it. Item familiars are intelligent items which are regarded as constructs, and constructs cannot be disabled or destroyed by dispelling or disjoining and continue to function in antimagic and dead magic areas. It can start as a +1 Ring of Protection and you can upgrade it yourself to another type of ring that has a +1 Deflection bonus to AC added per MIC p234, which should only cost you the normal price for crafting the type of ring you upgrade it to.