Sing thee to thy rest: Iaijutsu/Executioner bard?

[Snowbluff]

So, I've been having these strange thoughts lately... okay, those happen all of the time. Anywho, I'd thought it be cool to make a hauntingly beautiful/handsome character who sings terrible lullabies as funeral rites to the people she/he executes.

I'm just spit balling ideas at this point. The basis of the build would be Bard and Iaijutsu Master. The choice weapons would be a curse weapon of some sort (the -2, but will return to you) for flavor and weapon drawing. I'll probably add some Doomspeak for support, but I'll avoid Words of Creation since the character may not necessarily be good.

I'm trying to make a character who can kill in a single stroke, and be creepy and alluring at the same time.

Basic premise: Bard8/Iaijutsu Master5. High cha.
Snowflake Wardance, and a feat would be devotion to learning the skill.

For a custom weapon, Item Familiar. "Slender Hand of Oblivion," probably a -2 rapier.

What would you guys add?

[Erik Vale]

Given he's a executioner, I'd give him the profession [Executioner] skill and a executioner weapon per BVD, and axes are more common. For the perform there's lullabies, but Oratory and Comedy would also work [Perhaps Versatile performer, he's great for gallows humour and Hanable lectures, in addition to singing great lullabies].
Being a executioner, the curse could perhaps be someone he executed cursing him to forever hold the axe with which he killed others [Ok, perhaps it needs better wording], which is why you have the cursed weapon fluff wise instead of just being a crunch thing...

... Yep, that's it for fluffy things to add. The rest is all crunchy stuff which I rather leave for the experts.

Edit: Wait, the Item Familiar when it becomes intelligent, could be an amalgamation of all the souls of those it killed. Now I'm done.

[Quiet Wizard]

For mood-setting purposes, optimization of a Bard's ability to Hide and tactical offense benefit (due to Entanglement & Concealment mechanics), I would have the spell Nightmare Terrain be a 3rd level spell for this creepy bard.

[Snowbluff]

Given he's a executioner, I'd give him the profession [Executioner] skill and a executioner weapon per BVD, and axes are more common. For the perform there's lullabies, but Oratory and Comedy would also work [Perhaps Versatile performer, he's great for gallows humour and Hanable lectures, in addition to singing great lullabies].
Being a executioner, the curse could perhaps be someone he executed cursing him to forever hold the axe with which he killed others [Ok, perhaps it needs better wording], which is why you have the cursed weapon fluff wise instead of just being a crunch thing...

... Yep, that's it for fluffy things to add. The rest is all crunchy stuff which I rather leave for the experts.

Edit: Wait, the Item Familiar when it becomes intelligent, could be an amalgamation of all the souls of those it killed. Now I'm done. Hm... execution... Hrm.

Okay. I've looked at it and it's a tricky alternative. Meeting the criteria of it is hard, but Animate Rope can come in handy. I can use that to tie people up, I think. The other problem is that execution weapons are 2 handed, so I can't use snowflake wardance and I can't focus dex, either. Other than that, it's a good method. I'll see about a morphing weapon...

As for the Cursed weapon, the ability to return it to me by drawing another weapons is pretty damn good. As for the fluff, it being a twisted entity comprised of the poor souls would be quite nice. Isn't there a material I can use to trap souls?


For mood-setting purposes, optimization of a Bard's ability to Hide and tactical offense benefit (due to Entanglement & Concealment mechanics), I would have the spell Nightmare Terrain be a 3rd level spell for this creepy bard.
Oooh man. Nightmare Terrain is perfect. Move up while hiding, then make nothing out of your foe. :smallcool:

[Shinken]

You're not thinking that drawing another weapon but instead getting your cursed sword counts as drawing your cursed sword for iaijutsu, right?

[Erik Vale]

Hm... execution... Hrm.

Okay. I've looked at it and it's a tricky alternative. Meeting the criteria of it is hard, but Animate Rope can come in handy. I can use that to tie people up, I think. The other problem is that execution weapons are 2 handed, so I can't use snowflake wardance and I can't focus dex, either. Other than that, it's a good method. I'll see about a morphing weapon...

As for the Cursed weapon, the ability to return it to me by drawing another weapons is pretty damn good. As for the fluff, it being a twisted entity comprised of the poor souls would be quite nice. Isn't there a material I can use to trap souls?


The Profession was more a suggestion based on him executing people, if nothing else you can use it to earn money in addition to your perform skill, such as when you don't want to attract as much attention. However that can be picked up through Bardic Knack if you go Elf for the charisma, picking up Elven Dillante to make all skills not need training, and giving a +1 to al untrained [so your bardic knack skills with the build suggested and the feat will have a roll of 4+stat. This would make you a minor skill monkey]

As for the material, Thinuan, from complete warrior. However it can also catch your soul [Which might not be a downside] if you die with it one you, which you will because of the curse.

[Snowbluff]

You're not thinking that drawing another weapon but instead getting your cursed sword counts as drawing your cursed sword for iaijutsu, right? The Cursed Sword specifically states that you draw it. Unless you can't provide a reason otherwise, it's legal.

The sword’s owner automatically draws it and fights with it even when she meant to draw or ready some other weapon.

If you attack a flat-footed opponent immediately after drawing a melee weapon, you can deal extra damage, based on the result of an Iaijutsu Focus check.
Even if you were to read the cursed weapon as "you draw a weapon, but you get the sword instead" and not "you draw a weapon but you draw the curse sword instead," I still would have drawn a weapon to meet the requirement of making an Iai attack.

The Profession was more a suggestion based on him executing people, if nothing else you can use it to earn money in addition to your perform skill, such as when you don't want to attract as much attention. However that can be picked up through Bardic Knack if you go Elf for the charisma, picking up Elven Dillante to make all skills not need training, and giving a +1 to al untrained [so your bardic knack skills with the build suggested and the feat will have a roll of 4+stat. This would make you a minor skill monkey]

As for the material, Thinuan, from complete warrior. However it can also catch your soul [Which might not be a downside] if you die with it one you, which you will because of the curse.
I think I'll use the skill either way, since it's pretty flavorful. Thanks for the tip. :smallsmile:

Thinuan can only hold one soul. Curses! :smalltongue:

[Psyren]

Wouldn't it take you a week to kill people by RAW?

[Snowbluff]

Care to substantiate that?

[Shinken]

The Cursed Sword specifically states that you draw it. Unless you can't provide a reason otherwise, it's legal.

I don't want to get in a rules debate, I just think it doesn't work per RAI. You can't drop a cursed weapon, so you're not drawing it again if you try to draw another weapon - it just goes from one hand to the other, which is not drawing.

You still need a way to get your foes reliably flat-footed, anyway.

I mean, there really is no reason to try and abuse RAW like this. If you're going to be stuck with a -2 weapon, you could get several masterwork daggers and be a lot more accurate (and raising a lot less issues).

BUt hey, if you want to use that and your DM accepts it, more power to you.

[georgie_leech]

Wouldn't it take you a week to kill people by RAW?

While technically there's nothing overriding Profession checks generally taking a week, it would be a strange DM indeed that argued that an axe swing takes 168 hours to finish. :smalltongue:

[Snowbluff]

The wording suggests a readied strike (attack?). That would be a standard action, correct? I'd take 168 hours to kill someone if it meant I could do this. :smalltongue:



I mean, there really is no reason to try and abuse RAW like this. If you're going to be stuck with a -2 weapon, you could get several masterwork daggers and be a lot more accurate (and raising a lot less issues).


1) It's like fried ice cream. Crunchy and fluffy as hell. :smallcool:
2) As my item familiar, I can't lose it.
3) I won't have to enchant multiple weapons.

[Erik Vale]

While technically there's nothing overriding Profession checks generally taking a week, it would be a strange DM indeed that argued that an axe swing takes 168 hours to finish. :smalltongue:

No, that's earning money for them.
But if it still took a week, man that'd be a hell of a execution.
What are you doing?
Sawing through his neck with a endless supply of erasers. Why do you ask?
No reason, I just thought you were sane.


I don't want to get in a rules debate, I just think it doesn't work per RAI. You can't drop a cursed weapon, so you're not drawing it again if you try to draw another weapon - it just goes from one hand to the other, which is not drawing.

You still need a way to get your foes reliably flat-footed, anyway.

I mean, there really is no reason to try and abuse RAW like this. If you're going to be stuck with a -2 weapon, you could get several masterwork daggers and be a lot more accurate (and raising a lot less issues).

BUt hey, if you want to use that and your DM accepts it, more power to you.
You can drop it, you just can't get rid of it. And there's a flat footed compendium.

My favourite however is Neraph Charge. And since you'd be moving, you could draw as a free action... I'm now trying to Imagine a Ijitsu Rogue Ubercharger...
And it doesn't abuse RAW, given Gnomish Quick Razors. This build is sub optimal, because it uses them instead. Also... that many daggers would get expensive.

[Shinken]

You can drop it, you just can't get rid of it. And there's a flat footed compendium.
You can? I misremembered, then.


My favourite however is Neraph Charge. And since you'd be moving, you could draw as a free action... I'm now trying to Imagine a Ijitsu Rogue Ubercharger...
And it doesn't abuse RAW, given Gnomish Quick Razors. This build is sub optimal, because it uses them instead. Also... that many daggers would get expensive.
My point is precisely that abusing RAW for a suboptimal build is useless. How would plenty nonmagical daggers get expensive, anyway? It's a cheaper than a cursed sword (which can't be enchanted anyway).

[Erik Vale]

My point is precisely that abusing RAW for a suboptimal build is useless. How would plenty nonmagical daggers get expensive, anyway? It's a cheaper than a cursed sword (which can't be enchanted anyway).

Who says it can't be enchanted? It already is, and thus can be enchanted further.
And the daggers will need to be made magical eventually, assuming you wish to stay relevent, and making multiple weapons magical is a lot more expensive than enchanting one further. Also, the daggers only give you 4 rounds of combat before the sword becomes cheaper, leaving you better off enchanting the sword and grabbing a club.

Also, since you can't get rid of it normally, you can use it freely against rust monsters.

[georgie_leech]

Who says it can't be enchanted? It already is, and thus can be enchanted further.
And the daggers will need to be made magical eventually, assuming you wish to stay relevent, and making multiple weapons magical is a lot more expensive than enchanting one further. Also, the daggers only give you 4 rounds of combat before the sword becomes cheaper, leaving you better off enchanting the sword and grabbing a club.

Also, since you can't get rid of it normally, you can use it freely against rust monsters.

Quibble: Though it might be enchanted, it doesn't have an Enhancement Bonus of at least +1, so it needs one of those first. Amusingly, the -2 isn't actually an Enhancement... Penalty, so you really do only need the +1 to qualify for sticking other things on it; doing so would presumably involve the usual rules for adding effects to an existing item.

...Which I would quote but it's late and I'm utterly failing to find them.

[Snowbluff]

Who says it can't be enchanted? It already is, and thus can be enchanted further.
And the daggers will need to be made magical eventually, assuming you wish to stay relevent, and making multiple weapons magical is a lot more expensive than enchanting one further. Also, the daggers only give you 4 rounds of combat before the sword becomes cheaper, leaving you better off enchanting the sword and grabbing a club.

Also, since you can't get rid of it normally, you can use it freely against rust monsters.
Yeah, pretty much.

Quibble: Though it might be enchanted, it doesn't have an Enhancement Bonus of at least +1, so it needs one of those first. Amusingly, the -2 isn't actually an Enhancement... Penalty, so you really do only need the +1 to qualify for sticking other things on it; doing so would presumably involve the usual rules for adding effects to an existing item.

...Which I would quote but it's late and I'm utterly failing to find them.
The sword would be an item familiar. I can alter it by sacrificing GP.

EDIT: Can an Intelligent Item Familiar holding a wand in a wand chamber activate a wand? :smalltongue:

[Psyren]

While technically there's nothing overriding Profession checks generally taking a week, it would be a strange DM indeed that argued that an axe swing takes 168 hours to finish. :smalltongue:

It's not that strange - if you think about the death row process in most locales, a week is pretty generous. Even Ned Stark was due to be snipped longer than that.

The intent of the ability was never for it to be used in combat, so I don't think it's that strange that it would take that long to... execute.

[Snowbluff]

The intent of the ability was never for it to be used in combat, so I don't think it's that strange that it would take that long to... execute. The first 167.9 hours of every execution in movies is because of this. That how the hero always has time to rescue the condemned. :smalltongue:

I don't care that they didn't want me to use it in combat. It's for doing something badass. >:3

[Psyren]

I don't care that they didn't want me to use it in combat. It's for doing something badass. >:3

I know why you want it , I was just pointing out the RAW.

RAW is a double-edged sword - on the one hand it lets you kill anything in the game with a skill check, on the other they forgot to change the action that the skill check requires. Life is funny like that.

[Snowbluff]

I know why you want it , I was just pointing out the RAW.

RAW is a double-edged sword - on the one hand it lets you kill anything in the game with a skill check, on the other they forgot to change the action that the skill check requires. Life is funny like that.
That was a RAI complaint.

As for RAW, it's iffy. There is no time or action required, but a loose ("generally") guideline for it. The action of readying the weapon would override it if there was an action required.

That being said, there is probably an easier way to accomplish this. Isn't there a build for using CDG in battle, even against foes who would not normally be vulnerable? Or applying the helpless condition?

[Snowbluff]

Just a general update on where this is right now:

I want to figure out a way of getting my Item Familiar to use a wand. It doesn't have a hand... yet... :smallamused:

The build should probably find another good source of damage. Iaijutsu is nice, but I want to be able to crank out more damage before we hit level 13.

I'll have to put an actually complete stub together.

Unseelie Fey would be a good option for a template in a higher level game. The Winter Chill ability is right up it's alley.

Another high OP option would be a reserved-engineered +1 Morphing Cursed Shuriken -2 (as ammunition it enhances at a 1/50 of the cost). The hard part in this is finding a DM who will put up with your BS.

An alternative to the item familiar would be Leadership to obtain a Fiend of Possession. You make also elect to bind one, instead. This would be able to provide bonuses to your weapon equal to its FoP level. This is arguably the meanest trick available.

Invisibility (Greater, Swift) and Nightmare Terrain + Darkstalker are a serviceable source of Flatfooted. Swift Invisibility and Nightmare Terrain are available as Eternal Wands.

Execution would be cool, but the rules are iffy as no time or action is given for the skill or this specific use (it's not a week, that's for sure).

[georgie_leech]

It's not that strange - if you think about the death row process in most locales, a week is pretty generous. Even Ned Stark was due to be snipped longer than that.

The intent of the ability was never for it to be used in combat, so I don't think it's that strange that it would take that long to... execute.

I find it unlikely they intended someone else to have to Grapple the target for a week if that's the case. To each their own.