"I fully expected to use these on demons..."

[Leather_Book_Wizard]

Is it just me, or does anyone else think that V's use of the scrolls of dissmissal on the Titanium Elementals could have disasterous consequences if they actually run into fiends later? I mean, in all likelyhood, there will be a hole smashes in the AC prison wall, and with Sabine on the loose...

[Assassinfox]

Sabine can plane shift. I don't think Dismissal will be all that useful on her.

[Nightmarenny]

Is it just me, or does anyone else think that V's use of the scrolls of dissmissal on the Titanium Elementals could have disasterous consequences if they actually run into fiends later? I mean, in all likelyhood, there will be a hole smashes in the AC prison wall, and with Sabine on the loose...No more disasterous then allowing three Ti elements to rampage. In war you got to be flexible.

[JackofAllBlades]

I think if the LG break loose from the prison they will run away.I know they want to eleminate OoTS but it is far too risky to attack people in the middle of a big war.(They may get killed.)
Also Ti elementals should be stopped somehow.

[Green Bean]

Is it just me, or does anyone else think that V's use of the scrolls of dissmissal on the Titanium Elementals could have disasterous consequences if they actually run into fiends later? I mean, in all likelyhood, there will be a hole smashes in the AC prison wall, and with Sabine on the loose...

No, V did the right thing. Remember, a Ti golem seems to a appropriately scaled CR wise for two or three OotS members at once, wheras Sabine is more suited for a one on one challenge. This way, V got more bang for h** buck.

[Hallavast]

I think if the LG break loose from the prison they will run away.I know they want to eleminate OoTS but it is far too risky to attack people in the middle of a big war.(They may get killed.)
Also Ti elementals should be stopped somehow.

I dissagree. Nale seemed a little too intruiged with the gate, and I think we'll see him there later when everything comes together.

[Turcano]

It would really depend on on your definition of "later." Sabine is the only real potential threat that dismissal would work on in the immediate future (and, although the odds of the Linear Guild breaking out of jail are almost a given, I think that they would try to escape as soon as possible rather than stick around), and he can always buy/scribe more after the battle's over.

[Finwe]

I dissagree. Nale seemed a little too intruiged with the gate, and I think we'll see him there later when everything comes together.

Who's to say that Nale even knows there's a gate in Azure City? He might think that the only two left are Girard's and Serini's gates.

[Querzis]

Who's to say that Nale even knows there's a gate in Azure City? He might think that the only two left are Girard's and Serini's gates.

He heard Shojo speach, he know there is a gate in Azure city but he dont know where. However, there is a fallen paladin right next to him who know where is the gate.

[Underfoot]

He heard Shojo speach, he know there is a gate in Azure city but he dont know where. However, there is a fallen paladin right next to him who know where is the gate.

Miko doesn't know where the gate is. She almost destroyed it in her ignorance, and when the location was revealed in front of her, she was out cold.

[FujinAkari]

Miko doesn't know where the gate is. She almost destroyed it in her ignorance, and when the location was revealed in front of her, she was out cold.

I disagree. A lot. Miko was -the highest ranking member of the Sapphire Guard-. This guard was formed SPECIFICALLY to guard that sapphire. I really, REALLY doubt she doesn't know where the gate is. She just wasn't thinking when she attacked.

[Vonriel]

Or maybe she was and intentionally missed the gem so as not to destroy the gate. Hinjo might have simply been underestimating her foresight. I really don't see any actual demons entering the battle, and think V may have purchased them in the case they (meaning OotS) ran into one somewhere, and V figured that it'd be useful to have more than 1 in case the save was made. Of course, like I said elsewhere, I don't like trying to think things out in advance. I did it once and found I was really disappointed that I was right..

[Nightmarenny]

I disagree. A lot. Miko was -the highest ranking member of the Sapphire Guard-. This guard was formed SPECIFICALLY to guard that sapphire. I really, REALLY doubt she doesn't know where the gate is. She just wasn't thinking when she attacked.
I don't care how crazy Miko was. If their was a world destroying entity in her vesinity she wouldn't have been reckless.

Also Hijos dialouge in http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0411.html imply that they were really in danger of her hitting the saphire.

[Tarvok]

I don't care how crazy Miko was. If their was a world destroying entity in her vesinity she wouldn't have been reckless.

Also Hijos dialouge in http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0411.html imply that they were really in danger of her hitting the saphire.

I don't know. You get a woman angry enough...

[shaddy_24]

This was a better idea than saving them and hoping that demons would show up later. It V had allowed the Elementals to rip up the walls to save the scrolls the hobgoblins would have poured through and destroyed much of the city. Since Redcloak already summoned Elementals, he probably doesn't have any more high level sumoning spells. Any demons or devels he sumons will probably be weak enough to be taken down without the scrolls. Anyway, if V saved the scrolls and took down the Elementals another way and never used the scrolls, what would everyone say?

[Shhalahr Windrider]

I get the impression that Miko, despite her rank, may not have known the gate was specifically linked to the Sapphire. It could be that only the Lord of Azure City and those in line to take that position would know the location. That would naturally be a precaution to minimize the impact of strategies to divine the location of the gate similar to the one Xykon used.

[Kreistor]

I don't think I've ever seen Miko mention knowledge of that there's another gate in Azure City. She mentions the one in Redmountain Hills (#203), but that is because she would need to explain the charges to the OotS to get them to come along.

[DeathQuaker]

Is it just me, or does anyone else think that V's use of the scrolls of dissmissal on the Titanium Elementals could have disasterous consequences if they actually run into fiends later? I mean, in all likelyhood, there will be a hole smashes in the AC prison wall, and with Sabine on the loose...

Agree with the others that the recent conundrum was better to solve than wait for the next conundrum. If their butts were all beaten by the elementals by the time the demons showed up, that wouldn't help much.

Also, depending on how powerful the elementals were, they might be harder to deal with than certain demons, and Durkon may also have some stuff to help with evil outsiders.

[Dectilon]

"I don't know. You get a woman angry enough..."

It doesn't apply to men then? : P

As for the dismissal it might turn out that the greatest talent Red Cloak has is summoning : ) (Or maybe Xykon). MitD DID come from somewhere, ye? : P Those elementals might have been nothing compared to what's to come : )

[Grod_The_Giant]

It would really depend on on your definition of "later." Sabine is the only real potential threat that dismissal would work on in the immediate future (and, although the odds of the Linear Guild breaking out of jail are almost a given, I think that they would try to escape as soon as possible rather than stick around), and he can always buy/scribe more after the battle's over.

:confused: summoned demons, perhaps? the enemy only has two powerful casters.

[Krytha]

I dont think Miko knows where the gate IS, or the majority of the paladins either. This knowledge is passed down from ruler to ruler, not ruler to paladin club head. All they know is the gate is important and its in the tower. Defend.

[FujinAkari]

I dont think Miko knows where the gate IS, or the majority of the paladins either. This knowledge is passed down from ruler to ruler, not ruler to paladin club head. All they know is the gate is important and its in the tower. Defend.

If thats the case, then that tradition has been broken, as O-chul knows where it is, see http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0422.html

[qvcatullus]

If thats the case, then that tradition has been broken, as O-chul knows where it is, see http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0422.html

I'm not really sure how that shows that O-chul knows exactly where it is. Seems perfectly reasonable that it just means O-chul is going to defend the tower, because (as mentioned above) the paladins might well know it's somewhere in there.
In any case, it seems to be mostly idle speculation, although I suppose that's what the forum is for.

[SteveMB]

No more disasterous then allowing three Ti elements to rampage. In war you got to be flexible.
Durkon made a similar decision (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0111.html) when he used Thor's Might (which he'd been saving for Xykon) to get out of the mess Belkar had left him in.

[Tokiko Mima]

Is it just me, or does anyone else think that V's use of the scrolls of dissmissal on the Titanium Elementals could have disasterous consequences if they actually run into fiends later? I mean, in all likelyhood, there will be a hole smashes in the AC prison wall, and with Sabine on the loose...

Generally speaking I find that Elementals/Golems are more difficult to dispatch than your average demon of equivalent power, and certainly more of a threat in seige warfare. V did the right thing, especially since Durkon likely has a few anti-demon spells from Thor anyway and most attack spells that don't involve fire or poison work great on demons.

[Techonce]

It would really depend on on your definition of "later." Sabine is the only real potential threat that dismissal would work on in the immediate future (and, although the odds of the Linear Guild breaking out of jail are almost a given, I think that they would try to escape as soon as possible rather than stick around), and he can always buy/scribe more after the battle's over.

Actually I am assuming that they are already out of the prison. The guards came across the prisoners that were not on the rools and probably let them go. Being a very lawful sort fo place, they would not keep someone in jail that was not supposed to be there.

My 2cp

[Shhalahr Windrider]

Note that they think it's just a bookkeeping error, not that the Linear Guild doesn't belong there. They just don't intend to "distract" Hinjo with this minor glitch until after the battle. They're certainly not going to release the prisoners before then.

[Eriol]

Actually I am assuming that they are already out of the prison. The guards came across the prisoners that were not on the rools and probably let them go. Being a very lawful sort fo place, they would not keep someone in jail that was not supposed to be there.

My 2cp
I think (and hope) that any jail that finds a bookkeeping error doesn't RELEASE the prisoners before they find the source of said error. SOMEBODY put them there, and thus the proper thing to do would be to check with authority to find out why and where the error occurred, not to preemptively release the prisoners!

[Turcano]

:confused: summoned demons, perhaps? the enemy only has two powerful casters.

One of whom has already used up a sizable percentage of his high-level spells. And I don't know the full repertoire of Xykon's spell list, but summoning doesn't really seem to be his style (he's more of a undead-horde type of villain).

[Legendary]

Xykon won't be doing much until he gets near the gate. There should be a few spellcasters in the hobgob ranks, but not anywhere near as powerful as Redcloak, let alone Xykon. They will probably have less influence in the battle than the Azure clerics will. But then, I'm not familiar with D&D rules, so I don't know if I'm underestimating the enemy...

As for Redcloak, I bet he'll blow all of his high-level spells before the palace is breached. He'll last past the walls, but the palace will outlast his spell slots.

And as for demons, I do not believe they will enter the battle. And Sabine (once she escapes) will probably be fighting BOTH armies, as neither will exactly appreciate her presence.