Partially Real Illusions - Free Force Cage?

[Easy_Lee]

Illusion wizards, at level 14, can add some realness to their illusions. They can make one object (whatever an "object" means) that is part of an illusion spell they cast real for one minute. The example given is creating a bridge that lasts long enough for your allies to cross, implying that these illusions are tangible and capable of withstanding some significant force.

It specifies that this object is nonmagical and can't deal damage or directly harm anyone. However, it says nothing about the spell indirectly harming someone.

Can an illusionist create an illusion of an adamantite cage around a dragon and imprison it, with no save, for one minute? And what about indirectly harming someone? Can an illusionist create the illusion of a boulder completely encasing a target, so that target is totally restrained by the boulder and suffocates? After all, the boulder didn't harm the person; the lack of air did. Illusion spells seem to instantaneously appear as well, implying that there would be no save for their effects.

I'm not sure how a DM would get around this, other than houseruling that illusions have one hit point or something.

[TheDeadlyShoe]

Suffocation is directly harming someone - or for that matter, so is restraining them in any fashion. Personally, I would allow it as part of RP (restraining someone using shadow magic out of combat, perhaps) but not in combat. The 'shadow reality' bit shouldn't be a replacement for actual combat spells, and allowing unlimited creativity in how it could be applied is the path to Tier 1 Wizardry.

I'd allow the cage, too, except it'd be easily broken and/or the illusion magic sustaining it would be subject to disbelief even if the object is partly real. It's not actually real, after all - just partly.

[Easy_Lee]

I'd allow the cage, too, except it'd be easily broken and/or the illusion magic sustaining it would be subject to disbelief even if the object is partly real. It's not actually real, after all - just partly.

That's a valid house rule, but it's not directly stated in RAW. According to raw, one "object" that is part of the illusion can be made real for one minute. As in that part of the illusion is 100% real, otherwise a bridge (the example given) could not sustain the weight of a traveling party. At the very least, this allows illusionist wizards to create walls which are totally real and require some measure of force to break through.

[TheDeadlyShoe]

I'm going off 'semi-reality' - it's real, but it's not actually stone or adamantite and it requires the matrix of the illusion spell to remain real.

I guess that also brings into question whether a 'real' shadow effect can be dispelled. Hm.

[rlc]

After all, the boulder didn't harm the person; the lack of air did.

i don't even.

[Thomar_of_Uointer]

That's a valid house rule, but it's not directly stated in RAW. According to raw, one "object" that is part of the illusion can be made real for one minute. As in that part of the illusion is 100% real, otherwise a bridge (the example given) could not sustain the weight of a traveling party. At the very least, this allows illusionist wizards to create walls which are totally real and require some measure of force to break through.

All you need to figure out is what the DC to break down an illusory wall with a Strength check should be. Making it equal to the mage's Intelligence score would make sense, but that might be way too powerful for crowd control. Maybe half their Intelligence score? But that doesn't scale with level.

Any ideas?

[Easy_Lee]

All you need to figure out is what the DC to break down an illusory wall with a Strength check should be. Making it equal to the mage's Intelligence score would make sense, but that might be way too powerful for crowd control. Maybe half their Intelligence score? But that doesn't scale with level.

Any ideas?

Assuming it's a valid mechanic, probably the wizard's spell DC. That would work best with the theme of 5e spells, and ensure that illusionists can't trap tarrasques so easily.

[khachaturian]

Illusion wizards, at level 14, can add some realness to their illusions. They can make one object (whatever an "object" means) that is part of an illusion spell they cast real for one minute. The example given is creating a bridge that lasts long enough for your allies to cross, implying that these illusions are tangible and capable of withstanding some significant force.

It specifies that this object is nonmagical and can't deal damage or directly harm anyone. However, it says nothing about the spell indirectly harming someone.

Can an illusionist create an illusion of an adamantite cage around a dragon and imprison it, with no save, for one minute? And what about indirectly harming someone? Can an illusionist create the illusion of a boulder completely encasing a target, so that target is totally restrained by the boulder and suffocates? After all, the boulder didn't harm the person; the lack of air did. Illusion spells seem to instantaneously appear as well, implying that there would be no save for their effects.

I'm not sure how a DM would get around this, other than houseruling that illusions have one hit point or something.

what's the DC to avoid books thrown at you by the DM?

[Pex]

All you need to figure out is what the DC to break down an illusory wall with a Strength check should be. Making it equal to the mage's Intelligence score would make sense, but that might be way too powerful for crowd control. Maybe half their Intelligence score? But that doesn't scale with level.

Any ideas?

The ability comes in at 14th level. That's not too powerful for the level.

[Inevitability]

i don't even.

Always remember: 'Rocks don't kill people, physics kill people!'