Path of war vs Advanced Class Guide? Looking to add one

[jjcrpntr]

Looking to add a new book to my collection. I'm going back and forth between these two.

ACG- More classes, would give my players a ton of classes to pick from. Currently we have core/apg/um/uc, so that would give a ton of options.

PoW- I really like martial classes and so do a lot of my players. We all really liked ToB when we played 3.5

If you guys had to pick only one to add which would you go with?

[Xerlith]

Go PoW. Both are on SRD anyway, but PoW is straight up better. ACG's best class, the Brawler, is easily recreated with PoW and the others aren't that original. Okay, maybe the Bloodrager's a fine one.

[Psyren]

I'd go PoW - not necessarily because it's better, but because it's a brand new subsystem. I find having the actual book and the layout/presentation that the designer/creator intended to be a big help when learning the ins and outs of a new subsystem. While the PFSRD introduced me to Occultist for instance, I didn't fully grok all the differences between PF and 3.5 Pact Magic until I had the actual PDF, and later the hard copy volume.

Whereas ACG is all hybrid classes, so the mechanics are familiar. Bloodlines work like bloodlines, extracts work like extracts, style feats and teamwork feats work like... you get the idea.

PoW is also a lot cheaper if that matters any (which it probably does given the choice being presented.) Personally I see no reason not to get both.

[Vhaidara]

Another vote for Path of War. It's just a better written book that puts more power where power is lacking.

Also, better implementation of ideas. For example

ACG has a feat called Slashing Grace. It requires Weapon Finesse and Weapon Focus (one handed slashing weapon). You now get Dex to damage with that one handed slashing weapon. This does not make it finessable. This means that you can get Dex to damage with a battleaxe but not a rapier, and it requires two feats.

PoW has Deadly Agility, which requires Weapon Finesse and BAB +1, and gives Dex to damage with finessable weapons.

[icefractal]

Path of War. The ACG is ok, but not that amazing; I liked the APG a lot more for classes, actually.

[master4sword]

Definitely Path of War. It gives a fun new subsystem to Pathfinder, and you've said yourself that you and your players enjoyed ToB. With the Martial Training line of feats, this subsystem is open to any character who wants maneuvers and has feats to spare.

I was personally underwhelmed by the Advanced Class Guide. There's some nifty stuff in there, but there's also lots of thematic and mechanic overlap with existing content (which isn't surprising, considering the book's "mix two existing classes" design philosophy), so a lot less of it "feels" new.

[Snowbluff]

Path of War.

Is this some kind of joke? ACG was uninspired at best, and the PoW is pretty darn good. A great addition to any 3.x collection, if you use 3rd party material.

[Kudaku]

My God, GitP has an ignore function! How did I not find this before now?!? :smallsmile::smallsmile::smallsmile:

[Turion]

Definitely Path of War. Wait for the ACG to be errata'd: it's chock-full of typos, and honestly not worth the cost. Investigator and Hunter are pretty cool, but you can get those from the SRD pretty easily. On the other hand, having all the PoW maneuvers laid out in a pdf can be really helpful.


My God, GitP has an ignore function! How did I not find this before now?!? :smallsmile::smallsmile::smallsmile:

Isn't it wonderful? I swear my blood pressure has gone down since I found it...

[Snowbluff]

Definitely Path of War. Wait for the ACG to be errata'd: it's chock-full of typos, and honestly not worth the cost. Investigator and Hunter are pretty cool, but you can get those from the SRD pretty easily. On the other hand, having all the PoW maneuvers laid out in a pdf can be really helpful.
PoW has a couple of issues, too. They're being handled. For example, Unbreakable Gambit has weird wording.



Isn't it wonderful? I swear my blood pressure has gone down since I found it...

Yes and no. If you're being harassed, great. If you're just busy setting up an echo chamber by ignoring people who don't always agree with you, you've only defeated yourself.

[jjcrpntr]

Path of War.

Is this some kind of joke? ACG was uninspired at best, and the PoW is pretty darn good. A great addition to any 3.x collection, if you use 3rd party material.

No not a joke. I was leaning toward PoW, was debating it because i thought the additional classes might add some variety for the players. Though it sounds like the verdict here is pretty set.

Also that feat for dex dmg to finesse weapons makes a lot of sense from PoW, I agree the ACG feat line is stupid.

Well this has been enlightening thanks guys. We didn't test any of the classes from either book as my players are all really in to their characters right now so I didn't know what the thoughts were on the books. Now to wait for PoW to hit print because like Psyren I prefer to have the actual book there.

[Sith_Happens]

I'm confused, did someone say something stupid in this thread? Because if so I don't see it.:smallconfused:

As for the topic, definitely Path of War. Maneuvers are teh awesomes, and you've already specified that you agree with that sentiment.

[Kudaku]

Isn't it wonderful? I swear my blood pressure has gone down since I found it...

It is indeed! I was seriously considering completely giving up on the 3.x/PF forum and joining the other refugees in Roleplaying Games. Really glad I didn't have to do that. :smallsmile:

[Psyren]

I'm confused, did someone say something stupid in this thread? Because if so I don't see it.:smallconfused:

Yeah, I'm confused by all the crowing over the ignore function too :smallconfused: And the post numbers are contiguous so nobody deleted one.



ACG has a feat called Slashing Grace. It requires Weapon Finesse and Weapon Focus (one handed slashing weapon). You now get Dex to damage with that one handed slashing weapon. This does not make it finessable. This means that you can get Dex to damage with a battleaxe but not a rapier, and it requires two feats.

PoW has Deadly Agility, which requires Weapon Finesse and BAB +1, and gives Dex to damage with finessable weapons.

See, personally I'd rather Deadly Agility only worked for weapons you Focused. And the damage should be reduced for your offhand. But other than that I'm okay with it.

[Snowbluff]

Ooh! Ooh! I bet it was me! "Is this a joke?!" was waaaaaay out of line! :smallsmile:

[Kudaku]

I'm confused, did someone say something stupid in this thread? Because if so I don't see it.:smallconfused:


Yeah, I'm confused by all the crowing over the ignore function too :smallconfused: And the post numbers are contiguous so nobody deleted one.

I'd really rather not sidetrack the topic more than I already have, suffice to say that I accidentally ran across this function while checking something else and I believe the reading pleasure I obtain from browsing the 3.5 forum will increase greatly in the future. :smallbiggrin:


Ooh! Ooh! I bet it was me! "Is this a joke?!" was waaaaaay out of line! :smallsmile:

Please. I've been ignoring your nonsense for years now! :smalltongue:

[Shinken]

I'd go PoW - not necessarily because it's better, but because it's a brand new subsystem. I find having the actual book and the layout/presentation that the designer/creator intended to be a big help when learning the ins and outs of a new subsystem. While the PFSRD introduced me to Occultist for instance, I didn't fully grok all the differences between PF and 3.5 Pact Magic until I had the actual PDF, and later the hard copy volume.

Whereas ACG is all hybrid classes, so the mechanics are familiar. Bloodlines work like bloodlines, extracts work like extracts, style feats and teamwork feats work like... you get the idea.

PoW is also a lot cheaper if that matters any (which it probably does given the choice being presented.) Personally I see no reason not to get both.

Actually, the ACG pdf is cheaper.

[Anlashok]

I've spent the last three hours trying to come up with a good devil's advocate argument.

So...

Pick the ACG because

-It's first party, you're far more likely to find a game with it than you are likely to find a game that accepts PoW simply by definition (and some of it is society legal)

-It's all the same good ol' basic subsystems Paizo refuses to distance themselves from in any book. Straight and narrow. Nothing to learn at all except the names of a few new class features.

-It has true martial characters that are somewhat functional sometimes.

-At least a couple of the classes are legitimately not bad.

-If you play an Oracle it helps you win the game forever.

and uh... stuff. Some of the archetypes are nifty.

[Powerdork]

I've spent the last three hours trying to come up with a good devil's advocate argument.

So...

Pick the ACG because

-It's first party, you're far more likely to find a game with it than you are likely to find a game that accepts PoW simply by definition (and some of it is society legal)

-It's all the same good ol' basic subsystems Paizo refuses to distance themselves from in any book. Straight and narrow. Nothing to learn at all except the names of a few new class features.

-It has true martial characters that are somewhat functional sometimes.

-At least a couple of the classes are legitimately not bad.

-If you play an Oracle it helps you win the game forever.

and uh... stuff. Some of the archetypes are nifty.

Were these the Paizo forums I'd have fav'd this post so hard. As is, I'm going to ask if I can sig it instead. Not that I'm promising to sig it if you say yes, but I want to know if I have your permission (since that seems like the thing to do 'round hurr).