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desero clades
2014-09-18, 12:45 AM
We are going to start playing the Hoard of the Dragon Queen sometime soon, and I don't know which pact to go for.
The party looks like its going to be

Barbarian with a greataxe most likely
Sorcerer (blasty blaster)
Rogue, going to go thief (can't decide between dual wield melee or crossbow).

As for me, I want to go Archfey-lock but don't know what pact to go for in this party composition. Help with some suggestions, please?

squashmaster
2014-09-18, 12:52 AM
I been running Archfey with Pact of the Tome.

With your party setup I'd recommend Archfey. It'll give you more a variety/utility than straight damage. You'll have tools at your disposal the Sorcerer may not have if they go master blaster. Great Old One is nice but for Horde of the Dragon Queen you probably won't get as much use out of psionic/psychic utility that it has a lot of.

As far as which pact, that's personal preference, imo. I went Tome cause cantrips ftw and I don't wanna deal with a familiar and the semi-gish of blade doesn't interest me so much.

Surrealistik
2014-09-18, 12:57 AM
I'd start with Fighter for the Second Wind, Constitution save proficiency and the Defensive combat style (unless you've got _tons_ of Dex and Con, and even then).

Fiend Patron (the ultimate pact for survivability which you need for HotDQ; it is deadly at the low levels) and Chain Pact for an invisible polymorphing Imp scout with excellent stealth which you can attack/cast through using touch spells. Book of Shadows is probably better in the long run, but it takes a _long_ time before it rivals the Chain Pact unless your DM is very generous with rituals.

Darkness + Devil Sight + Agonizing Blast, though Hex is good if you expect it will be a long time until your next short rest, and you're down to your last spell.

I'd also probably take a second Fighter level for Action Surge after getting your first ability score improvement.

You choose the rest.

Yorrin
2014-09-18, 07:55 AM
It looks like you've already got you melee guy and scout (barb/rogue), so I see no need of Blade/Chain. Tome can get you the utility that this party lacks. You could even pick up some Cleric-y functionality by choosing Guidance + Spare the Dying as two of your bonus cantrips.

Surrealistik
2014-09-18, 12:03 PM
Chain is still useful despite the rogue scout, and this is my experience in first hand play, because even when 'detected', Imps are still invisible and/or have the form of an innocuous animal. Further, when worst comes to worst, you're not risking a PC.

TheOOB
2014-09-18, 01:35 PM
I'd say tome defiantly. You're party has no divine caster(which is a mistake IMO, HotDQ is very tough and not a ton of healing is on offer), so simply having save the dying will be a big deal.

Surrealistik
2014-09-18, 02:31 PM
Spare the Dying just isn't worth it by the time you get it via Book of Shadows (L3 at earliest, L4 if you take a well-advised Fighter level at your 1st level). When you hit L3+, Hoard of the Dairy Queen becomes _much_ less deadly if you do proper scouting (which Pact of the Chain excels at), have a decent build and aren't tactically reckless.

desero clades
2014-09-18, 04:25 PM
So far I think chain sounds the most useful... though I think I'd have to go for the pixie instead of the imp for fluff purposes, is it as useful as the imp?

Since this is the first time we're playing 5E our DM doesn't want us to multiclass sadly... so its going to be straight warlock.

Surrealistik
2014-09-20, 11:42 AM
So far I think chain sounds the most useful... though I think I'd have to go for the pixie instead of the imp for fluff purposes, is it as useful as the imp?

Since this is the first time we're playing 5E our DM doesn't want us to multiclass sadly... so its going to be straight warlock.

More HP, flying without disadvantage to Stealth, proficiency with a couple of social skills, polymorphing, fire and poison immunity, resistance to a lot of stuff including non-magic weapon attacks, and 120 foot Darkvision that ignores magical darkness.

It is pretty much the best option with only the Quasit really competing with it, but that thing can apparently betray you at any time, so why bother?

Aramis Rhett
2014-09-21, 11:44 PM
Chain is a good pact. Tome is better. With Pact of the Tome, at 2nd level you can take Book of Ancient Secrets for one of your invocations (and I would recommend Eldritch Sight so you may not pass up any potentially well hidden magical items) and learn Find Familiar without having to Pact into it. And while the Chains of Carceri invocation is good in its own right, Pact of the Chain doesn't come close to being as useful as a Pact option since with Book of Ancient Secrets requiring Pact of the Tome you can eventually learn ALL the ritual spells. That will boost your utility through the roof.

Surrealistik
2014-09-22, 12:20 AM
Better in the long run probably.

For pretty much the duration of HofDQ, definitely not. Pact of the Chain and Imp scout all the way; remember that you cannot normally pick out an Imp using the Find Familiar ritual even assuming you do find and transcribe it.

Aramis Rhett
2014-09-22, 01:13 AM
Haven't been able to thumb over HotDQ yet, just providing my opinion. But you mentioned earlier that it could be dismissed by enemies for simply appearing as a small creature, and a regular familiar could do that. There are certainly options which he could recast the ritual and alter the form of his familiar so it may travel unnoticed by any hostiles (unless they kill every tiny sized creature they see, which is unlikely.)
Also, the invocation Book of Ancient Secrets says to choose two 1st level rituals that appear in the book, removing the need for finding the spell.

Aramis Rhett
2014-09-22, 01:26 AM
And for a loophole of sorts, the Misty Visions invocation would greatly help with scouting. Cast it to form a wall of similar visual qualities in front of an actual wall, then have your PC scout walk into the illusion and have a look around.

Surrealistik
2014-09-22, 10:42 AM
Haven't been able to thumb over HotDQ yet, just providing my opinion. But you mentioned earlier that it could be dismissed by enemies for simply appearing as a small creature, and a regular familiar could do that. There are certainly options which he could recast the ritual and alter the form of his familiar so it may travel unnoticed by any hostiles (unless they kill every tiny sized creature they see, which is unlikely.)
Also, the invocation Book of Ancient Secrets says to choose two 1st level rituals that appear in the book, removing the need for finding the spell.

When I was talking about finding the spell, I meant in the event you chose others for the freebies (though I personally wouldn't). That said, I'd agree that in most cases you could probably scout with a raven form familiar let's say, and come out fine, but if that raven were in say... a cave or indoors, it might reasonably be chased off. An Imp is never going to be unable to infiltrate an area without drawing suspicion (short of someone in said area having true seeing while he's in range of it), particularly since he can change his animal form besides also employing invisibility. The 120' darkvision that penetrates magical darkness is very useful too. Also keep in mind that Imp familiars can also provide Magic Resistance while within 10 feet of you per the Monster Manual. Finally, for Book of Shadows to really be worth a damn in comparison, it needs one of your precious invocations, which hurts during a low level module since you won't get more than a few, and there are plenty of good options, three of which are IMO pretty much mandatory (Devil Sight, Agonizing Blast and Misty Visions).

Lastly yes, that's one of the reasons Misty Visions is one of my favourite invocations by far. I also like using it in combat to obscure my position (as well as those of ranged party members) and attack things with auto-advantage when I'm out of Darkness to synergize with Devil Sight.

Aramis Rhett
2014-09-22, 01:32 PM
I did happen to mention recasting Find Familiar to change the appearance from raven or owl, to rat, snake, or even better, spider. Have the spider crawl around on the ceiling. Just seems that Pact of the Chain is a very limited ability. Tome affords you access to all the ritual spells in the game, which is huge.
Also, to the OP, if your DM will allow it, look into rolling as a Human with the variant traits. Take the Magic Initiate feat and take Cleric spells (Spare the Dying cantrip, Guidance cantrip, and Cure Wounds 1st level). Would provide healing in a pinch and boost ability checks (Stealth check for scout).

Surrealistik
2014-09-22, 01:41 PM
I did happen to mention recasting Find Familiar to change the appearance from raven or owl, to rat, snake, or even better, spider. Have the spider crawl around on the ceiling. Just seems that Pact of the Chain is a very limited ability. Tome affords you access to all the ritual spells in the game, which is huge.
Also, to the OP, if your DM will allow it, look into rolling as a Human with the variant traits. Take the Magic Initiate feat and take Cleric spells (Spare the Dying cantrip, Guidance cantrip, and Cure Wounds 1st level). Would provide healing in a pinch and boost ability checks (Stealth check for scout).

If I was going to take a feat, it'd be Spell Sniper for sure.

And yes, you can recast Find Familiar, but the gold investment every time you want to change things up isn't exactly cheap at the lower levels.

Lastly, as repeatedly mentioned before, yes, Pact of the Chain is outshone by Pact of the Tome in the long run, but given the duration of HotDQ and the fact that you start at level 1, you'll probably never get to the point where it actually does (especially when the Imp grants you Magic Resistance).

Aramis Rhett
2014-09-22, 02:11 PM
If I was going to take a feat, it'd be Spell Sniper for sure.

And yes, you can recast Find Familiar, but the gold investment every time you want to change things up isn't exactly cheap at the lower levels.

Lastly, as repeatedly mentioned before, yes, Pact of the Chain is outshone by Pact of the Tome in the long run, but given the duration of HotDQ and the fact that you start at level 1, you'll probably never get to the point where it actually does.

Spell sniper isn't bad, but the OP wants to stay away from being a blaster.

If recasting over and over becomes an issue, either find one form that is very versatile (spider would probably be a top choice) or use other spells to beef up the rogue.

HotDQ may be somewhat short in itself, but what if the OP wants more versatility and continued use out of his Warlock beyond HotDQ? Maybe Pact of the Chain would prove to be a hindrance in a later campaign where Pact pf the Tome would be able to shine all the brighter? Myself, I look at my choices made for the long run, not just a one time adventure. Also, I see Great Old one as being more universal in terms of utility. Access to detect thoughts, telepathy, hideous laughter, and Create Thrall. That alone at later levels would be the ultimate scout. Simply incapacitate a humanoid who would be able to travel freely in an area, enthrall them, and send them as your advance scout. Not to mention an added attack if it were needed.

desero clades
2014-09-23, 01:53 AM
Thanks for the suggestions everyone! We haven't started playing just yet (probably next week, hopefully).
I'm going to ask our DM if we are just doing this module or if we will be continuing either a different campaign or the rest of the adventures.
If its just the first book I'll probably go with chain, since its better for those low levels I feel. I'll go with tome if we're keeping these characters for a longer game.

MustacheFart
2014-09-23, 02:04 AM
Thanks for the suggestions everyone! We haven't started playing just yet (probably next week, hopefully).
I'm going to ask our DM if we are just doing this module or if we will be continuing either a different campaign or the rest of the adventures.
If its just the first book I'll probably go with chain, since its better for those low levels I feel. I'll go with tome if we're keeping these characters for a longer game.

I am curious. You said you probably would have to go with pixie instead of imp due to fluff reasons. What's the fluff? Maybe we can offer better advice if we know a bit more about what you're thinking as to your character (fluff).