Tripping as an AoO

[Talakeal]

In 3.5 is there any text that says, unambiguously, whether or not you can use a special attack like trip or disarm as part of an attack of opportunity or full attack?

I always assumed you could, but my DM is insisting that special attacks can only be used alongside the standard attack action, and the PHB seems pretty ambiguous about the matter.

[Stormageddon]

Maneuvers like tripping are attack actions not standard actions. AoO gives an attack action. Things like bullrush state that they are a standard action. Here's some links.

http://www.d20srd.org/srd/combat/attacksOfOpportunity.htm

http://www.d20srd.org/srd/combat/specialAttacks.htm

[Curmudgeon]

Yes. Table 8–2: Actions in Combat (Player's Handbook, page 141) has this footnote for

Disarm
Grapple
Trip an opponent


These attack forms substitute for a melee attack, not an action. As melee attacks, they can be used once in an attack or charge action, one or more times in a full attack action, or even as an attack of opportunity.

[Talakeal]

Yes. Table 8–2: Actions in Combat (Player's Handbook, page 141) has this footnote for

Disarm
Grapple
Trip an opponent


Thank you! That is exactly what I was looking for.

Now to figure out how to show it to him without looking like a know it all / rules lawyer who is rubbing it in his face...

[Ellowryn]

But why not!? You did just go rules lawyer on him, so puff out your chest and stick your nose in the air and try and sound as matter of fact like its the most natural thing in the world that you are right as you can!

[Rhaegar14]

But why not!? You did just go rules lawyer on him, so puff out your chest and stick your nose in the air and try and sound as matter of fact like its the most natural thing in the world that you are right as you can!

With a little less snark, yes, when it's something as critical to your combat tactics as a tripper being able to trip on an opportunity attack, you absolutely want to go full-on rules lawyer. Be blunt and point to the rule in the book.

(Assuming, that is, that you're playing a tripper, and I don't know why this would come up if you're not.)

[Thanatosia]

Just one important caviet - although you can usually use an AoO to make a trip attempt, the exception is an AoO provoked by someone standing from prone..... no, you can't just knock them back down for trying to get up.

[Curmudgeon]

Just one important caviet - although you can usually use an AoO to make a trip attempt, the exception is an AoO provoked by someone standing from prone..... no, you can't just knock them back down for trying to get up.
Well, yeah. Seeing as how AoOs interrupt the provoking action when it's barely begun, they're still on the ground. It's pointless to try to trip someone who's already prone.

[Ketiara]

Well, yeah. Seeing as how AoOs interrupt the provoking action when it's barely begun, they're still on the ground. It's pointless to try to trip someone who's already prone.

okey I see the point in this, but I have players arguing that they can keep a foe down this way... is there a phrase somewhere in a book where it says you cant trip as AoO someone standing from prone?

[Crake]

okey I see the point in this, but I have players arguing that they can keep a foe down this way... is there a phrase somewhere in a book where it says you cant trip as AoO someone standing from prone?

the provoking action happens after the AoO, thus you provoke while still prone. You can trip them, sure, but you'd get nothing out of it, and then the action resolves, ie. you get up.

[nyjastul69]

okey I see the point in this, but I have players arguing that they can keep a foe down this way... is there a phrase somewhere in a book where it says you cant trip as AoO someone standing from prone?



Originally posted by the SRD (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/combat/attacksOfOpportunity.htm#makinganAttackofOpportuni ty):

An attack of opportunity "interrupts" the normal flow of actions in the round. If an attack of opportunity is provoked, immediately resolve the attack of opportunity, then continue with the next character’s turn (or complete the current turn, if the attack of opportunity was provoked in the midst of a character’s turn).

The AoO interrupts the act of standing from prone. The AoO is resolved before the provoker has actually stood up. The provoker is still prone and thus can not be tripped.

ETA: If you require an actual book reference the same quote can be found on page 137 of the PH.

[Dalebert]

Now to figure out how to show it to him without looking like a know it all / rules lawyer who is rubbing it in his face...

What? But that's the fun part!

[Curmudgeon]

Thank you! That is exactly what I was looking for.

Now to figure out how to show it to him without looking like a know it all / rules lawyer who is rubbing it in his face...
You're welcome.

Just hand him the book open to that page, point at the footnote, and say you found the answer. (You don't have to say you had help finding it.)

[Talakeal]

You're welcome.

Just hand him the book open to that page, point at the footnote, and say you found the answer. (You don't have to say you had help finding it.)

Well, the situation was a little bit more confrontational than that. I was actually describing a character in my previous campaign to another player and the DM butt in and flat out insisted I was cheating or mistaken and couldn't do that, and adamantly refused to accept that it was possible. I could t find the section in the PHB that said it clearly one way or the other to back me up.


Edit: Man, tying to post a reply on my touch screen really mangled my spelling and grammar.

[HighWater]

Well, the situation was a little bit more confrontational than that. I was actually describing a character in my previous campaign to another player and the DM but in and flat out insisted I was cheating or mistaken and couldn't do that, and adamantly refused to accept that it was possible afaik, butI could t fint the section in the PHB that said it clearly one way or the other to back me up.

Seems like "Just hand him the book open to that page, point at the footnote, and say you found the answer." will still work in that case.
Maybe add some comment like "written down in the typical 3.5 way - important information hidden in a footnote!" and a "just so you know, if it ever comes up..."