[3.5] Help with XP!

[Thurbane]

Hey all,

How do I calculate group XP when the party has an allied monster on their side? The monster doesn't have an ECL, only a CR.

How does it being on their side affect the XP that the PCs earn?

It's not a cohort, merely a temporarily allied creature (not summoned, charmed or otherwise compelled).

Cheers - T

[Curbstomp]

Well, Heroes of Battle covers this indirectly for allied units on missions with the PC's and scaling.

That said, to me it is a question of how much the allies helped in the fight. I would then modify the CR of the fight by that amount, then split the resulting XP among the PC's only. Below is roughly how I do my XP calculation adjustments:


0% of work done by allies: Do not modify the CR
1-19% of work done by allies: Reduce CR by 1
20-39% of work done by allies: Reduce CR by 2
40-59% of work done by allies: Reduce CR by 3
60-79% of work done by allies: Reduce the CR by 4
80-99% of work done by allies: Reduce the CR by 5
100% of work done by allies: No XP for player characters

Hopefully one of those two suggestions helps you.

[Firest Kathon]

I would not modify the CR of the encounter, but treat the allied creature as an additional party member. Calculate the party level as normal (with the CR of the creature as its level), then split the XP evenly between the party members and the allied creature (e.g. if there are 4 party members and the creature, each party member gets 1/5 XP).

[Biffoniacus_Furiou]

If the monster doesn't use experience points, then it doesn't earn any, so it doesn't get a split of that reward.

[Crake]

I would not modify the CR of the encounter, but treat the allied creature as an additional party member. Calculate the party level as normal (with the CR of the creature as its level), then split the XP evenly between the party members and the allied creature (e.g. if there are 4 party members and the creature, each party member gets 1/5 XP).

yeah, this is how it should be done. Note that the level of the other party members does not affect how much xp an individual gains, only their own level, and the number of allies.


If the monster doesn't use experience points, then it doesn't earn any, so it doesn't get a split of that reward.

Any creature with an advancement entry can gain/use xp

[Biffoniacus_Furiou]

Any creature with an advancement entry can gain/use xp

Dragons explicitly advance by age, not by XP. The same could be said for any creature that doesn't have a level adjustment entry. If it has no ECL, it has no basis for how much XP per CR it would gain.

DMG pages 104-105 specifically says not to consider the presence of cohorts when dividing XP, and that followers don't earn experience at all.

[Thurbane]

The monster in question has no advancement line, and cannot benefit from XP.

[Segev]

If it is helping, it still gets a share of the XP as if its CR were its level. That XP may be wasted, but it getting the XP represents how it reduced the effective CR of the encounter.

[Urpriest]

While the monster doesn't get XP in a normal way since it doesn't have an ECL, it still needs some means to get XP as long as it's Int 3+, since it could conceivably take levels in a class, need to pay for XP components, or the like.

That said, in this kind of situation I tend to subtract the monster's XP value from the encounter, basically assuming that the monster "cancels out" that chunk of the challenge. (I tend to try to structure the fights where the monster helps to work out this way too, so that the monster is taking on something of approximately equal CR while the party focuses on the rest of the fight). It's sort of a 4e-ish way to handle it, but I find it's a decent heuristic.

[Thurbane]

OK, thanks for the advice guys.

I'm going with the "treat the monster as if it were a party member where it's CR = ECL" option to determine what XP the rest of the party get.